ECT Our triune God

[PneumaPsucheSoma]

You are a bigger fool than I gave you credit for being.


You should explain what you believe to such lack to the S.A.Indians in Christ who have no idea they are missing out on what you alone espouse as being the only way to Christ Jesus. Perhaps you should consider going there with your Greek lexicion in hand to straighten them out in their primitve believing for son-ship in the Father. Try telling them there is no such relationship available to them because they haven't swung on your gate. I hope that "nonplusses" you to a little self examination..

To whom much is given, much is required. You can't validly use primitives in a foreign land to excuse your blatant and unrecalcitrant schismatic heresies, to which you cling in stubbornness of the pride of life.

They're not Hegelian Kenoticists. Their lack of understanding is not your replacement doctrines that ignore historical exegetical information that has been available all your pitiful pseudo-Pentecostal life.

And they may or may not have a viable salvific faith. How would you even know what they believe? You're making an abstract rhetorical and theoretical projected argument. It's absurd and has no bearing on orthodox doctrine. They're not lobbying desperately for their ignorance. You're throwing them under a bus you're driving yourself.

You've spent since 1947 in the Pentecostal movement, being fed concepts and many other fallacies. Those SA Indians haven't. Theirs is a lack. Yours is a replacement and supplantation. Big difference. Huge.

 

[Cross Reference]

To whom much is given, much is required.

Well, I guess I owe an apology. I apologize for expecting more from you.

Read the book "Bruchko" and learn; be amazed at what God can do without your permission. Google it for a fly leaf summary.

 

[PneumaPsucheSoma]

Well, I guess I owe an apology. I apologize for expecting more from you.

Yeah, you always presume you're the one "to whom much is given". That's what that puffed up gnosis knowledge will do. You shoulda spent your wasted pseudo-Christian neo-Pentecostal life in having love abounding in epignosis knowledge instead.

Read the book "Bruchko" and learn; be amazed at what God can do without your permission. Google it for a fly leaf summary.

No. This is your problem. Books and the words and experiences of men over scripture in its valid translation. I couldn't care less about your "books about" by men who are likely extreme heretics just like you, denying the historical Christology of the Faith.

 

[fzappa13]

I'm not ducking. I don't know what your point is other than to insist the lowest common denominator is the litmus test for salvation. The less you know the "more" saved you are.

The Gospel is ontological and epistemological. One's ontology can be, and is, changed by God without extensive initial awareness beyond certain basics. But no one should stay at that point and excuse away their false simplicity and ignorance.

The quality of faith is like that of a child. Pure and wholly persuaded, without fear or doubting. A total yieldedness of oneself, which is ontological. That inner ontology WILL include and progress to inward epistemology, which will always include outward economy of action and establishment of methodologies based on the entirety of it all.

Does that address what you're referring to? If not, please elaborate.

Oh, it addresses it but it doesn't answer it. If children must understand Koine to be saved then they are lost. If not, then there is another way in.

 

[Cross Reference]

Yeah, you always presume you're the one "to whom much is given". That's what that puffed up gnosis knowledge will do. You shoulda spent your wasted pseudo-Christian neo-Pentecostal life in having love abounding in epignosis knowledge instead.



No. This is your problem. Books and the words and experiences of men over scripture in its valid translation. I couldn't care less about your "books about" by men who are likely extreme heretics just like you, denying the historical Christology of the Faith.

You and your Greek is all you need. That has been made very clear. So sad.

 

[PneumaPsucheSoma]

Oh, it addresses it but it doesn't answer it. If children must understand Koine to be saved then they are lost. If not, then there is another way in.

There is. God administers His grace, and they have access by faith into that grace wherein they stand. The children don't saved themselves by their faith. Salvation is not something man does.

 

[PneumaPsucheSoma]

You and your Greek is all you need. That has been made very clear. So sad.

The Greek text is the inspired Word, and the Word made flesh is the last Adam made a quickening Spirit; so yes it's all I need. The Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit are quite sufficient.

 

[Lazy afternoon]

1 Corinthians 16:22-24 KJV -

yes.

LA

 

[Cross Reference]

The Greek text is the inspired Word, and the Word made flesh is the last Adam made a quickening Spirit; so yes it's all I need. The Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit are quite sufficient.

And you, have none of them. What's the Greek understanding for "deception"?

