Jesus CANNOT be Jehovah/YHVH God

[Right Divider]

Of course I understand what you are saying. The problem is, the Scriptures don't agree with your theory.

2 Cor 11:3-4 But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty, so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ. 4 For if he that cometh preacheth another Jesus, whom we have not preached, or if ye receive another spirit, which ye have not received, or another gospel, which ye have not accepted, ye might well bear with him.

There isn't a single example, of ANY sermon being PREACHED to ANY audience this "dual nature" theory.
Therefore, I reject the notion.

Our course there is. You are just too brainwashed and stubborn to believe it.

The Word was God.... John 1:1
And the Word was made flesh... John 1:14

Deity and humanity.

So simple that a child can understand it.

 

[Dartman]

JESUS is the WORD.

Nope. God's words are the word. Once you come to that CORRECT conclusion, your theology will change.
Just check the way John uses LOGOS;
John 1:1 In the beginning was the word, and the word was with God, and the word was God.
John 1:14 And the word was made flesh, and dwelt among us,...
John 2:22 ...and they believed the scripture, and the word which Jesus had said.
John 4:37 And herein is that saying true, One soweth, and another reapeth.
John 4:39 And many of the Samaritans of that city believed on him for the saying of the woman, which testified, He told me all that ever I did.
John 4:41 And many more believed because of his own word;
John 4:50 Jesus saith unto him, Go thy way; thy son liveth. And the man believed the word that Jesus had spoken unto him, and he went his way.
John 5:24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life ...
John 5:38 And ye have not his word abiding in you: for whom he hath sent, him ye believe not.
John 6:60 Many therefore of his disciples, when they had heard this, said, This is an hard saying; who can hear it?
John 7:36 What manner of saying is this that he said, Ye shall seek me, and shall not find me: and where I am, thither ye cannot come?
John 7:40 Many of the people therefore, when they heard this saying, said, Of a truth this is the Prophet.
John 8:31 Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed;
John 8:37 I know that ye are Abraham's seed; but ye seek to kill me, because my word hath no place in you.
John 8:43 Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word.
John 8:51 Verily, verily, I say unto you, If a man keep my saying, he shall never see death.
John 8:52 .. thou sayest, If a man keep my saying, he shall never taste of death.
John 8:55 ... I know him, and keep his saying.
John 10:19 There was a division therefore again among the Jews for these sayings.
John 10:35 If he called them gods, unto whom the word of God came, and the scripture cannot be broken;
John 12:38 That the saying of Esaias the prophet might be fulfilled, which he spake,..
John 12:48 He that rejecteth me, .. hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day.
John 14:23 Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: ...
John 14:24 He that loveth me not keepeth not my sayings: and the word which ye hear is not mine, but the Father's which sent me.
John 15:3 Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you.
John 15:20 Remember the word that I said unto you, ... if they have kept my saying, they will keep yours also.
John 15:25 But this cometh to pass, that the word might be fulfilled that is written in their law, They hated me without a cause.
John 17:6 ... thou gavest them me; and they have kept thy word.
John 17:14 I have given them thy word; and the world hath hated them, because they are not of the world, even as I am not of the world.
John 17:17 Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.
John 17:20 Neither pray I for these alone, but for them also which shall believe on me through their word;
John 18:9 That the saying might be fulfilled, which he spake, Of them which thou gavest me have I lost none.
John 18:32 That the saying of Jesus might be fulfilled, which he spake, signifying what death he should die.
John 19:8 When Pilate therefore heard that saying, he was the more afraid;
John 19:13 When Pilate therefore heard that saying, he brought Jesus forth, and sat down in the judgment seat
John 21:23 Then went this saying abroad among the brethren, that that disciple should not die: yet Jesus said not unto him, He shall not die; but, If I will that he tarry till I come, what is that to thee?

 

[Dartman]

So simple that a child can understand it.

You keep repeating this nonsense ..... and NEVER provide as Scripture that clearly, simply and directly states your premise.
On the other hand, the Scriptures are FULL of texts that clearly state that Jehovah/YHVH alone is God, is "the ONLY true God", is the Creator, is Christ's God.

And, Scriptures that state Jesus is God's servant, God's son, our brother, a man, the descendant of Eve, Abraham, David and Mary.

