Robert's Gospel According to the Apostle Paul

[clefty]

I am a Jewish convert and a Christian.

You cant be both...it is a new creature IN HIM

Jews, you see, worship a god that HAD NOT A SON...and certainly have no need of SALVATION through Him...

In fact Jews dont want freedom from sin...but freedom from oppression which means they rule the world...you know tikkun olam...it just so happens that to heal the world they must needs to run it...

Jews dont wait His return to go heaven and then live with Him...they still await a conquering king to help them this tikkun olam thingy...

Yup Jews actually HATE Him because He came to remind them Israel was to have been merely a blessing to all nations through their worship ministry at His temple...weeeelll they fumbled that one...so He had to come and do it Himself...and NOW AGAIN blessings and promises are for goyim too...and not just for jews...

So they killed Him cuz they wanted it to be just for jews...

I mean you saw what they did even to the rest of israel right? Over TAXING them just to worship at Jerusalem to the point their brothers couldn’t pay anymore so the worshipped elsewhere...wow...

That’s why Yah banished them...poof genetic Israel was gone and only jews returned...to try again...lol the covenant its laws remained though...

Nope cant be jew and christian...IN HIM there is no jew...no gentile either...what goyim keeps Sabbath or kosher? Lol...oh a believing grateful one...not really gentile anymore though...

ONE LAW for native and non native...of Israel and NOT Judah...just like in the OT...

You missed Israel with your attempt to join Judah...

 

[tetelestai]

Prolly cuz they didnt know nothing about a 40 year overlap thingy...

Same thing happened in the wilderness.

Because of the Israelites worshipping the golden calf, one generation was kept from participating in the covenant that was just given to Moses (the OC) They were kept from entering the Promised Land for 40 years. That generation wondered in the desert for 40 years.

All males born during those 40 years were NOT circumcised. It wasn't until after they crossed the Jordan into the Promised Land,that all those men were circumcised.

Only two men who were 18 or older when Moses took his census crossed the Jordan. They were Joshua and Caleb. Not even Moses and his brother Aaron could cross the river. They could only stand on the other side, and look at it.

 

[clefty]

Same thing happened in the wilderness.

Because of the Israelites worshipping the golden calf, one generation was kept from participating in the covenant that was just given to Moses (the OC) They were kept from entering the Promised Land for 40 years. That generation wondered in the desert for 40 years.

All males born during those 40 years were NOT circumcised. It wasn't until after they crossed the Jordan into the Promised Land,that all those men were circumcised.

Only two men who were 18 or older when Moses took his census crossed the Jordan. They were Joshua and Caleb. Not even Moses and his brother Aaron could cross the river. They could only stand on the other side, and look at it.

Close...

A new generation of the same nation Israel crossed the Jordan...under the same covenant...

You however insist that in the NT a new generation crossed over into promise...under a new covenant with BRAND NEW DIFFERNT LAWS or dispensation or whatever...

Back then the people that arrived to the promise were already a mix of native and non native under one law...a law which continued the same even after crossing into promise...they did NOT get in because they disobeyed...even Moses...(I mean if anyone should have gotten a disclaimer clause or pass...I mean it wasnt even levitical law or 1 of the 10 that kept him out...he was under a different dispensation true but still faith WITH WORKS)

The people that actually went IN to the promise were however NOT given a NEW CONTRACT or new laws...

So study again this 40 year thingy and realize the Law remained its dispensation too...and even in the OT the covenant remained the same

In the NT it was NEVER wait 40 years to the promise land of heaven above...certainly NOT wait 40 years to be free from laws...the very laws that identify you as citizens of that heaven above...you know laws that define you as His People...which “here are they that keep the commandments of Yah and have the faith OF Yahushua”

So did that faith become Islam after another 40 years?...does it become Buddhist if followed 40 years?

Ha I know many jews that became Buddhist in later life...so there is a pattern...LOL

 

[tetelestai]

Close...

A new generation of the same nation Israel crossed the Jordan...under the same covenant...

Close.

The Israelites lived in physical bondage in Egypt. They were led out of that physical bondage, through physical water, into a physical promised land. However, they had to wait 40 years because they rejected what God had given them.

That was a typology of what was to come.

In the first century, humans were under the spiritual bondage of sin. Christ Jesus was sent to deliver the people out of spiritual bondage, into a spiritual promised land, through baptism by the Spirit.

However, the people He was sent to, rejected Him, and had to wait 40 years until the New Covenant was fully in place.

There was an overlap of the two covenants during those 40 years.

