Speaking in Tongues a Stupid Practice and Probably "Annoys God."

[Grosnick Marowbe]

:thumb:

Yep

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

Actually I didn't say that, but as your DON'T speak in tongues, you DON'T have the infilling of the Holy Spirit, just as is clearly shown in Acts 19:1-7 (NIV)

The HOLY Spirit allows me to exercise my faith and be used in the corporate church to minster to saints and sinners.

Nobody that KNOWS the Bible, ever says not speaking in tongues equates to not being saved. Maybe people of your ilk try to prevaricate in that manner, but that is NOT what is taught in scripture. Orderly corporate use is what is taught BUT if you don't have the infilling of the Holy Spirit, and refuse to acknowledge what Paul clearly showed in Acts 19, then you WON'T understand.

Pamphlets? :loser:

The spirit of Christ is NOT the same, which you should know if you remember your Sunday School lessons? Jesus said to WAIT for the Holy Spirit. Apparently you don't believe Him either? You probably should read Rom 8:9 and 1 Peter 1:11 more thoroughly and IN context in order to understand the vernacular being used.

I always have wondered why a lot of usernames ALWAYS indicate the EXACT opposite of the person using them?

For instance: God's Truth?

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

They heard what the Holy Spirit allowed them to hear. They did NOT hear the actual glossolalia.
As you obviously have never received the infilling of the Holy Spirit you wouldn't know what that spirit is.

One is indwelt, sealed, and baptized by the Holy Spirit (not by water) into the Body
of Christ once they hear the Grace Message and place their faith
in Christ. That's how it works.

 

[glorydaz]

Actually I didn't say that, but as your DON'T speak in tongues, you DON'T have the infilling of the Holy Spirit, just as is clearly shown in Acts 19:1-7 (NIV)

The HOLY Spirit allows me to exercise my faith and be used in the corporate church to minster to saints and sinners.

Nobody that KNOWS the Bible, ever says not speaking in tongues equates to not being saved. Maybe people of your ilk try to prevaricate in that manner, but that is NOT what is taught in scripture. Orderly corporate use is what is taught BUT if you don't have the infilling of the Holy Spirit, and refuse to acknowledge what Paul clearly showed in Acts 19, then you WON'T understand.

Pamphlets? :loser:

The spirit of Christ is NOT the same, which you should know if you remember your Sunday School lessons? Jesus said to WAIT for the Holy Spirit. Apparently you don't believe Him either? You probably should read Rom 8:9 and 1 Peter 1:11 more thoroughly and IN context in order to understand the vernacular being used.

I always have wondered why a lot of usernames ALWAYS indicate the EXACT opposite of the person using them?

Jesus said to wait for the Spirit because Jesus had to ascend into heaven before He would come.

John 16:7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you.​

And, of course, John's baptism is not the same as when we are baptized into Christ by the Holy Spirit. What you're suggesting is just off. It's clear the poster you are addressing had grounds for saying too many Pentecostals claim others aren't saved unless they speak in tongues. I've heard it many times myself.

Acts 19:2-4
He said unto them, Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed? And they said unto him, We have not so much as heard whether there be any Holy Ghost. And he said unto them, Unto what then were ye baptized? And they said, Unto John's baptism. Then said Paul, John verily baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people, that they should believe on him which should come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus.​

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

I visited a place called "Melodyland" It was a charismatic Church in the 70s
I got water baptized there. For what I believed at the time was just to show
outwardly what happened inwardly. I know know that water baptism is
unnecessary and tongues and the other gifts are not for today.

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

Jesus said to wait for the Spirit because Jesus had to ascend into heaven before He would come.

John 16:7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you.​

And, of course, John's baptism is not the same as when we are baptized into Christ by the Holy Spirit. What you're suggesting is just off. It's clear the poster you are addressing had grounds for saying too many Pentecostals claim others aren't saved unless they speak in tongues. I've heard it many times myself.

Acts 19:2-4
He said unto them, Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed? And they said unto him, We have not so much as heard whether there be any Holy Ghost. And he said unto them, Unto what then were ye baptized? And they said, Unto John's baptism. Then said Paul, John verily baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people, that they should believe on him which should come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus.​

Amen.

 

[glorydaz]

One is indwelt, sealed, and baptized by the Holy Spirit (not by water) into the Body
of Christ once they hear the Grace Message and place their faith
in Christ. That's how it works.

Yep, that's how it works. :thumb:

 

[freelight]

Respecting the movement of the Spirit in your own spirit.......

Respecting the movement of the Spirit in your own spirit.......

The purpose of speech is to communicate, i.e., to convey my thoughts to you in a way that you can understand.

