ECT MADists don't follow Paul

Cross Reference

Cross Reference

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patrick jane said:
You're really annoying, where did anybody say we are the dispensers of God's grace ? We are living in the dispensation of grace given first to Paul. Try to make some sense when you post.
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Annoying my ... .You can't be more wrong about Paul, so quick with your upperhanded non-understanding attitude. Paul preaching the gospel of Jesus Christ is ALL you should be focussed on but that you reject as being some sort of incomplete gospel. That's crazy!
 
Cross Reference

Cross Reference

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Right Divider said:
Per se? LOL

You say that He didn't but Paul says that He did. I believe the Bible.

Eph 3:2 (AKJV/PCE)​
(3:2) If ye have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God which is given me to you-ward:

​
If you would like to show us all where any other apostle makes this claim, that would be great.
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So yu believe it to be something more than what he purposed to convey, so what? What does it get you even if you are correct? Are you better off than any other Christian who "doesn't get it" as you think they shouuld?
 
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Interplanner

Well-known member
Right Divider said:
Per se? LOL

You say that He didn't but Paul says that He did. I believe the Bible.

Eph 3:2 (AKJV/PCE)​
(3:2) If ye have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God which is given me to you-ward:

​
If you would like to show us all where any other apostle makes this claim, that would be great.
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Yes, per se (as you are thinking).

The 'house' or 'vineyard' of God had certain rules until the son arrived. Now that he has come and revealed truly what the owner is like, and that there is a different arrangement with the workers, there is a new 'oikonomia.' Paul happens to be one of those workers. There are others. But because of the dramatic background of Paul--starting from a persecutor--he is one of the main spokespersons. Not that he is the only one, just the one who sees it most vividly. Vivid enough to say 'you don't make laws (about the fruit of the Spirit)'--the Spirit just grows it in you by your dwelling on Christ. It is the new way of the Spirit, not the way of the letter.
 
D

Danoh

New member
Interplanner said:
Yes, per se (as you are thinking).

The 'house' or 'vineyard' of God had certain rules until the son arrived. Now that he has come and revealed truly what the owner is like, and that there is a different arrangement with the workers, there is a new 'oikonomia.' Paul happens to be one of those workers. There are others. But because of the dramatic background of Paul--starting from a persecutor--he is one of the main spokespersons. Not that he is the only one, just the one who sees it most vividly. Vivid enough to say 'you don't make laws (about the fruit of the Spirit)'--the Spirit just grows it in you by your dwelling on Christ. It is the new way of the Spirit, not the way of the letter.
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There you have it; the wisdom of men.
 
Right Divider

Right Divider

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Interplanner said:
Yes, per se (as you are thinking).

The 'house' or 'vineyard' of God had certain rules until the son arrived. Now that he has come and revealed truly what the owner is like, and that there is a different arrangement with the workers, there is a new 'oikonomia.' Paul happens to be one of those workers. There are others. But because of the dramatic background of Paul--starting from a persecutor--he is one of the main spokespersons. Not that he is the only one, just the one who sees it most vividly. Vivid enough to say 'you don't make laws (about the fruit of the Spirit)'--the Spirit just grows it in you by your dwelling on Christ. It is the new way of the Spirit, not the way of the letter.
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Paul is an AMBASSADOR for Christ. That means that he is in a FOREIGN land (in this case earth, since he is "seated in heavenly places").

God gave Paul a new and different 'oikonomia.' It does NOT invalid God's other dispensations, but is something distinct. Paul certainly confirmed the kingdom, but did not claim to be a part of it in the SAME sense as Jesus' TWELVE apostle for the TWELVE tribes of Israel.
 
Right Divider

Right Divider

Body part
Cross Reference said:
I interpreted it from what I read just as you do when reading the scriptures. Now, am I dumb?
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Once AGAIN, I ask HOW you could come to that conclusion? and them condemn me as someone claiming to be God.

That's an extremely hash accusation.

You should have at least asked my to clarify instead accusing me of blaspheme!

So yes, you are dumb.
 
Cross Reference

Cross Reference

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Right Divider said:
Once AGAIN, I ask HOW you could come to that conclusion? and them condemn me as someone claiming to be God.

That's an extremely hash accusation.

You should have at least asked my to clarify instead accusing me of blaspheme!

