The Pathway Machine

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Lehrer

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Whoa! I gave you a response to what I read on your site, specifically addressing Revelation 22:13; but you have apparently ignored it. Here it is again:

I noticed you did not address the OT scriptures, so your argument is handicapped right off the bat.

Actually your use of the term OT, or Old Testament is handicapped right off the bat.

From the Greek ἐπὶ τῇ ἀναγνώσει τῆς παλαιᾶς διαθήκης (epi tei anagnosei tes palaias diathekes); Latin in lectione veteris testamenti at 2 Corinthians 3:14, where the Greek word diathekes actually means covenant. It also appears in 32 other places throughtout the Greek text. At 2 Corinthians 3:14 Paul referrs only to the Law covenant and further, wasn't constituting a "New Testament" or covenant.

"in ignorance of the philology of later and vulgar Latin, it was formerly supposed that 'testamentum,' by which the word [diatheke] is rendered in the early Latin versions as well as in the Vulgate, meant 'testament' or 'will,' whereas in fact it meant also, if not exclusively, 'covenant.'" - Essays in Biblical Greek, by Edwin Hatch, Oxford, 1889, p. 48.

"in the old Latin translation of the Scriptures testamentum became the common rendering of the word [diatheke]. As, however, this rendering is very often found where it is impossible to think of such a meaning as will (for example, in Ps. lxxxiii, 5, where no one will suppose the Psalmist to say that the enemies of God 'have arranged a testament against Him'), it is plain that the Latin testamentum was used with an extended meaning, answering to the wide application of the Greek word." - A Bible Commentary for English Readers - W. F. Moulton, edited by Charles Ellicott, New York, Vol. VIII, p. 309.

On the page in question I had references to 1 Chronicles 21:17 / Exodus 3:14; 33:20 / Genesis 1:26 / Isaiah 9:6 / Proverbs 8:27-30.

A quick read found this blatant error...

The speaker of Revelation 22:13 is indicated in Revelation 22:16...

16 I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, and the bright and morning star.

The Bible states that Jesus claimed "I am Alpha and Omega," contrary to your assertion.

Address that.

Revelation 1:1 indicates a revelation og God through Christ. At times God speaks through an angel (22:8) and at other times God speaks himself as at 1:8. Jesus is referred to as a mighty God but only Jehovah is referred to as God Almighty (Isaiah 9:6 / Genesis 1:17 / Revelation 1:8. At 21:6 God says that those conquering will inherit something and he will be their God and they his son. Jesus refered to those conquering as, not his sons but his brothers. Matthew 25:40 / Hebrews 2:10-12.

Throughout chapter 22 there are various speakers. 22:8-9 are an angel. 22:16 is obviously Jesus. 22:17a is the "spirit of the bride." 22:20b is John himself.
 

Lehrer

New member
TOL has been around for almost 15 years... we are very keen at spotting folks who wish to use TOL to promote their own website and drive our traffic to theirs.

Please keep the discussion here... rather than there... or we will simply delete your account and everything associated with it.

Oh... and.. welcome to TOL. :D

You've got to be ****ing kidding me. You've got more adds on this ***** than a Playboy rag and your pathetic *** is telling me not to leave a link?

**** you.
 

Nathon Detroit

LIFETIME MEMBER
LIFETIME MEMBER
You've got to be ****ing kidding me. You've got more adds on this ***** than a Playboy rag and your pathetic *** is telling me not to leave a link?

**** you.
The ads you see on this website generate revenue. Your links don't. :duh:
 

elohiym

Well-known member
Actually your use of the term OT, or Old Testament is handicapped right off the bat.

I am referring to the books of the Bible in the Hebrew canon. Call them whatever you like.

And if you want to nitpick, then your use of the terms "Exodus, Genesus, Isaiah," and "Proverbs" is handicapped because you are not using the correct Hebrew titles of the books.

On the page in question I had references to 1 Chronicles 21:17 / Exodus 3:14; 33:20 / Genesis 1:26 / Isaiah 9:6 / Proverbs 8:27-30.