The writer of Hebrews tells us so:

(Heb 8:13) By calling this covenant "new," he has made the first one obsolete; and what is obsolete and outdated will soon disappear.

During those 40 years (30AD - 70AD), the Old Covenant was fading away, and disappeared for good in 70AD.

Hebrews was written during those 40 years.

We now live fully under the New Covenant.

 

[tetelestai]

The people that actually went IN to the promise were however NOT given a NEW CONTRACT or new laws...

None of the males born during the 40 years in the wilderness were circumcised.

That means that when they became men they could not eat the Passover, or participate in any of the other feasts, or any of the requirements of the Law given to Moses.

Yet they lived side by side with older men who were keeping the law.

 

[clefty]

Animal sacrifices for sin atonement were temporary until Christ Jesus made the one time sacrifice for sin FOR EVER.

Animal sacrifices for sin atonement AFTER the cross is blasphemous.



Animal sacrifices were a temporary covering of sins that foreshadowed the perfect, one time, complete, absolute, sacrifice of Christ Jesus for sins.

Yes indeed...critical point...all these shadows ARE to point to Him...His Way...

They were to teach “Mercy rather than sacrifice”...His people were to have been known for their mercy love and holiness not genes or sacrificial system...

That was to have made them circumcised in heart...inwardly...His people by promise and faith and obedience not genes

Israel was ALWAYS a spiritual thing...not genetic or by blood...

From blood Jacob he was made into Israel by the Spirit...now a re-born son from another promise Isaac...who also was divinely ordained as genetically those genes were dust since Sarah was too old...

Not for their sake did the hebrews get saved from Egypt or for anything they did or were but for His promise to Abraham...


This continued genetic blood and biology and secret seed line elitism is satanic...and should be avoided Titus 3:9

But we are to learn Mercy rather than sacrifice...towards Him His faith and obedience...to represent His holiness not our chosenness...certainly not our genes

 

[clefty]

Close.

The Israelites lived in physical bondage in Egypt. They were led out of that physical bondage, through physical water, into a physical promised land. However, they had to wait 40 years because they rejected what God had given them.

That was a typology of what was to come.

In the first century, humans were under the spiritual bondage of sin. Christ Jesus was sent to deliver the people out of spiritual bondage, into a spiritual promised land, through baptism by the Spirit.

However, the people He was sent to, rejected Him, and had to wait 40 years until the New Covenant was fully in place.

There was an overlap of the two covenants during those 40 years.

The writer of Hebrews tells us so:

(Heb 8:13) By calling this covenant "new," he has made the first one obsolete; and what is obsolete and outdated will soon disappear.

During those 40 years (30AD - 70AD), the Old Covenant was fading away, and disappeared for good in 70AD.

Hebrews was written during those 40 years.

We now live fully under the New Covenant.

Ummmm...right New contract same Laws from sin to salvation...just like saved from egypt entered promise land same laws...

 

[john w]

Jesus tells how we know what is right and wrong:

(Matt 7:12 KJV) Therefore all things whatsoever ye would that men should do to you, do ye even so to them: for this is the law and the prophets.

You say that the law and the prophets was made void, destroyed at the cross.


Are you drunk?

 

[clefty]

None of the males born during the 40 years in the wilderness were circumcised.

That means that when they became men they could not eat the Passover, or participate in any of the other feasts, or any of the requirements of the Law given to Moses.

Yet they lived side by side with older men who were keeping the law.

Ummmm right...from egypt to promised land they were keeping the law...same law...and if any were broken or not kept they were unclean out of the campt...then made clean and finally able to cross into the promise...

Just like we in the same law new covenant will cross over not from unsaved to IN HIM...

But from IN HIM...into the promise land of with HIM...actually...you know having been circumcised of heart to obey and be “here are they that keep the commandments of Yah and the faith of Yahushua”...

Trust and obey...for there is not other way...know that song?

 

[tetelestai]

Ummmm...right New contract same Laws from sin to salvation...just like saved from egypt entered promise land same laws...

Not the same laws.

(Heb 7:12) For when the priesthood is changed, the law must be changed also.

We know the priesthood changed. Christ Jesus was not from the tribe of Levi, and a descendant of Aaron. He was from the tribe of Judah.

Only men from the tribe of Levi, who were direct descendants of Aaron could be priests under the Law of Moses.

(Heb 7:14) For it is clear that our Lord descended from Judah, and in regard to that tribe Moses said nothing about priests.

The priesthood changed. Christ Jesus is our High Priest.