So yes, you are dumb.
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It really isn't blasphemess to believe we are to propagate the grace of God, is it? I mean, if you are in the process of knowing Him what should be the automatic activity on display from the Christian who understands what the process is all about? But without being in such a process, obviously without knowledge to desire it, dispensing God's grace would be an act of presumption, don't you think?
 
Right Divider

Right Divider

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Interplanner said:
2 Cor 3-5, the ministers of the new covenant. Don't be splitting hairs on me; its the same thing. The time of salvation has come, the day of grace is upon us.

Look at the whole of 2 Cor, as I said before. The friction with the impostor apostles. They are not offering grace, but "we" are--all those who preach the Gospel.
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So many people try to use this ONE verse to TRY to put those who are saved under the gospel of the grace of God, back under a covenant. The gospel of the grace of God requires no covenant. It is God's grace freely given to all that accept it.

Interplanner said:
You really need to get much more background in all the moving parts of the 'machinery'.

Paul always worked in a team. He was always training people to do what he did in other places, too. Look at the opening of I Cor and all the people named there. They were all teaching the grace of God in justification by Christ in the Gospel.
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Yes, without a covenant -- free gift.
 
Right Divider

Right Divider

Body part
Cross Reference said:
It really isn't blasphemess to believe we are to propagate the grace of God, is it? I mean, if you are in the process of knowing Him what should be the automatic activity on display from the Christian who understands what the process is all about? But without being in such a process, obviously without knowledge to desire it, dispensing God's grace would be an act of presumption, don't you think?
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I cannot follow your wanderings.

The gospel of the grace of God is NOT the same as the gospel of the kingdom. God gave Paul a dispensation of the gospel and THAT gospel is the gospel of the grace of God and NOT the gospel of the kingdom.
 
SaulToPaul 2

SaulToPaul 2

Well-known member
Right Divider said:
So many people try to use this ONE verse to TRY to put those who are saved under the gospel of the grace of God, back under a covenant. The gospel of the grace of God requires no covenant.
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Indeed. That bugs me as well.

First, he was writing to the Corinthians who he found in a Jewish synagogue.

Second, he explained to them that the spirit of the new testament was the righteousness of God.
He ministered it through his gospel.

He was not telling the Corinthians that they're under the letter of the New Covenant.
 
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Danoh

New member
SaulToPaul said:
Indeed. That bugs me as well.

First, he was writing to the Corinthians who he found in a Jewish synagogue.

Second, he explained to them that the spirit of the new testament was the righteousness of God.
He ministered it through his gospel.

He was not telling the Corinthians that they're under the letter of the New Covenant.
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Those second and third statements there - profound.

At the same time, reading your often simple posts, I just as often get the sense of Andy saying something too simple for Barney to grasp as is.

A simplicity further lost sight of as to its' profoundness by the fact that Barney is often already on his own course by the time Andy attempts to shed his intended light.

A course on Barney's part far too often a far too hopelessly fool one to turn back from until it has wreaked its unnecessary havoc to Barney's hysterical exposure, once more, lol

In this, I imagine many looking like Barney in that day; their hair a mess from what it turns out had been an unnecessary perspective...
 
Cross Reference

Cross Reference

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Right Divider said:
I cannot follow your wanderings.

The gospel of the grace of God is NOT the same as the gospel of the kingdom. God gave Paul a dispensation of the gospel and THAT gospel is the gospel of the grace of God and NOT the gospel of the kingdom.
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God gave Paul no such thing.

Who has bewitched you to believe that which now ensnares you? How does it profit you?
 
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Danoh

New member
Cross Reference said:
God gave Paul no such thing.

Who has bewitched you to believe that which now ensnares you? How does it profit you?
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Yo, would be bright light in a bright room...

1 Corinthians 9:17 For if I do this thing willingly, I have a reward: but if against my will, a dispensation of the gospel is committed unto me.
 
I

Interplanner

Well-known member
Cross Reference said:
God gave Paul no such thing.

Who has bewitched you to believe that which now ensnares you? How does it profit you?
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There aren't 2 gospels. The English expression 'gospel of the kingdom' clouds the fact that the possessive genetive is used which is properly: the gospel that belongs to the kingdom (not about it).
 
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