ECT Our triune God

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Obviously not the simplistic and clueless DyoHypoTrins who drop in with a short sentence.

Maybe you have scripture that provides three hypostases for God. Nobody else doesn. Do you have some extra scribbled pages pasted into the binding?

I wouldn't waste my time arguing your silly "genealogies". Learn Jesus.
 

Lazy afternoon

LIFETIME MEMBER
LIFETIME MEMBER
Yes, I know you are. I'm not in the least. It's the quantity of hypostases that's at issue.



Well... I can partially accept that as an excuse and go on.



Good for you!!!! I will heretofore no longer refer to you as a Triadist at any time. You are an actual Trinitarian, unlike many/most of your peers (including Lon and godrulz, etc.).

I thought it was your PDF that Lon posted, so I must have been mistaken. I'm referring to the PDF on this site that interposes the HS as both a person and a being in the same sentence; and specifically insisting the Holy Spirit had both a distinct mind and will (referencing phronema and boulomai, which are not nous and thelo/thelema).

Kudos to you. Even though it's still error, I don't have nearly the issue with actual Creedal Trinitarians as I do with the vast professing majority who are actually Triadists purporting and percieving the conceptualization that F/S/HS each have individuated centers of sentient consciousness.



Meh.... Not much there.

That is clear.

Anyone should be able to understand that post.

LA
 

godrulz

Well-known member
Hall of Fame
That's because you can't/don't/won't understand that God created eternity.

I can essentially be described as a Unitarian with a divine, eternal, uncreated Son as Theanthropos.

So, you affirm that Jesus is God Almighty, the one true God (Deity of Christ)?

God did not create eternity. Wrong assumptions lead to wrong conclusions. Eternity is everlasting time (duration/sequence/succession). Eternity and time are not created 'things', but concepts. Measures of time (sun, moon, stars, clocks) are created things, but should not be confused with fundamental, philosophical time/eternity.

Unitarians deny the Deity of Christ. Your view is not trinitarian by your own definition. You are closer to modalism than biblical trinitarianism.

What church/denomination did you pastor in, pretty please? I once pastored in a Pentecostal church.

ECF were philosophically (pagan and otherwise) influenced. Where did you take formal training (institution), if any? If self-taught Greek, you fail to realize the expertise of Robertson, Mounce, Wallace, etc. Greek is nuanced and a little knowledge is a dangerous thing.


How am I doing?:box:
 

godrulz

Well-known member
Hall of Fame
You are a snob who thinks Greek requires professional training.

God is timeless, he created eternity already.

No, one does not require professional training, but being self-taught rarely works due to the complexity and nuances of the language. There are no end to exegetical fallacies made by those who jump to simplistic, wrong conclusions. Even the experts/masters cannot agree on everything because much research is needed and there is often more than one possibility on any given issue.

God is not timeless. This is a Platonic, philosophical, Augustinian error. God is uncreated, no beginning, no end, but that does not preclude duration/succession/sequence (time) in His everlasting experiences/relations.

Eternity is uncreated as is God. Eternity by definition is not created and has no beginning/end. What is created is material universe, sentient beings, measures of time, etc., not time/eternity itself.:chew:
 

keypurr

Well-known member
eter·ni·ty noun \i-ˈtər-nə-tē\ : time without an end

: a state that comes after death and never ends

: time that seems to be without an end

Websters dictionary tells us that Eternity means time without an end, not time without a beginning.

Gen 1:1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

In the beginning there was ONLY GOD.
His son came later........so God was alone.
Hebrews, Colossians, says that God created his express image, his son.
And then all things were created through his son.

.
 

godrulz

Well-known member
Hall of Fame
Jn. 1; Phil. 2; Heb. 1; Col. 1, etc. show that Christ is uncreated Creator, not a creature made by God. The eternality/pre-existence/Deity of Christ that you deny is what separates you from biblical, historical, orthodox Christianity.
 

Lazy afternoon

LIFETIME MEMBER
LIFETIME MEMBER
Jn. 1; Phil. 2; Heb. 1; Col. 1, etc. show that Christ is uncreated Creator, not a creature made by God. The eternality/pre-existence/Deity of Christ that you deny is what separates you from biblical, historical, orthodox Christianity.

