ECT Our triune God

[PneumaPsucheSoma]

If Jesus was God in any of His actions with regard to his temptations/testings/trials, he could never have redeemed mankind. Being in union with God did not necessitate Him being Divine anymore then we are made divine by being born again.

"That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me. . . . Iin them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me."
John 17:21,23 (KJV)

This heretical schismatic insistence disqualifies you from posting in the ECT section, including this thread.

 

[Lazy afternoon]

If Jesus was God in any of His actions with regard to his temptations/testings/trials, he could never have redeemed mankind. Being in union with God did not necessitate Him being Divine anymore then we are made divine by being born again.

"That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me. . . . Iin them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me."
John 17:21,23 (KJV)

Yes, Jesus was made a man in the image of God, after being born from Mary, as the seed of David.

(Never the seed of God)

LA

 

[fzappa13]

There is. God administers His grace, and they have access by faith into that grace wherein they stand. The children don't saved themselves by their faith. Salvation is not something man does.

The opportunity to avail yourself of the gift of grace through faith that Jesus was who He said He was began at the cross and ends at Christ's return. What about everyone else. What of the children who never formulated this faith in their head? What of the children?

 

[Lon]

Yes, Jesus was made a man in the image of God, after being born from Mary, as the seed of David.

(Never the seed of God)

LA

Not really part of this thread or supportive of it.

 

[Lon]

The opportunity to avail yourself of the gift of grace through faith that Jesus was who He said He was began at the cross and ends at Christ's return. What about everyone else. What of the children who never formulated this faith in their head? What of the children?

Matthew 19:14

 

[Lazy afternoon]

Lon,

Of course you do not support it.

It is scripture.

LA

 

[Cross Reference]

Yes, Jesus was made a man in the image of God, after being born from Mary, as the seed of David.

(Never the seed of God)

LA

C'mon, LA. Wake up! Jesus, the man, had to be [*by and of] the Seed of God! How else could a sinless man enter into the race of Adam from the outside? Sin or Sinlessness follows the blood line of the father, not the mother. Jesus was conceived by the Holy Spirit. The important thing to keep in mind is that, as with Adam was the whole human race made subject to his decisions, by His conception was the whole of the Godhead make subject to the decisions of Jesus. made vulnerable to human "Vanity" per Rom.8:20 KJV, to do things his way. In this was Jesus trusted completely by His Father because of the great Love and worship Jesus had for Him that brought to him the JOY and Vision of His Father's intention. Though Jesus would shed tears and sweat as of drops of blood before it all came to the end, He never waivered in His allegiance to His Father by which He overcame the world. He became the pattern for life for us all.

[*by] By because of the needed sinless conception.

[*of] Being of God assured Him of the Holy Spirit indwelling much as it does for those born again.

 

[Lazy afternoon]

C'mon, LA. Wake up! Jesus, the man, had to be by the Seed of God! How else could a sinless man enter into the race of Adam from the outside? Sin or Sinlessness follows the blood line of the father, not the mother. Jesus was conceived by the Holy Spirit.

The Holy Spirit has no blood.

The Bible says He is the seed of David.

The important thing to keep in mind is that by His conception was the whole of the Godhead make subject his decisions, made vulnerable to temptation to do things his way. In this was Jesus was trusted completely by His Father because of the great Love and worship Jesus had for Him that brought to him the JOY and Vision of His Father's intention. Though Jesus would shed tears and sweat as of drops of blood before it all came to the end, He never waivered in His allegiance to Father. He became the pattern for life for us all.

Jesus did waiver, but He was shown how to get through it by the fathering of His Father in experience.

Your idea is that Jesus could not be tempted to sin.

LA

 

[Cross Reference]

The Holy Spirit has no blood.


The Bible says He is the seed of David.

Yes. It also says Adam was the son of God. Now where do you want to go from there.

By your shortsightedness you are saying Jesus was conceived and thus born in sin. His blood was dirty blood and thus could not redeem mankind. Do you really want to be saying that?

Jesus did waiver, but He was shown how to get through it by the fathering of His Father in experience.

He never waivered. He feared!!

Your idea is that Jesus could not be tempted to sin.

Not by anything I wrote can you conclude that. Again, Wake up!!

 

[Lazy afternoon]

Yes. It also says Adam was the son of God. Now where do you want to go from there.

Adam was too.

Luk 3:38 Which was the son of Enos, which was the son of Seth, which was the son of Adam, which was the son of God.

By your shortsightedness you are saying Jesus was conceived and thus born in sin. His blood was dirty blood and thus could not redeem mankind. Do you really want to be saying that?

No.

You are adding something to the account which is not there.

He never waivered. He feared!!

Wrong again.

Heb 4:15 For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin.

Luk 22:42 Saying, Father, if thou be willing, remove this cup from me: nevertheless not my will, but thine, be done.

Not by anything I wrote can you conclude that. Again, Wake up!!

Your manner tells me you do not know the truth.

Making false judgments of another is not the way of those who know Christ in a close manner, or of those who seek to honor Christ.

LA

 

[Cross Reference]

Adam was too.
Luk 3:38 Which was the son of Enos, which was the son of Seth, which was the son of Adam, which was the son of God.