So, a child CAN understand the story of the Easter Bunny, and Harry Potter, and Luke Skywalker, and Bilbo Baggins ...... that doesn't make the story true.

 

[Bright Raven]

You keep repeating this nonsense ..... and NEVER provide as Scripture that clearly, simply and directly states your premise.
On the other hand, the Scriptures are FULL of texts that clearly state that Jehovah/YHVH alone is God, is "the ONLY true God", is the Creator, is Christ's God.

And, Scriptures that state Jesus is God's servant, God's son, our brother, a man, the descendant of Eve, Abraham, David and Mary.

So, a child CAN understand the story of the Easter Bunny, and Harry Potter, and Luke Skywalker, and Bilbo Baggins ...... that doesn't make the story true.

I see that you are not willing to fairly come to understand what the scriptures say. When you do, your life will change dramatically.

John 8:32 New King James Version (NKJV)
32 And you shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.”

 

[clefty]

Both trinity, and oneness teach "ANOTHER Jesus", a "Jesus" that is NEVER .... EVER... preached to ANY audience in the Scriptures. The Scriptures CLEARLY warn the Church regarding that. The strictly unitarian God of the OT, matches PERFECTLY with the unitarian God of the NT, as Jesus phrased it, "the ONLY true God".
Without believing in the TRUE God, it is IMPOSSIBLE to please the TRUE God.
Heb 11:6 But without faith it is impossible to please Him, FOR he that cometh to God MUST BELIEVE that HE is, AND that He is a rewarder of them that diligently seek Him.

Absolutely! A LITERAL Resurrection BACK to life. Everything that was Jesus died. Everything that was Jesus was buried in the tomb, and a gloriously CHANGED Jesus was brought BACK to life, stood/raised himself upright, and Jesus walked out of that tomb, with the wounds of his crucifixion intact.
Not quite. We agree on this doctrine, but if you are Catholic you believe in a different God, a different Jesus, a different Gospel .. (going to heaven rather than inheriting the earth), and several other critical errors. That prohibit's fellowship.

Sadly, you are correct. I pray that you will CONTINUE your search for truth.

Yes, I do... and that makes me sad for you, and your siblings.
It certainly seems to be what they are saying.
I am not a Protestant, I am part of the original apostolic Church the Catholics fell away from.
Protestants were absolutely right in their disgust at the moral depravity of the Papacy, AND the totally NONBiblical, NONCHRISTIAN behavior of the Papacy, doing EXACTLY what Jesus commanded NOT be done;
Luke 22:25-27 And he said unto them, The kings of the Gentiles exercise lordship over them; and they that exercise authority upon them are called benefactors. 26 But ye shall not be so: but he that is greatest among you, let him be as the younger; and he that is chief, as he that doth serve.
27 For whether is greater, he that sitteth at meat, or he that serveth? is not he that sitteth at meat? but I am among you as he that serveth.

Throughout history, I don't know of any ruler that exceeded the opulence, the pomp and the "lordship" of the Papacy.

BUT, the Protestants didn't go far enough to actually RETURN to their apostolic roots .... they STILL cling to another God, another Jesus and another Gospel.

Both Catholics and Protestants do NOT obey Christ's commandments of peace. BOTH have murdered my siblings throughout the centuries.

The Protestants are daughters of the Catholic apostasy..... which is why the apostate church is called "the mother of harlots".

Rev 17:5 And upon her forehead was a name written, MYSTERY, BABYLON THE GREAT, THE MOTHER OF HARLOTS AND ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH.


I feel bad for how harsh this reality is, but I have no choice but to tell the truth ... at least as I currently understand it.

I pray you will recover your self from the snare of Idolatry, and false gospel.

I pray we BOTH will be led into greater truth.

I can think of a specific way Protestants still stumble after Rome its tradition...following jewish false witness that Yahushua had indeed changed the customs delivered by Moses...

That of course was false witness as that is NOT what was preached as it was NOT what had happened...

Even James concluded the Jerusalem council fully expecting that the goyim would continue to hear Moses preached and read in every city on every Sabbath...Acts 15:21

 

[clefty]

Our course there is. You are just too brainwashed and stubborn to believe it.