What separates you from truth is that Gods son is a man who began in a moment of time in the body of Mary and continued until He was fully grown in statue and wisdom and blessed with the indwelling of His Father, only permanently and fully after His resurrection.

That Gods son was in the heart of God before Jesus was born does not make Jesus into a second person pre-existent creator God.

LA
 

PneumaPsucheSoma

TOL Subscriber
I wouldn't waste my time arguing your silly "genealogies". Learn Jesus.

It's not "genealogies", and just by posting you did. LOLOL.

I've learned Jesus. That's why I'm not a Triadist claiming to be a DyoHypoTrin with an impotent three-souled god.

And the only actual Creedal Trinitrarian so far is AMR.
 

Cross Reference

New member
It's not "genealogies", and just by posting you did. LOLOL.

I've learned Jesus. That's why I'm not a Triadist claiming to be a DyoHypoTrin with an impotent three-souled god.

And the only actual Creedal Trinitrarian so far is AMR.

To the contrary, had you learned Jesus, you argument would be no argument.
 

PneumaPsucheSoma

TOL Subscriber
So, you affirm that Jesus is God Almighty, the one true God (Deity of Christ)?

LOL. Yes, in a majority of posts, including some addressed to you in discourse. Did you somehow miss that all this time?

God did not create eternity. Wrong assumptions lead to wrong conclusions. Eternity is everlasting time (duration/sequence/succession). Eternity and time are not created 'things', but concepts. Measures of time (sun, moon, stars, clocks) are created things, but should not be confused with fundamental, philosophical time/eternity.

Yeah, this is your inane and godless Process Theology speaking. What an abomination to God and truth. I won't even get started on the Open Theism stupidity.

Unitarians deny the Deity of Christ.

No kiddin'? LOL.

Your view is not trinitarian by your own definition.

My view is not DYOHYPOSTATIC Trinitarian. It's Trinitarian.

You are closer to modalism than biblical trinitarianism.

There isn't a hint of Modalism in my view whatsoever. Your subject measurements are irrelevant. You're a Triadist who doesn't even know your own O/orthodox doctrine; and you're an Open Theist who has NO idea about all the stuff in your Process Theology.

What church/denomination did you pastor in, pretty please? I once pastored in a Pentecostal church.

Southern Baptist. Not a fan.

ECF were philosophically (pagan and otherwise) influenced.

Not in the sense of deriving belief from pagans. They were Spirit-filled Christians. But they intentionally engaged in Greek semantics wars with Sophists, Gnostics, and others to combat outside influences attempting to hybridize the faith; all while beginning to develop an apologetic that would maintain Monotheism while accounting for F/S/HS.

Where did you take formal training (institution), if any?

All SBC institutions. All DyoHypoTrin influenced.

If self-taught Greek, you fail to realize the expertise of Robertson, Mounce, Wallace, etc. Greek is nuanced and a little knowledge is a dangerous thing.

It's the abuse of those nuances that is the foundation of all the DyoHypoTrin apologetics and exegesis. The biggest abuse is the John 17/John 1:1 referents. The next biggest abuse is the arthrous substantives in Matt. 28:19, or maybe 1John 5:7-8.

There aren't three hypostases in the Greek anyhwere or anyhow.

How am I doing?:box:

About par for a Triadist Open Theist with an impotent god, meaning abysmally overall. But I don't question your salvation, just your false ideologies.
 

PneumaPsucheSoma

TOL Subscriber
To the contrary, had you learned Jesus, you argument would be no argument.

To the contrary, had YOU learned Jesus, your argument would be no argument. (Seems like a nanny-nanny-boo-boo should go here after returning your bare assertion.)

I guess condescending, adamant drive-by declarations are the scope of your exegesis. Fail. Spoken like another true dogmatized and indoctrinted ideologogue.
 

PneumaPsucheSoma

TOL Subscriber
eter·ni·ty noun \i-ˈtər-nə-tē\ : time without an end

: a state that comes after death and never ends

: time that seems to be without an end

Websters dictionary tells us that Eternity means time without an end, not time without a beginning.

Hi, keypurr. Though Webster's is one of the primary etyomologically authorities for English, I'm not referring to English. I'm referring to adh in Hebrew (not olam); and aidios in Greek (not aionios).