The argument that Jesus is God is based on quite a number of OT scriptures that you did not address, so your argument is handicapped by that fact.

Jesus is referred to as a mighty God but only Jehovah is referred to as God Almighty...

:squint:

So you are saying that Jesus is a mighty God, but not God Almighty? Seriously?

Throughout chapter 22 there are various speakers. 22:8-9 are an angel. 22:16 is obviously Jesus. 22:17a is the "spirit of the bride." 22:20b is John himself.

Someone is coming quickly (Rev 22:12). We are waiting for the second coming of who? That same person is the speaker of Rev 22:13. Who else is coming quickly with his reward, if not the Jesus of Rev 22:16?

Clearly, based on those verses, Jesus is God. And when you come to understand that Jesus is God and what that means, especially regarding impeccability, then you may apprehend the gospel.
 

Town Heretic

Out of Order
Hall of Fame
:plain:

Well...that was something. At least now I know why he chose "other". It was as close to an epithet as he could come by designation.
 

The Berean

Well-known member
My goodness what a silly rabbit. Lehrer comes here all haughty-taughty with his supposed deep knowledge of Scripture yet when Knight asks him not to endorse his own website he goes off on some dumb profanity laced rant? Geez, what a tool.
 

Psalmist

Blessed is the man that......
LIFETIME MEMBER
Hall of Fame
TOL has been around for almost 15 years... we are very keen at spotting folks who wish to use TOL to promote their own website and drive our traffic to theirs.

Please keep the discussion here... rather than there... or we will simply delete your account and everything associated with it.

Oh... and.. welcome to TOL. :D

You've got to be ****ing kidding me. You've got more adds on this ***** than a Playboy rag and your pathetic *** is telling me not to leave a link?

**** you.

Sounds like a plan. :chuckle: Lehrer :banned:
 
You might want to consider something about ‘forums’?
Do you think that God doesn’t notice believers are just using the Internet as an excuse to ‘avoid’ Having To Physically Go Into All The World and do what Jesus commands [Mark 16:15-18]? Ergo, most believers aren’t joining forums to serve God or experience fellowship in Christ but rather they just want to boast and start arguments and insult everyone who doesn’t agree with their limited understanding of “God” or even worse and perhaps more likely; they were tempted into a forum by the devil to distract them From God?

i.e. Satan doesn’t want Christians going out In Person into the real world and spreading the gospel and edifying and healing and baptizing etc. and the Internet provides the ideal diversion to excuse believers from actually talking with real people In Person, knocking on people’s doors In Person and laying hands on people etc.? Thus, “forums” created to entice idle lazy disobedient believers to cower behind Alias usernames spewing biblical quotes from ignorance instead of declaring their Real names and going into the Real world and serving God as they Really should be doing? So the devil is quite happy to lure naïve believers into cyberspace, away from the real world and thus keeping them from Doing Those Things in service to God “in person”? And as long as people are distracted on the Internet arguing and bible-bashing each other, the devil doesn’t have to lift a finger to prevent “those believers” from obeying Mark 16:15-18 because they are already neatly trapped in the “Internet” and they may never learn how to truly Walk in Christ? In other words, their faith is so weak that they couldn’t preach anything to anyone In Person even if they wanted to and they probably never even spoke one prayer to God asking him to bless them with the ‘power’ to go out and interact with people Face-to-Face and obey what Mark 16:15-18 commands and in the end, that neglect could very well cost them their souls?

