And Helen Crump was the anti-Ellie/Peg. Wonder what causes last names like "Crump?"
The Preterists and Matthew 24:34
- Thread starter Jerry Shugart
- Start date
And Helen Crump was the anti-Ellie/Peg. Wonder what causes last names like "Crump?"
SaulToPaul 2
Well-known member
In the 70s, her name was Helen Crump-Schwump.
Butch P. also was an overrated actor/guest "star" on "Leave It To Beaver."
Wonder how she afforded that cool house, on a school teacher's salary, while Big Barn, on "civil service" salary, shacked up at a boarding house,or the court house? Wonder how Thelma Lou could afford a home, when she did not seem to have any visible means of support,a job, except one reference to going to "the office?" You think she had a fling with Ward Cleaver, at "the office?"
It's a mite curious.......
You're in denial.
What was the topic of this thread again?
Aaron the Tall
Member
Jerry,
Just to recap the flow of thought leading up to this last idea of yours.
1.) I claimed the passage of Daniel 7 was fulfilled at the ascension where Christ was given a Kingdom.
2.) You claimed that this couldn't have happened because all nations haven't yet served him.
3.) I took this to mean that if all nations aren't serving Christ, He doesn't have a Kingdom.
4.) So, I pointed out that according to your view, there will be a rebellion in the millennial Kingdom reign where nations will not be living under Christ's rule.
5.) The conclusion according to your logic: Christ can't have a Kingdom during this portion of the millennial reign because not all nations are serving him.
You seemed to disagree with this conclusion. However, if you concede that Christ can have a Kingdom while some are not serving him, then your claim in #2 is not valid.
What Kingdom is this verse speaking of?
"For He rescued us from the domain of darkness, and transferred us to the kingdom of His beloved Son,"
Isn't this Christ's Kingdom that believers now are members of?
You don't think Peter is referring to sending the Spirit of Christ into the hearts of those who repent and believe?
"Because you are his sons, God sent the Spirit of his Son into our hearts, the Spirit who calls out, "Abba, Father." (Gal. 4:6)
It says many believed Peter's message. Why then didn't Jesus return?
Or are you suggesting Christ's return is hinged upon 100% repentance and acceptance of every single Jew alive on earth? or at least the 1/3rd that are left after the tribulation?
That's all I got time for tonight....
Jerry Shugart
Well-known member
Instead of discussing the last thing I said let us start with the first part because it lays the foundation of the rest. Let us start with my remarks here:
The Lord Jesus' kingdom will be on the earth. That is why He had His disciples pray in the following way:
"And he said unto them, When ye pray, say, Our Father which art in heaven, Hallowed be thy name. Thy kingdom come. Thy will be done, as in heaven, so in earth"
It is obvious that the Father's will has never been done on the earth as it is in heaven. Therefore, we can know that the Lord Jesus has not yet returned to the earth:
"And then shall they see the Son of man coming in a cloud with power and great glory. And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh. And he spake to them a parable; Behold the fig tree, and all the trees; When they now shoot forth, ye see and know of your own selves that summer is now nigh at hand. So likewise ye, when ye see these things come to pass, know ye that the kingdom of God is nigh at hand" (Lk.21:27-31).
Could you please please give me your post number where you addressed Matthew 13?
Thanks!
1Mind1Spirit
Literal lunatic
Quite the statement there Jerry.
Didn't you pay attention to what the Angel told Daniel?
They had to whoop some other Angels before they could visit him.
That battle determined the next kingdom God set up on earth.
Then also in Daniel, the watchers decreed the Most High rules in the kingdoms of men, gives them to whom he will and sets up the basest of men over them.
God's will, never having been done on earth?
Only a booger eatin' moron could utter such nonsense.:wazzup:
Ole Neb had more goin' on than you, Jer.
Jerry Shugart
Well-known member
So you think that the Lord's will is now being done on earth as it is in heaven?