English came later, and has developed separately. :)

Gen 1:1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

In the beginning there was ONLY GOD.
His son came later........so God was alone.
Hebrews, Colossians, says that God created his express image, his son.
And then all things were created through his son.

.

I agree with the bolded.
 

PneumaPsucheSoma

TOL Subscriber
What separates you from truth is that Gods son is a man who began in a moment of time in the body of Mary and continued until He was fully grown in statue and wisdom and blessed with the indwelling of His Father, only permanently and fully after His resurrection.

That Gods son was in the heart of God before Jesus was born does not make Jesus into a second person pre-existent creator God.

LA

I've been trying to glean your position. Adoptionist by some label? (Information quesiton.) :)
 

PneumaPsucheSoma

TOL Subscriber
Y,know... I've spent many years examining the various proposed doctrinal formulations for F/S/HS. What I see is an INternal struggle, rather than O/rothodoxy of a DyoHypoTrin doctrine with ALL others left on the outside. (And most professing DyoHypoTrins are Triadists anyway, but that's another point all its own for another post.)

If someone is a true Monotheist who professes YHWH as that one true and living God; and also professes the Son to be the Word that literally became flesh as Jesus Christ, the biblical and historical literal man; and that Jesus Christ was born of a virgin by the Holy Spirit without an earthly father; and that by His sinless life and shed blood on calvary, He atoned for sin and brought everlasting life to those who by grace have faith in His provision for salvation, redemption, justification, and sanctification; and that there was a physical bodily resurrection and ascension after the crucifixion with Him returning in like manner... That would seem to be the "qualifying" threshhold for salvific faith rather than the minutiae of doctrinal formulation.

I'm not compromising or universalizing in any manner or to any degree. Others who claim the Logos became another created celestial being as an angel before being a created man (JW); and those insisting there is no metaphysical realm and/or that F/S/HS are a plurality of multiple gods, especially if they were men or men can attain unto deity (LDS)... are doctrinally beyond the faith, as are all the World Religions, including those who esotericize the Christian faith as "God being the One Consciousness", etc.

The Father is God, who is YHWH. Jesus Christ is His Son. The Holy Spirit indwells believers. Jesus Christ died for our sin. He rose again and ascended. He's returning (or has returned, if you're a Preterist).

This would mean that several belief systems WITHIN the Christian faith qualify. Trinitarians, Binitarians, Arians, Sabellians, Unitarians, Adoptionists and a handful of others. No Docetists, Ebionites, etc.

I don't think that's too broad. It includes all who are contending for YHWH and Monotheism, while accounting for the Son and Holy Spirit in various ways.

The Church is NOT supposed to be an institution unto itself, just like the government is NOT supposed to be an institution unto itself. The Church is the saints, not a hierarchy or corporate entity apart from the saints themselves.

Those who have DEnominated themselves are ALL in divisional schizm. Many for good reasons of earnest contention for truth, but schizm nonetheless.

Protestants don't get to claim institutional status. And it doesn't matter. The RCC and/or EOC don't get to be the "only true Church".

It's not compromise to include a small and reasonable perimeter beyond one's own adamant doctrinal formulation as elgible for salvific faith according to the Word.

Too bad there isn't as much Gospel-sharing and enemy-fighting as there is in-fighting amongst YHWH-believing Monotheists who claim the blood of Jesus Christ is the only atonement for man's sin.

My own "hostilities" are directed primarily at Dyohypostatic Trinitarians for two reasons. They are the key central proponents of historically declaring everyone else as outside the faith. And most modern professing DyoHypoTrins are functionally or literally Triadists without even knowing it OR their own historical Creedal Trinity doctrine.

My opposition is responsive, not initiative. I'd relent if they would. ALL historical formulations are wrong, by degree. Nobody can anthematize anyone else.
 

Cross Reference

New member
To the contrary, had YOU learned Jesus, your argument would be no argument. (Seems like a nanny-nanny-boo-boo should go here after returning your bare assertion.)

I guess condescending, adamant drive-by declarations are the scope of your exegesis. Fail. Spoken like another true dogmatized and indoctrinted ideologogue.


What you posit isn't worth any more!
 
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