(Heb 4:14) Therefore, since we have a great high priest who has ascended into heaven, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold firmly to the faith we profess.

When the priesthood changed, the law changed.

The writer of Hebrews tells us when the priesthood changed, the law HAD to change.

Yet, you keep claiming we have the same law.

 

[clefty]

You say that the law and the prophets was made void, destroyed at the cross.


Are you drunk?

LOL...thought you were and passed out...missed you ‘round here...

Kinda slow...ha

Anywho...happy pope gregory calendar new year thingy or something I guess...

 

[tetelestai]

You say that the law and the prophets was made void, destroyed at the cross.

The law and prophets were fulfilled by Christ Jesus.

Are you drunk?

No, but I'm a little hung over from last night.

 

[john w]

Jesus said the same thing Paul said:

(Matt 7:12 KJV) Therefore all things whatsoever ye would that men should do to you, do ye even so to them: for this is the law and the prophets.

Are you still drunk? According to you, the law has been destroyed, so you have no objective law, that defines the above, "whatsoever....," and the Saviour's' "whatsoever" would always confirm "It is written" in His own law, not going beyond its parameters, not violating His own objective law, as contained within the OT.

 

[tetelestai]

Ummmm right...from egypt to promised land they were keeping the law...same law...and if any were broken or not kept they were unclean out of the campt...then made clean and finally able to cross into the promise...

No, they didn't keep the law.

They didn't circumcise any of the males who were born. They didn't do this for 40 years.

 

[clefty]

Not the same laws.

(Heb 7:12) For when the priesthood is changed, the law must be changed also.

We know the priesthood changed. Christ Jesus was not from the tribe of Levi, and a descendant of Aaron. He was from the tribe of Judah.

Only men from the tribe of Levi, who were direct descendants of Aaron could be priests under the Law of Moses.

(Heb 7:14) For it is clear that our Lord descended from Judah, and in regard to that tribe Moses said nothing about priests.

The priesthood changed. Christ Jesus is our High Priest.

(Heb 4:14) Therefore, since we have a great high priest who has ascended into heaven, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold firmly to the faith we profess.

When the priesthood changed, the law changed.

The writer of Hebrews tells us when the priesthood changed, the law HAD to change.

Yet, you keep claiming we have the same law.

Ok let’s make this easier for you...He was clear its not LORD! LORD! But those that DO WHAT...

He also said HIs mother and brothers are those that DO WHAT...

He also said if you love Him do what...

So which of these do you do?

Start easy like with the 10...which of the 10 do you NOT wish to do in the NT?

 

[clefty]

No, they didn't keep the law.

They didn't circumcise any of the males who were born. They didn't do this for 40 years.

And thus had to in order to go into the promise land...

And uncircumcised they were still saved from egypt

BTW circumcision was NOT salvific never was...didnt save Moses from death or Abraham...

And just cuz the people didnt do it dont mean the LAW didnt remain...duh

They did it until they didnt...and well they were abolished not the Law

 

[tetelestai]

Are you still drunk? According to you, the law has been destroyed, so you have no objective law, that defines the above, "whatsoever....," and the Saviour's' "whatsoever" would always confirm "It is written" in His own law, not going beyond its parameters, not violating His own objective law, as contained within the OT.

The writer of Hebrews agrees with me:

(Heb 7:18) For on the one hand there is an annulling of the former commandment because of its weakness and unprofitableness,

The law was annulled, meaning it is no longer valid.

There is a new law because their is a new priesthood. There is also a new covenant.

 

[tetelestai]

And thus had to inorder to go into the promise land...

No, they didn't.

They entered the promised land uncircumcised.

 

[tetelestai]

Ok let’s make this easier for you...He was clear its not LORD! LORD! But those that DO WHAT...

He also said HIs mother and brothers are those that DO WHAT...

He also said if you love Him do what...

Jesus was born under the law, and lived under the law.

When Jesus said the above things, He was living under the law, as were all the people He said those things to.

The law changed AFTER the cross, not before it.

 

[Robert Pate]

Where there is law there is judgment and condemnation. There is no law for the Christian, Romans 8:1, because the law has been abolished by Jesus Christ, Ephesians 2:15. Under the New Covenant the Christian does not live by the law or by religion, Instead, "The Just Shall Live By Faith" Romans 1:17.

John W. is under the wrath of God because he holds the truth in unrighteousness, Romans 1:18.

Living by faith does not mean living by rules, laws or religion. The just that are living by faith are living by faith in Christ and his Gospel.