That is foolish as the Apostle Paul describes the present age the following way:
"Who gave himself for our sins, that he might deliver us from this present evil age, according to the will of God and our Father" (Gal.1:4).
Do you really think that "evil" is a good description of the way that God's will is being done in heaven?
The kingdom will not start until the Lord Jesus returns to the earth:
"When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory" (Mt.25:31).
"And then shall they see the Son of man coming in a cloud with power and great glory. And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh. And he spake to them a parable; Behold the fig tree, and all the trees; When they now shoot forth, ye see and know of your own selves that summer is now nigh at hand. So likewise ye, when ye see these things come to pass, know ye that the kingdom of God is nigh at hand" (Lk.21:27-31).
Of course these things have not yet happened. There is no evidence that the Lord Jesus began to reign in His kingdom when He sat on the throne of His glory at anytime in the past.
Or perhaps you want to argue that His reign is an evil one?
1Mind1Spirit
Literal lunatic
The kingdom of heaven does not come with observation.
You sayin' the angel lied when he had to do God's will in heaven before it happened on earth?
Galatians was written before 70AD
Therefore, Paul was describing the previous age when he said "this present evil age", not the present age we live in right now.
(Heb 9:26) ....But he has appeared once for all at the culmination of the ages to do away with sin by the sacrifice of himself.
The Saints are reigning with Christ Jesus right now. It's not an evil reign.
You do know a king has to have enemies to reign?
If there's no enemies, there's nothing to reign over.
iamaberean
New member
What? Know ye not that the kingdom of God in within us, right here on earth today.
And do you not know that earth is God's footstool, and heaven is his throne.
Let God be true and every man a liar.
Jerry Shugart
Well-known member
Yes, it does not COME with observation but once it will arrive it will be seen.
The Apostles were with the resurrected Lord Jesus for forty days while He spoke of things concerning the kingdom and they believed that the kingdom will be restored to Israel. And the Lord did not tell them that they were in error for expected that to happen but only told them that they were not to know when that would happen.
So it is certain that a visible kingdom will be restored to Israel.
Or perhaps you want to argue that even though the Apostles were tutored by the Lord Jesus for forty days about the kingdom that they did not know even the most basic facts concerning the kingdom?
Jerry Shugart
Well-known member
The end of the age in which the Lord Jesus walked the earth has not ended unless you think that a world wide harvest has already occurred. Here is what the Lord Jesus said about the end of the age in which He was living:
"He that soweth the good seed is the Son of man; The field is the world; the good seed are the children of the kingdom; but the tares are the children of the wicked one; The enemy that sowed them is the devil; the harvest is the end of the age; and the reapers are the angels. As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this age. The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity; And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth. Then shall the righteous shine forth as the sun in the kingdom of their Father. Who hath ears to hear, let him hear" (Mt. 13:37-43).
Anyone with the slightest degree of common sense knows that an event like that has not yet happened.
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Nazaroo
New member
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1Mind1Spirit
The kingdom of heaven does not come with observation.
Yes, it does not COME with observation but once it will arrive it will be seen.
Could Jesus have meant something entirely different?
Something like:
"The kingdom doesn't come with observation, but with participation." ??
Originally Posted by 1Mind1Spirit
The kingdom of heaven does not come with observation.
Yes, it does not COME with observation but once it will arrive it will be seen.
Could Jesus have meant something entirely different?
Something like:
"The kingdom doesn't come with observation, but with participation." ??
Jerry Shugart
Well-known member
Do you really think that is what the Lord Jesus told the Pharisees?
That is ridiculous!
What He told them was that the kingdom was in their midst, in the sense that the King was right in front of them.
Later He said that "now" His kingdom was not of the world.
iamaberean
New member
Jesus was telling the Pharisees that the kingdom of God is within us. At the time he told them that, the King was not residing there.
When Jesus said " the kingdom is not", again it was because God was not yet residing in us.
When the disciples received the Holy Ghost, then God begin residing in the temple that was made without hands. All believers, should be born again to allow God to reside in them, for that is his kingdom here on earth.
