Did you read my two comments above? You know, with the argument for the Holy Spirit not being just some force of God's? You should read it if you haven't.
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Jesus Christ is God Almighty, Jehovah
- Thread starter Jerry Shugart
- Start date
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freelight
Eclectic Theosophist
More on Personality........
More on Personality........
In a response to Right Divider, I address the issue of 'personality' of Deity here
- just added more and edited my commentary.
I dont have much more to add to my former discourse, but say the issue of 'personality' is a wonderful subject. It would be fundamental to accept God existing as and operating as a 'personality', having within his infinite Being other personalities as well, since after all, He is the originator of personality, and the Father of all personalities. Other religious writing offer more insight into this subject than just the Bible alone, with which one may expand their consciousness. This is something both Unitarians and Trinitarians ought to consider, since our finite conceptions of Deity can only go so far and cannot wholly limit the INFINITE itSelf.
More on Personality........
In a response to Right Divider, I address the issue of 'personality' of Deity here
- just added more and edited my commentary.I dont have much more to add to my former discourse, but say the issue of 'personality' is a wonderful subject. It would be fundamental to accept God existing as and operating as a 'personality', having within his infinite Being other personalities as well, since after all, He is the originator of personality, and the Father of all personalities. Other religious writing offer more insight into this subject than just the Bible alone, with which one may expand their consciousness. This is something both Unitarians and Trinitarians ought to consider, since our finite conceptions of Deity can only go so far and cannot wholly limit the INFINITE itSelf.
Right Divider
Body part
Since you're too dumb to understand simple logic, there is no use in trying to communication with you.
Plurality of persons could be anything from 2 to a host of heavenly beings...including angels of different rank
everready
New member
Your right about Moses talking to Jesus as Jesus testified to in..
John 8:58 Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am.
and God is indeed everywhere..
Acts 17:24 God that made the world and all things therein, seeing that he is Lord of heaven and earth, dwelleth not in temples made with hands;
25 Neither is worshipped with men's hands, as though he needed any thing, seeing he giveth to all life, and breath, and all things;
26 And hath made of one blood all nations of men for to dwell on all the face of the earth, and hath determined the times before appointed, and the bounds of their habitation;
27 That they should seek the Lord, if haply they might feel after him, and find him, though he be not far from every one of us:
28 For in him we live, and move, and have our being; as certain also of your own poets have said, For we are also his offspring.
everready
Jerry Shugart
Well-known member
When we look at what is said here it is evident that the plurality exists with God:
"And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness...So God created man in his own image" (Gen.1:26-27).
In verse 27 it is only God who created man. So in verse 26 the pronouns "us" and "our" must be in regard to God because it is "us" who made man.
So it is obvious that the pronoun "us" does not refer to angels of different rank.
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Jerry Shugart
Well-known member
Sorry. I thought that I was addressing someone else!
And probably smarter than a cow. My experience has been that no one can teach algebra to a cow.
:cow:
http://americanrtl.org/what-does-the-bible-say-about-abortion#image
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The heavenly hosts were a war...1/3 were cast out and banished from heaven...God was being accused as being a no good god and Satan wished to usurp Him...
A good general or coach often speaks collectively as in "let us go kick some..." Love too causes no ego and speaks collectively as in "let us make a family..."
God is both at war with Satan and perfect inclusive Love...
Adam himself was included in tha "let us make"...as he was given the final job of naming things...names are important
Any good artist loses himself in creation and says to himself "what are we doing today" or even speaks in third person lol...
"Let us go down and see" was said after the flood about the tower...did they have to literally go or couldn't they see from the throne of God?
Was it God himself that Abraham fed and washed His feet...which of the three did Jacob wrestled with...the whole team?...he won btw
Moses asked what is your name and it was said "I am" not "we are" so hmmm
All good stuff to think about...
Yes three...interesting number...was hoping for a name of the Holy Spirit...
"Let Us" could be two...none good but God His son said...our brother...as we too are sons...but not as Spirit filled as He...
Jerry Shugart
Well-known member
I see nothing but bad stuff to think about!
Right Divider
Body part
MAKING and NAMING are TWO different things.
With "logic" like that I can see why you do not understand much of anything.
musterion
Well-known member
If you are referring to a personal name there is not one. Electrical power doesn't have a name, neither does hydraulic power, or pneumatic power, or nuclear power, etc.
What is referred to as a holy spirit is simply a spiritual power, the power by which the heavens and earth were created and Jesus was conceived.
So can you lie to power? Does a power talk? Can power be angry at people?
NO!!!
We've already refuted your argument that the Holy Spirit is just a force or power of God, so stop using it.
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No, But you can lie to God!
Acts 5:3-4 King James Version (KJV)
3 But Peter said, Ananias, why hath Satan filled thine heart to lie to the Holy Ghost, and to keep back part of the price of the land?
4 Whiles it remained, was it not thine own? and after it was sold, was it not in thine own power? why hast thou conceived this thing in thine heart? thou hast not lied unto men, but unto God.
Where does the Father live?
Ephesians 4:6 one God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.
Can you lie to the Father?
:cow:
So what is the holy spirit? Is he a person? Is he the father of Jesus?
freelight
Eclectic Theosophist
Holy Breath, Divine Energy, Power..................
Holy Breath, Divine Energy, Power..................