Understand this: When anyone lifts what they believe they possess higher in their heart than the simplicity of "knowing" "Jesus Christ and Him crucified" they do NOT have any part of Him because "knowing" about Him is far short of actually "knowing" Him. BTW, I found that understanding in an a book written in English. . .with no Greek footnotes. However, it was victorian English. How'd I do?

 

[PneumaPsucheSoma]

And you, have none of them. What's the Greek understanding for "deception"?

Understand this: When anyone lifts what they believe they possess higher in their heart than the simplicity of "knowing" "Jesus Christ and Him crucified" they do NOT have any part of Him because "knowing" about Him is far short of actually "knowing" Him. BTW, I found that understanding in an a book written in English. . .with no Greek footnotes. However, it was victorian English. How'd I do?

YOU'RE A HEGELIAN KENOTICIST, YOU STUBBORN MORON. IT'S BEEN HERESY AND ANATHEMA FOR NEARLY TWO MILLENNIA.

So take the advice of this article and quit advocating your anti-Christ heretical Christology and all that comes from it.

(And notice you had to post NON-scripture to even make that point at all. And it was by yet another idiot Englishizer who presumed the Greek word "haplotes" translated as "simplicity" means a lack a complexity. The irony is that YOU and THIS WRITING are the deception of duplicity, which is the OPPOSITE of haplotes.)

You've been a heretical schismatic all of your paltry pseudo-Christian neo-Pentecostal life.

 

[Cross Reference]

I believe I now stand justified in my opinion of you that you fell out of your crib one too many times.. Thank you.

 

[Lon]

LOL!! Ditto! LOL!! You don't know a thing about me nor have you inquired and don't care because everyone is less than you anyway. So what's the point, right?, you obviously have no relationship to Christ Jesus.

Imho, this is drawing first-blood (or ensuing as the case may be). I don't think this is our call to make, especially over the internet. We aren't judges and will all stand before our Maker. We will also be held accountable for every idle word. Be purposeful instead of reactionary? :think:

<what conceit> How old are you, anyway? To me, you are just a kid. But that is just my educated opinion based upon what you have displayed on this forum. Gnostism fits you as best I can figure. Your claims don't speak allegiance to Christ but rather the sureness of your education in christology. Sad shame because you can't go any further.

An education in Christology is no shame. The Bereans were more noble because of study. More noble than those around them for it.

The friction between the Jews and Samaritans was similar to this conflict. Jesus both used a parable with Samaritans and spoke to them.

This back and forth isn't really a part of this thread's intent. I suppose posturing is one way to handle the conflict between Triune views. It isn't necessary, however. Our words stand as they are without us needing to prop them up, other than further clarification and explanation, only.

In Him

 

[Lon]

Oh, it addresses it but it doesn't answer it. If children must understand Koine to be saved then they are lost. If not, then there is another way in.

I think I see where you are coming from and it too is important to the thread. Can a kid understand the triune view? It is mysterious and the best that was done for me as a child was water: liquid,solid,gas and an egg: shell,white,yolk. I think I could grasp it was only analogy and pretty crude, but 'mystery' was given. I think a child then starts categorizing scripture as he/she grows, hopefully while they are reading it for themselves. So, I think, to address your first question: a trust in Christ covers a multiple of sins and shortcomings.
Heresy? We avoid it ourselves, and are called to oust or have naught to do with heretics and false-teachers. God will have to deal with the heretic one on one. I'm not sure it is wise to tell all strongly willful heretics they are going to hell. Jesus did say true worshippers must worship in Spirit and Truth. Again, I think it's God's call at that point and we are just obedient to our instructions. -Lon

 

[PneumaPsucheSoma]

I think I see where you are coming from and it too is important to the thread. Can a kid understand the triune view? It is mysterious and the best that was done for me as a child was water: liquid,solid,gas and an egg: shell,white,yolk. I think I could grasp it was only analogy and pretty crude, but 'mystery' was given. I think a child then starts categorizing scripture as he/she grows, hopefully while they are reading it for themselves. So, I think, to address your first question: a trust in Christ covers a multiple of sins and shortcomings.
Heresy? We avoid it ourselves, and are called to oust or have naught to do with heretics and false-teachers. God will have to deal with the heretic one on one. I'm not sure it is wise to tell all strongly willful heretics they are going to hell. Jesus did say true worshippers must worship in Spirit and Truth. Again, I think it's God's call at that point and we are just obedient to our instructions. -Lon

The question is "can an extreme Kenoticist worship God in spirit and in truth?", especially if that Kenoticist is corrected time and again by those who are longsuffering in doing so while they refuse to hear the truth that they must worship in.