So whose seed was he of? David or some other man as well? Whose?

No.

You are adding something to the account which is not there.

No, I am not but, you are if you say the seed of Jesus was not of God but Daivid's alone.

Wrong again.

Not so. Gesthsemany was all about eleviating His human fear. How great was his fear that Jesus' tears would be as "great drops of blood"?

Heb 4:15 For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin.

Was He a great high priest when in Gethemany on the night before His crucifixion? Was interceeding on our behalf or His own when He was relinquishing His will to HIS FATHER?

Luk 22:42 Saying, Father, if thou be willing, remove this cup from me: nevertheless not my will, but thine, be done.

You wrote it, I ddin't. So what was Jesus afraid of? What sustained Him in His time of fear was the same as what sustained when He was in the wilderness for 40 days.

Your manner tells me you do not know the truth.

Your replies tell me you don't want to know the truth.

Making false judgments of another is not the way of those who know Christ in a close manner, or of those who seek to honor Christ. LA

What false statements?

 

[fzappa13]

Matthew 19:14

Well, evidently something else must be read into that passage as well; otherwise you've got doctrinally unlearned kids sneaking into the kingdom and mucking things up and we can't very well have that.



Can we?

 

[PneumaPsucheSoma]

Well, evidently something else must be read into that passage as well; otherwise you've got doctrinally unlearned kids sneaking into the kingdom and mucking things up and we can't very well have that.

Can we?

Once again, the common misunderstanding that it is believing (the verb) that saves rather than faith (the noun).

Children have this qualitative functionality. It is adults who outgrow such sincere and simple functionality, tainted by their own hearts and minds.

 

[patrick jane]

Well, evidently something else must be read into that passage as well; otherwise you've got doctrinally unlearned kids sneaking into the kingdom and mucking things up and we can't very well have that.



Can we?

It doesn't matter if your "learned" and 75 years old, you are a CHILD of God

 

[Cross Reference]

It doesn't matter if your "learned" and 75 years old, you are a CHILD of God

Legally? No question. Howver, It is not His intention to leave us in that state. Read 1 John 1,2 and 3.
OMT: Children are teachable. Jesus could well have been inferring that by using them as an example. I rather think so.

 

[Lon]

Luk 22:42 Saying, Father, if thou be willing, remove this cup from me: nevertheless not my will, but thine, be done.

Your manner tells me you do not know the truth.

Making false judgments of another is not the way of those who know Christ in a close manner, or of those who seek to honor Christ.

LA

You mean like hijacking a thread that has nothing to do with denial of the Triune view and posting against it? It is not allowed here LA. I've shown an incredible amount of patience, even these last two pages. Please stop. Discuss our view. Ask questions, sure. Promote Unit-Arianism? :nono: There are about 4 other threads, right now, you can post this kind of thing in, not here.

 

[Cross Reference]

Jesus did waiver, but He was shown how to get through it by the fathering of His Father in experience.

"Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil; And deliver them who through fear of death were all their lifetime subject to *bondage."
Hebrews 2:14-15 (KJV)

*per Romans 8:20 KJV by which Adam had sealed the whole human race to vanity also known as "self preservation" . . . fear of dying.

Gethsemany was proof of the fear Jesus experienced having taken on the full likeness of man, the "seed of Abraham" for their deliverance.

 

[fzappa13]

Once again, the common misunderstanding that it is believing (the verb) that saves rather than faith (the noun).

Children have this qualitative functionality. It is adults who outgrow such sincere and simple functionality, tainted by their own hearts and minds.

I'm not sure I understand the distinction your are trying to make as the two seem so intertwined.

 

[Lon]

Hello CR, I think we are at the end of this discussion.

Gethsemany was proof of the fear Jesus experienced having taken on the full likeness of man, the "seed of Abraham" for their deliverance.

As to the Lord Jesus Christ being fully man, there is no contest. The heresy you are espousing is however against the creeds and councils, against scripture passages (against the Lord Jesus Christ being Yesterday, Today, and Forever the same).

We are about at the end of this road because the links and discussion will only become cyclic at this point. By way of wrap up here are a few posts with related reading and then we need to get back to the OP which is the orthodoxy of the Triune view and it's discussion.
As Ask Mr. Religion reminded us:

Yes, returning to the focus of the thread is i order.

In the spirit of the thread's focus, some background readings for review:

View attachment 24125

View attachment 24124

AMR

Along with his ensuing post here.

This is part of the Kenosis problem and why it is considered heresy (both of these are fairly short and quick reads).

It is time to wrap up the discussion here.

No. Extreme Kenoticism has been heresy and anathema for many centuries. It's also the most extreme form of Nestorianism, which has also been heresy and anathema for many centuries. And Kenoticism is also a form of Semi-Arianism or Semi-Unitarianism, while also resembling Adoptionism. All heresy and anathema for many centuries.

I will thank you, CR, for helping flesh out the problems of your view as Trinitarians understand it, for all, that any can read and appreciate those differences, and then read the scriptures and links. Thanks and lets move on to other topics. -Lon

 

[PneumaPsucheSoma]

I'm not sure I understand the distinction your are trying to make as the two seem so intertwined.

Yes, few are. That's why there is so much debate and conjecture by so many from their various perspectives.