The Protestant practice of "speaking in tongues," i.e., asking God to endow them with the use of a languge that neither they nor anybody else understands, is completely contrary to the intrinsic expressiveness/communicativeness of language. In other words, the practice presupposes that God will endow you with linguistic skills stripped of their natural expressiveness, will give you a language that frustrates its own natural ends.

Two kinds of 'tongues' must be considered to exist here,...one that is 'known' of course (the many languages of man) and some that are 'unknown' (meaning not native to ordinary language of this earth-realm, being of a more 'transcendental' nature).

The language heard by foreigners on the day of Pentecost were in 'known' tongues,...but there remains the public and private use of 'tongues' in the religious/spiritual community of believers as described by Paul. This 'glossalalia' is 'spiritual' in nature/dimension, and can be given as a message to a congregation if meant to be 'interpreted' for all to understand (remember there is the gift of interpreting tongues, earthly or spiritual), or there may be times of prayer or even singing in 'tongues' in worship/praise to 'God' when one's own 'spirit' is expressing itself to the Infinite Spirit....in spiritual feelings, thoughts and intimations.

A form of this can be referred to often as one's own 'prayer language', when one's spirit prays in deep communion with Spirit. This 'language' transcends the ordinary mind, being of the spirit. It can be translated, or doesn't have to be,...being just one expressing toward or communicating with 'God'. Its a language of spiritual feeling as I describe it. (when one doesn't know how or what to pray,...the Spirit interceds with groanings....deep calls unto deep.)

As sodomy is to the sexual act and lying is to assertion, so too is speaking in tongues to language.

I find this comparison as quite extravagant....for lack of a better word at the moment - it nears sacrilege. - what it comes down to is a matter of understanding...if you're looking in as an 'outsider' or are an insider having the experience.

The protestant who asks God to give them such speech asks God to pervert his own creation, and that's Satanic.

I don't follow or agree with the logic there. While some Pentecostals/charasmatics encourage people to ask for the gift or to pray in tongues (via laying on of hands, baptism in the Holy Spirit)...I think the true emphasis is being filled with the fullness of 'God'...emptying yourself to be filled with Him. Its a 'surrender' to His Spirit, will and the prophetic dimension, since 'speaking in tongues' is a kind of 'prophecy'...the bubbling forth of waters (spirit unto Spirit).

A lot of this also depends on what denomination you affiliate with and are being taught under, how they order their services, their 'conduct' (what they allow). You are responsible for your own 'speech' unto 'God', however that comes out, for his exaltation and purpose, to glorify his will in the earth. I'm sure some charismatic catholics sharing with protestant believers have also moved in this dimension of the Spirit, and function thereby, according to the Spirit's leading. Of course some human or carnal interference or distortions can enter in (we are imperfect in our flesh),....but you get back on track. I share from my own experience in the Spirit among Pentecostal/charismatic communities, and my own 'speaking in tongues' (communion in that Spirit-realm that transcends the mind). There's much more to the subject as well




pj

 

[Traditio]

Freelight is defending glossalalia. Do I really need any further argument for why the practice is ridiculous?

 

[Traditio]

For anyone who thinks the practice is defensible, I think that the following are compelling;

1. There is no unequivocal evidence in the Bible that promotes the practice (not in and of itself compelling).

2. The nature of the act is contrary to the purposes of language.

3. Linguists seem to be in accord in saying that glossalalia is not a legitimate act of speech. In fact, they seem to be in accord in saying that glossalalia is nothing supernatural; it's pretty much spontaneous gibberish produced by the "speaker."

4. One site I read indicates that glossalia has almost no history in Christianity prior to 1901 in Topeka, Kansas.

You would either have to brainwashed or a complete idiot, if you simply consider the evidence, to think that glossalalia is anything but a sham and delusion, of, not a divine, but a human, all too human, origin. It is little more than culturally induced mass hysteria. Nothing more.

Concerning xenoglossy: this is a biblical practice, and this is what Acts describes. But it is no longer widespread because there is no need for this, as St. Thomas Aquinas himself says. The Catholic Church already preaches throughout the world, to the many nations, in their own tongues. Widespread xenoglossy would be superfluous. Yet, God does grant this gift, in perhaps rare occassions, where necessary for the salvation of souls. Consider St. Padre Pio.

 

[StanJ]

Jesus said to wait for the Spirit because Jesus had to ascend into heaven before He would come.

John 16:7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you.
​

And, of course, John's baptism is not the same as when we are baptized into Christ by the Holy Spirit. What you're suggesting is just off. It's clear the poster you are addressing had grounds for saying too many Pentecostals claim others aren't saved unless they speak in tongues. I've heard it many times myself.