Iamaberean, you at least state your belief. Unlike some, who insist on baiting others through endless questions only to prove their true intent no matter what answer is given them – that they all along had an answer in mind - towards nothing more than the resulting strife of attempted coercion - and often, the parroted information of another’s labor.
The following is from my own labor in the Word; take it how you will.
Exodus 32:
18. And he gave unto Moses, when he had made an end of communing with him upon mount Sinai, two tables of testimony, tables of stone, written with the finger of God.
Deuteronomy 9:
10. And the LORD delivered unto me two tables of stone written with the finger of God; and on them was written according to all the words, which the LORD spake with you in the mount out of the midst of the fire in the day of the assembly.
Behold – the God of Israel among His peculiar people: Israel – John 1:
1. In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
2. The same was in the beginning with God.
3. All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.
4. In him was life; and the life was the light of men.
14. And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.
45. Philip findeth Nathanael, and saith unto him, We have found him, of whom Moses in the law, and the prophets, did write, Jesus of Nazareth, the son of Joseph.
47. Jesus saw Nathanael coming to him, and saith of him, Behold an Israelite indeed, in whom is no guile!
48. Nathanael saith unto him, Whence knowest thou me? Jesus answered and said unto him, Before that Philip called thee, when thou wast under the fig tree, I saw thee.
49. Nathanael answered and saith unto him, Rabbi, thou art the Son of God; thou art the King of Israel.
John 8:
4. They say unto him, Master, this woman was taken in adultery, in the very act.
5. Now Moses in the law commanded us, that such should be stoned: but what sayest thou?
6. This they said, tempting him, that they might have to accuse him. But Jesus stooped down, and with his finger wrote on the ground, as though he heard them not.
7. So when they continued asking him, he lifted up himself, and said unto them, He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone at her.
8. And again he stooped down, and wrote on the ground.
9. And they which heard it, being convicted by their own conscience, went out one by one, beginning at the eldest, even unto the last: and Jesus was left alone, and the woman standing in the midst.
John 12:
12. On the next day much people that were come to the feast, when they heard that Jesus was coming to Jerusalem,
13. Took branches of palm trees, and went forth to meet him, and cried, Hosanna: Blessed is the King of Israel that cometh in the name of the Lord.
14. And Jesus, when he had found a young ***, sat thereon; as it is written,
15. Fear not, daughter of Sion: behold, thy King cometh, sitting on an ***'s colt.
16. These things understood not his disciples at the first: but when Jesus was glorified, then remembered they that these things were written of him, and that they had done these things unto him.
Luke 11:
20. But if I with the finger of God cast out devils, no doubt the kingdom of God is come upon you.
Luke 17:
20. And when he was demanded of the Pharisees, when the kingdom of God should come, he answered them and said, The kingdom of God cometh not with observation:
21. Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you.
22. And he said unto the disciples, The days will come, when ye shall desire to see one of the days of the Son of man, and ye shall not see it.
23. And they shall say to you, See here; or, see there: go not after them, nor follow them.
24. For as the lightning, that lighteneth out of the one part under heaven, shineth unto the other part under heaven; so shall also the Son of man be in his day.
25. But first must he suffer many things, and be rejected of this generation.
In this, regardless of what you have been taught; His Own understanding seems to be that His "days of the Son of man" shall be good ones - this; before the great distress He allowed to come upon Israel once more, in His wrath per His Law, see Daniel's prayer in Daniel 9.
Zechariah 2:
10. Sing and rejoice, O daughter of Zion: for, lo, I come, and I will dwell in the midst of thee, saith the LORD.
11. And many nations shall be joined to the LORD in that day, and shall be my people: and I will dwell in the midst of thee, and thou shalt know that the LORD of hosts hath sent me unto thee.
12. And the LORD shall inherit Judah his portion in the holy land, and shall choose Jerusalem again.
13. Be silent, O all flesh, before the LORD: for he is raised up out of his holy habitation.
