But they do.
Even their pope and priests bow and pray to the statues.
And they have done it consistently through history.
So where do you get the idea that RCC members are not supposed to do what their pope and leaders have done throughout history?
Pagan Mary Worship
- Thread starter Ktoyou
- Start date
Even their pope and priests bow and pray to the statues.
And they have done it consistently through history.
So where do you get the idea that RCC members are not supposed to do what their pope and leaders have done throughout history?
Ben Masada
New member
Well, Pollice, I am not a Bishop but, I assign yourself with a mission today: To instruct Catholic peasants who indeed worship the graven images of Mary. Then they carry Mary's statue in a procession on the shoulders of 4 people through the streets till they get into a church with it and, many even pray before her asking for a miracle. Some go further and kiss the statue or touch it and kiss their fingers. I wonder how close one is to get to be committing and act of idolatry.
Pollice Verso
New member
They don't pray to statues - they pray to Christ, Who those statues represent.
SaulToPaul 2
Well-known member
We can pray to Christ without the statues, right?
The most textbook example of idolatry is when a number of Jews made a golden calf in the absence of Moses. They melted down their jewelry and worshiped the physical idol itself as God, being an incantation of prosperity.
So bowing down to statues of saints is not idolatry, though there are things which do the Catholic Church no justice such as hallowing water and objects. In fact, there's Gnostic roots in that though they'll never admit it
So bowing down to statues of saints is not idolatry, though there are things which do the Catholic Church no justice such as hallowing water and objects. In fact, there's Gnostic roots in that though they'll never admit it
Pollice Verso
New member
Of course. Just as you can pray without closing your eyes, kneeling, or even actually saying the words out loud.
Let's see about that.
[FONT="]Every good, every help, every grace which men have received and will receive from God until the End of Time, came, and will come, to them by the intercession and through the hands of Mary . . . the whole Trinity gave thee a name, O Mary, which after that of thy most holy Son is above every name, so that at thy name every knee should genuflect in heaven, on earth, and under the earth, and every tongue should confess the grace, the glory, and the power of thy most holy name.[/FONT] [FONT="] - Raymond Jordano[/FONT] |
[FONT="]All the Elect obtain eternal salvation through the means of Mary. [/FONT][FONT="]- St. Ildephonsus[/FONT] |
[FONT="]No man is delivered or preserved from the world-wide snares of Satan except through Mary; and God grants His graces to no one except through her alone.[/FONT] [FONT="]- St. Germanus of Constantinople[/FONT] |
[FONT="]She opens the abyss of God's mercy to whomsoever she wills, when she wills, and as she wills, so that there is no sinner however great who is lost if Mary protects him . . . All men: past, present, and to come, should look upon Mary as the means and negotiator of the salvation of all ages.[/FONT] [FONT="]- St. Bernard[/FONT] |
[FONT="]All gifts, virtues, and graces of the Holy Ghost are administered by the hands of Mary to whomsoever she desires, when she desires, and in the manner she desires, and to whatever degree[/FONT] she desires. - St. Bernardine of Siena |
[FONT="]All the Saints have a great devotion to Our Lady: no grace comes from Heaven without passing through her hands. We cannot go into a house without speaking to the doorkeeper. Well, the Holy Virgin is the doorkeeper of Heaven.[/FONT] [FONT="]- St. John Mary Vianney[/FONT] |
[FONT="]We had closed Paradise; you, O Mary, opened the entryway to the tree of life again . . . You are the bridge to life, the staircase to Heaven! [/FONT] [FONT="]- St. John Damascene[/FONT] |
[FONT="]Holy Scripture was written for Mary, about Mary, and on account of Mary.[/FONT] [FONT="]- St. Bernard |
[/FONT]
And folks still wonder WHY folks in the RCC worship her.
Pagan Mary Worship
Was not Adam created in the image of God?
Dust, Soul and Mind?
Is not the Father the Picture of Wisdom?
Is not the Son the Flesh, as the Word became Flesh?
Was the Protoevangelium not etched into Genisis?
Is not the Spirit of Elohim the very Soul of God?
Sent from my iPad using TOL ~Jesus is the Theology and the Counselor is the Commentary
Was not Adam created in the image of God?
Dust, Soul and Mind?
Is not the Father the Picture of Wisdom?
Is not the Son the Flesh, as the Word became Flesh?
Was the Protoevangelium not etched into Genisis?
Is not the Spirit of Elohim the very Soul of God?
Sent from my iPad using TOL ~Jesus is the Theology and the Counselor is the Commentary
Ben Masada
New member
The most textbook example of idolatry is when a number of Jews made a golden calf in the absence of Moses. They melted down their jewelry and worshiped the physical idol itself as God, being an incantation of prosperity.
So bowing down to statues of saints is not idolatry, though there are things which do the Catholic Church no justice such as hallowing water and objects. In fact, there's Gnostic roots in that though they'll never admit it
So bowing down to statues of saints is not idolatry, though there are things which do the Catholic Church no justice such as hallowing water and objects. In fact, there's Gnostic roots in that though they'll never admit it
You are right to remind me of that act of idolatry played by the Jews when they built the golden calf when Moses was away up on the mount but, I don't see much of a difference from collecting money from the offerings of Catholics to buy a beautiful statue of Mary, Jesus, or some of the saints and take them out in a procession on the shoulders of four carriers till getting into a church and praying before the statues even asking for a miracle.
Pollice Verso
New member
From the Catholic Catechism:
"This very special devotion ... differs essentially from the adoration which is given to the incarnate Word and equally to the Father and the Holy Spirit, and greatly fosters this adoration."
In other words, honor Mary, worship God.
Right Divider
Body part
Sadly, you are falling for lies and seem not to care about standing firm in the truth.
Right Divider
Body part
If it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck.....
Praying to anyone but God is wrong. But you know that.
Right Divider
Body part
Representing God with a statue. And you don't see a problem with that? You have problems.
Pollice Verso
New member
That's no different from stain glass windows depicting Jesus, or a Lamb clearly depicting Jesus, or a Nativity scene, etc.
Yes, it's all idolatry.
The statues are NOT of their idea of image of Jesus, they are as often Mary, which is the Roman image of Minerva, the virgin goddess. The statues are said to be like a living being, which heal and bleed.
Pollice Verso
New member
There may be some who believe this, but it is not the official teaching of the church.
Pollice Verso
New member
This is an unfair stereotype. Are all Protestants snake handlers? Or are they lawless sinners who are saved because they "prayed the prayer" when they were 5 years old? Stereotypes and generalizations are unseemly on all sides.
I went to a regular Catholic church and in comes the "priest" all dressed up in high regalia, with incense clapping away. They thing they do magic and can change bread and wine into the body and blood of Christ (transubstantiation). I guess with all the pomp and ceremony, they thing their sacred rituals are truly magical!
I seem here, Catholicism is atheism in the making, when the kids grow up! Until I can to TOL, I did believe it was just another 'holy roller' church.
I seem here, Catholicism is atheism in the making, when the kids grow up! Until I can to TOL, I did believe it was just another 'holy roller' church.