When I see extreme cognitive dissonance and beligerent stubbornness for one's own false doctrine when confronted with truth, it gravely concerns me for their salvific faith.

 

[PneumaPsucheSoma]

I think I see where you are coming from and it too is important to the thread. Can a kid understand the triune view? It is mysterious and the best that was done for me as a child was water: liquid,solid,gas and an egg: shell,white,yolk. I think I could grasp it was only analogy and pretty crude, but 'mystery' was given. I think a child then starts categorizing scripture as he/she grows, hopefully while they are reading it for themselves. So, I think, to address your first question: a trust in Christ covers a multiple of sins and shortcomings.
Heresy? We avoid it ourselves, and are called to oust or have naught to do with heretics and false-teachers. God will have to deal with the heretic one on one. I'm not sure it is wise to tell all strongly willful heretics they are going to hell. Jesus did say true worshippers must worship in Spirit and Truth. Again, I think it's God's call at that point and we are just obedient to our instructions. -Lon

My question is more along the lines of "Why are adults, who don't have the heart and faith of a child as illustrated in the scriptural example, always referring to children?"

 

[Lon]

The question is "can an extreme Kenoticist worship God in spirit and in truth?", especially if that Kenoticist is corrected time and again by those who are longsuffering in doing so while they refuse to hear the truth that they must worship in.

When I see extreme cognitive dissonance and beligerent stubbornness for one's own false doctrine when confronted with truth, it gravely concerns me for their salvific faith.

I agree. It was worth a moment of this thread to elucidate it and, as example, discuss both the history and why it is considered heresy. We must/necessarily leave those who eschew councils and other godly men, to their own private counsel with the warnings given. They are in their own hands and will stand before their Maker. We rightly ask them to leave the church and even this thread, however. Exclusively Christian carries with it an agreement not to be disruptive, contentious, and to hold to orthodox doctrines.

 

[Cross Reference]

When I see extreme cognitive dissonance and beligerent stubbornness for one's own false doctrine when confronted with truth, it gravely concerns me for their salvific faith.

I doubt that. However, therein is your problem. You can't see which has allowed your conceit to rob you of pleasant experiences and it will continue because you have no vision from God.

 

[Cross Reference]

An education in Christology is no shame. The Bereans were more noble because of study. More noble than those around them for it.

I never stated nor implied it was. So what are you saying other than trying to insinuate I believe that it is.

 

[PneumaPsucheSoma]

I agree. It was worth a moment of this thread to elucidate it and, as example, discuss both the history and why it is considered heresy. We must/necessarily leave those who eschew councils and other godly men, to their own private counsel with the warnings given. They are in their own hands and will stand before their Maker. We rightly ask them to leave the church and even this thread, however. Exclusively Christian carries with it an agreement not to be disruptive, contentious, and to hold to orthodox doctrines.

Yes. But there's also another series of paradoxes involved with that to which you have referred.

If someone rejects the results of Ecumenical Councils and the Patristics and those who came after the Fathers, then what foundation of doctrine can they rightly stand on?

It's one thing to reject corruptions of orthopraxy and eschew certain selected tertiary peripherals. It's quite another to toss everyone under the bus who formulated and declared doctrines that one would attempt to affirm after doing so.

The Trinity doctrine has some fairly broad latitude, but it has very strict boundaries in another sense. And to arrogantly and ignorantly prefer the resulting late innovations in Christology from the most despicable and influential of all Theosophists through 19th-century Liberal Philosophers posing as Theologians (Extreme Kenoticism) to Chalcedonian Christology (and the necessary anathemas), then one's rejection of the early Latin heritage of the Faith is beyond laughable.

The eternal uncreated uninterrupted continuous ontological divinity of our Lord is not up for grabs to toss out with Kenotic technicalities that re-introduce extreme Nestorianism layered over a form of Adoptionism. It's a multi-fold heretical schism, regardless of the timeline in history.

 

[Cross Reference]

If Jesus was God in any of His actions with regard to his temptations/testings/trials, he could never have redeemed mankind. Being in union with God did not necessitate Him being Divine anymore then we are made divine by being born again.

"That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me. . . . Iin them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me."
John 17:21,23 (KJV)