Acts 19:2-4
He said unto them, Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed? And they said unto him, We have not so much as heard whether there be any Holy Ghost. And he said unto them, Unto what then were ye baptized? And they said, Unto John's baptism. Then said Paul, John verily baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people, that they should believe on him which should come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus.
​

Jesus said God would send ANOTHER comforter or παράκλητος (paraklētos) John 14:16 (NIV). Jesus was the first Comforter.
He said wait for the "Comforter" or παράκλητος (paraklētos) John 16:7 (NIV)
You should be able to see the difference here?

You're right, but accepting Christ as our savior is NOT being baptized in Christ. receiving the spirit of Christ is not the same as being baptized or filled with the Holy Spirit, as I've already shown from scripture.
Some Pentecostals may say that, but they are uneducated or falsely taught, just as many Calvinists are. Doing what Paul instructs in Rom 10:9-11 means one is saved. Doing or having the Baptism of the Holy Spirit as Paul also instructed in Acts 19:1-7 is a separate and distinct event in our walk of faith.

 

[StanJ]

For anyone who thinks the practice is defensible, I think that the following are compelling;

Biased assertions don't really carry ANY weight here. A post with NO scripture whatsoever carries even less. Bias is clearly seen from you and THAT is your problem. I'll stick with scripture and the REALITY of the Holy Spirit in my life.

 

[Traditio]

Biased assertions don't really carry ANY weight here. A post with NO scripture whatsoever carries even less. Bias is clearly seen from you and THAT is your problem. I'll stick with scripture and the REALITY of the Holy Spirit in my life.

Show me biblical verses which unequivocally support the pentecostal practice. If you then appeal to the so called "reality" of the practice because of your experience, I'll appeal to the linguistics, who assert that you are just playing pretend.

Here's what I'm saying, StanJ. Why don't you give me some empirical proof, independently of your misreading of the Bible, that you are doing more than playing pretend? Give me some science.

Give me some kind of proof that can be accepted by someone who doesn't already believe in your pentecostal silliness.

 

[oatmeal]

[/B]
For instance: God's Truth?

oatmeal?

 

[oatmeal]

I was expecting actual answers, not just scripture quotes.

Now I understand you.

For you, scripture holds no answers.

That is evident by many of your answers that boast personal opinions instead of scripture.

"What saith the scripture?" Romans

Jeremiah 15:16

Psalm 119:130

You need to learn how to read and believe scripture.

 

[oatmeal]

God is right and you are wrong

Acts 2:4 is plain as day.

If you wish to reject that scripture, that is your loss

 

[oatmeal]

On Pentecost, every man heard the Apostlesintheir own language. The only thing one hears in modern Pentecostal tongues is worthless noise, clanging cymbals.

When you are taught God's instructions for the use of speaking in tongues, then you will realize that you had much to learn.

 

[desiringGod7]

When you are taught God's instructions for the use of speaking in tongues, then you will realize that you had much to learn.

Of all of the precious truth and instruction from God in His Word.. it takes a fool to take the idea speaking in tongues and to turn it into an idol, which is what has happened in many congregations.

I speak to my Lord, and he hears me. I use real words, and what I can't find words for, His Spirit inside of me searches and knows already. I would have to be a complete fool to think that by me making random sounds my lips and tongue I could do ANYTHING to add to the relationship I already have, because of what I have in Christ.

Real language is an ACTUAL gift of God. Learn to appreciate it.

 

[Psalmist]

Of all of the precious truth and instruction from God in His Word.. it takes a fool to take the idea speaking in tongues and to turn it into an idol, which is what has happened in many congregations.

I speak to my Lord, and he hears me. I use real words, and what I can't find words for, His Spirit inside of me searches and knows already. I would have to be a complete fool to think that by me making random sounds my lips and tongue I could do ANYTHING to add to the relationship I already have, because of what I have in Christ.

Real language is an ACTUAL gift of God. Learn to appreciate it.

Paul wrote in Romans 1:25
Who exchanged the truth of God for the lie, and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever. Amen.

The creature more than the Creator ... The gift more than the giver.
​

 

[Totton Linnet]

Of all of the precious truth and instruction from God in His Word.. it takes a fool to take the idea speaking in tongues and to turn it into an idol, which is what has happened in many congregations.

I speak to my Lord, and he hears me. I use real words, and what I can't find words for, His Spirit inside of me searches and knows already. I would have to be a complete fool to think that by me making random sounds my lips and tongue I could do ANYTHING to add to the relationship I already have, because of what I have in Christ.

Real language is an ACTUAL gift of God. Learn to appreciate it.

I know folks who love speechifying so much in English it is an idol.

Paul spoke in tongues more than anyone.