Hi JR,
I addressed the issue of personality and 'God' here, earlier. I link my previous commentary which addresses the issue in its many dimensions. Considering the points I make is important here, if you take a preconceived mindset of interpreting this thru a Trinitarian belief-system or not. Since the Holy Spirit is the Spirit of God, whether you personalize Him/Her or not....the 'Spirit' can possess 'personality' and will relay or express the personality of God because 'God' and His Spirit are indivisible. There are references as well as the Spirit being poured out, coming upon people, this indicating the dynamic power or breath of God in operation, so the Spirit works in various manifestations or gifts, as well as various anointings of power.
An 'anointed one' is also one upon whom the Spirit of God comes, the oil being smeared onto the person, permeating him, empowering him for service (whether a king, priest or prophet). So there is obviously a non-personal spiritual energetic presence of the Spirit of God as well. Only as some 'presence' is actually expressing and relating to other beings in a personal way, could we say it has 'personality' of some kind. Otherwise, the common notion among orthodox or evangelical to say "the Holy Spirit is a person" is fine, but its more a matter of 'faith' and 'doctrinal assumption' that this is so, beyond what one 'imagines' or 'assumes' to be any kind of 'proof' that a person called the 'Holy Spirit' actually exists. No one knows beyond what one experiences subjectively. Again,...there may be a Spirit or spirits of God at work in any given situation, for angels too have some kind of 'personality', being personal beings as well. So in an event where multiple spirits of God are converging or at work, you'll have a great company of personalities engaging. At the same time if there are any manifestations present,...you'll have demonstrations of spiritual power, diverse movements, special operations, inner and outer transformations of spirit, soul and body. Being in the glory-manifestations of 'God' is pretty awesome, if you've ever had a foretaste.
We are not instructed to pray to the Holy Spirit, but if moved to invoke or ask the Spirit of God to move in a special way after addressing the Father-God in the name of Jesus,...there is nothing wrong with that, since we understand BOTH the personality of the Spirit and the dynamic power and gifts of the Spirit. "Holy Spirit, have your way". Again, you can personify or treat the Spirit as a 'person' as much as it has a divine personality, but 'Spirit' is also breath, power, active-force, energy. On this score, if one wants to contextualize their engagement with God within a Unitarian or Trinitarian context,...its still 'God' in operation (no matter how you configure things conceptually). There is 'God' and the 'agency' of God. He is the Father of spirits, many ministering spirits serve Him, a whole hierarchy of cosmic beings, divine Sons and angels, myriads of spirits. "he makes his angels spirits, and ministers as flames of fire" :angel:
If any could tell, I'm a bit charasmatic
Holy Breath, Divine Energy, Power..................
Hi JR,
I addressed the issue of personality and 'God' here, earlier. I link my previous commentary which addresses the issue in its many dimensions. Considering the points I make is important here, if you take a preconceived mindset of interpreting this thru a Trinitarian belief-system or not. Since the Holy Spirit is the Spirit of God, whether you personalize Him/Her or not....the 'Spirit' can possess 'personality' and will relay or express the personality of God because 'God' and His Spirit are indivisible. There are references as well as the Spirit being poured out, coming upon people, this indicating the dynamic power or breath of God in operation, so the Spirit works in various manifestations or gifts, as well as various anointings of power.
An 'anointed one' is also one upon whom the Spirit of God comes, the oil being smeared onto the person, permeating him, empowering him for service (whether a king, priest or prophet). So there is obviously a non-personal spiritual energetic presence of the Spirit of God as well. Only as some 'presence' is actually expressing and relating to other beings in a personal way, could we say it has 'personality' of some kind. Otherwise, the common notion among orthodox or evangelical to say "the Holy Spirit is a person" is fine, but its more a matter of 'faith' and 'doctrinal assumption' that this is so, beyond what one 'imagines' or 'assumes' to be any kind of 'proof' that a person called the 'Holy Spirit' actually exists. No one knows beyond what one experiences subjectively. Again,...there may be a Spirit or spirits of God at work in any given situation, for angels too have some kind of 'personality', being personal beings as well. So in an event where multiple spirits of God are converging or at work, you'll have a great company of personalities engaging. At the same time if there are any manifestations present,...you'll have demonstrations of spiritual power, diverse movements, special operations, inner and outer transformations of spirit, soul and body. Being in the glory-manifestations of 'God' is pretty awesome, if you've ever had a foretaste.
We are not instructed to pray to the Holy Spirit, but if moved to invoke or ask the Spirit of God to move in a special way after addressing the Father-God in the name of Jesus,...there is nothing wrong with that, since we understand BOTH the personality of the Spirit and the dynamic power and gifts of the Spirit. "Holy Spirit, have your way". Again, you can personify or treat the Spirit as a 'person' as much as it has a divine personality, but 'Spirit' is also breath, power, active-force, energy. On this score, if one wants to contextualize their engagement with God within a Unitarian or Trinitarian context,...its still 'God' in operation (no matter how you configure things conceptually). There is 'God' and the 'agency' of God. He is the Father of spirits, many ministering spirits serve Him, a whole hierarchy of cosmic beings, divine Sons and angels, myriads of spirits. "he makes his angels spirits, and ministers as flames of fire" :angel:
If any could tell, I'm a bit charasmatic