Some of these forums may also have been created by believers who do not have a ‘leadership role’ in their own physical church or maybe don’t belong to any church? So the “Internet” affords them the opportunity to ‘practice at’ being a cyber-pastor over their own flock of Anonymous cyber-lambs/wolves but they don’t have to face the inevitability of being questioned about what they’re doing and believing and saying because when the going gets tough, they simply remove the topics they don’t like and/or ban the people they cannot face. Likewise, many of the forum members are probably in the same boat and without the ‘power’ to do what Mark 16:15-18 says but a forum also enables ‘them’ to pretend they are wise church elders so confidently quoting scripture while arguing uncontrollably with anonymous strangers who might very well be wolves, for all They know or care to find out? ;)

Too scary for you to believe that might be what’s happening? Are you offended that your forum might not be serving any divine purpose whatsoever and that You might actually have to re-think some things about your faith and biblical interpretation? Shocked that You might need some spiritual correcting or you may actually be lost again? Well I hope you are shocked or at least concerned because that might mean you actually Do Care To Know if you’re believing and doing the right thing in Jesus’ name and that you do want to Listen and Learn and grow in Christ like the rest of us foolish wretches? And maybe you will now pray for God to show you what your true good works might be and bless you to properly serve his will, not Yours? Rather than anonymously prancing around in a forum trying to impress someone with your biblical knowledge because you’re afraid and powerless to face the real world in His name? Or like believers who segregate themselves in forums by denomination, as if to advertise that they might somehow be better Christians than non-denominational followers or that Adventists might somehow be better Christians than Protestants or Catholics might somehow be better Christians than Anglicans or Christadelphians might somehow be better Christians than Lutherans or Baptists might somehow be better Christians than Evangelicals etc. etc. etc.? But there it is! We now have thousands of believers that have migrated to the Internet wagging their uncontrollable tongues (James 3:8) in the vacuum of cyberspace and pretending to be warriors for God but in reality, they are merely deluding themselves? And for all You know, the devil’s minions also created the forum You are babbling in and the yolk is on you? ;) Don’t believe it? If you can’t, then you are ignorant because I’ve witnessed so-called Christian forums where the moderators are actually atheist or worse perhaps and so the joke was indeed on “those believers who participated”.

But what do I know? Anyway, kudos to those responsible for this forum if this topic actually survived their screening process thus allowing members to read it and God to do the moderating? Notwithstanding, I do question the advent of forums and the motives of those who create them since, if for no other reason, that the ‘nature’ of a forum does not promote love and patience but rather conflict, hatred and impatience. So if anyone thinks I’m here looking for forum buddies, friends or pals, let me be perfectly clear. God willing, I’m compelled to be here mainly to WARN those believers who may have been lured here by the evil one and/or inadvertently; about the ‘danger’ of forums and the Internet! Period.

And whether or not the creators of these forums had good intentions, I have witnessed far too much evil in each and every forum I participated in. Without exception, Each and Every so-called Christian forum proved to be little more than a chaotic hostile vehicle for judgmental, hateful, ignorant administrators and moderators trying to play God instead of ‘facing God’s truth’ in obedience to Christ and most members responded in kind because most people weren’t there to blamelessly, harmlessly debate Christianity and perhaps learn something and grow in Him. Quite the contrary, they were there to fight and argue their “limited understanding of God” at any cost and when the Mods/Admins couldn’t support their opinions and/or felt threatened to perhaps being exposed as false brethren, they just removed the topics and banned anyone who didn’t kneel to their rhetoric and man-made rules. Which means they aren’t ‘forums’ in the first place because people weren’t allowed to freely and honestly debate or discuss anything. ;)

So I guess we’ll soon find out if this forum operates similarly and if believers here put God’s Laws first instead of man-contrived-forum-rules? As well, I won’t be posting any further comments nor responding publically to anyone’s threads in this forum either because I’m not here to debate anything with anyone especially in an almost certain ungodly atmosphere like ‘this’ and so as to then perhaps be accused of lending credence to any otherwise legitimate Internet platforms let alone “so-called Christian forums”? I’ve already learned my lesson God willing, about the evil of the “Internet” and those human resources who would perpetrate evil there. Indeed, I’m genuinely repulsed now just ‘joining’ any of these forums in order to “warn” those whom God may wish to be warned? I may not even have any divine purpose for being on the Internet myself but in the event that just one person is properly corrected or saved by doing so, then it was absolutely worth the effort. Hallelujah!

Paul
 
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