The Word was God.... John 1:1
And the Word was made flesh... John 1:14

Deity and humanity.

So simple that a child can understand it.

So divinity died on the cross?

Or was it withdrawn?...is why “Eli!...Eli!”

 

[Bright Raven]

So divinity died on the cross?

Or was it withdrawn?...is why “Eli!...Eli!”

Yes, the Son was separated from the Father.

 

[Dartman]

Yes, the Son was separated from the Father.

Death is equated with sleep. Jesus was dead. NO PART of Jesus was still alive. Jesus, the REAL Jesus, was buried in the tomb.
Jesus' God brought Jesus back to life, an ENDLESS life, "first begotten from the dead",

 

[Bright Raven]

Death is equated with sleep. Jesus was dead. NO PART of Jesus was still alive. Jesus, the REAL Jesus, was buried in the tomb.
Jesus' God brought Jesus back to life, an ENDLESS life, "first begotten from the dead",

He was alive spiritually.

 

[Idolater]

Both trinity, and oneness teach "ANOTHER Jesus", a "Jesus" that is NEVER .... EVER... preached to ANY audience in the Scriptures. The Scriptures CLEARLY warn the Church regarding that. The strictly unitarian God of the OT, matches PERFECTLY with the unitarian God of the NT, as Jesus phrased it, "the ONLY true God".
Without believing in the TRUE God, it is IMPOSSIBLE to please the TRUE God.
Heb 11:6 But without faith it is impossible to please Him, FOR he that cometh to God MUST BELIEVE that HE is, AND that He is a rewarder of them that diligently seek Him.

Absolutely! A LITERAL Resurrection BACK to life. Everything that was Jesus died. Everything that was Jesus was buried in the tomb, and a gloriously CHANGED Jesus was brought BACK to life, stood/raised himself upright, and Jesus walked out of that tomb, with the wounds of his crucifixion intact.
Not quite. We agree on this doctrine, but if you are Catholic you believe in a different God, a different Jesus, a different Gospel .. (going to heaven rather than inheriting the earth), and several other critical errors. That prohibit's fellowship.

Sadly, you are correct. I pray that you will CONTINUE your search for truth.

Yes, I do... and that makes me sad for you, and your siblings.
It certainly seems to be what they are saying.
I am not a Protestant, I am part of the original apostolic Church the Catholics fell away from.
Protestants were absolutely right in their disgust at the moral depravity of the Papacy, AND the totally NONBiblical, NONCHRISTIAN behavior of the Papacy, doing EXACTLY what Jesus commanded NOT be done;
Luke 22:25-27 And he said unto them, The kings of the Gentiles exercise lordship over them; and they that exercise authority upon them are called benefactors. 26 But ye shall not be so: but he that is greatest among you, let him be as the younger; and he that is chief, as he that doth serve.
27 For whether is greater, he that sitteth at meat, or he that serveth? is not he that sitteth at meat? but I am among you as he that serveth.

Throughout history, I don't know of any ruler that exceeded the opulence, the pomp and the "lordship" of the Papacy.

BUT, the Protestants didn't go far enough to actually RETURN to their apostolic roots .... they STILL cling to another God, another Jesus and another Gospel.

Both Catholics and Protestants do NOT obey Christ's commandments of peace. BOTH have murdered my siblings throughout the centuries.

The Protestants are daughters of the Catholic apostasy..... which is why the apostate church is called "the mother of harlots".

Rev 17:5 And upon her forehead was a name written, MYSTERY, BABYLON THE GREAT, THE MOTHER OF HARLOTS AND ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH.


I feel bad for how harsh this reality is, but I have no choice but to tell the truth ... at least as I currently understand it.

I pray you will recover your self from the snare of Idolatry, and false gospel.

I pray we BOTH will be led into greater truth.

I applaud this and thank you. I believe that you pastor a congregation yourself, I'm pastor of a small congregation. I believe that the doing of theology on TOL is intended by divine providence to drive the whole Church, the Body of Christ back together again, like 'Humpty.'

We are frayed, we are fractured, this is not how it was in the beginning (Ac2:42 e.g.), but we are Not dead. Christianity is Not over yet, and we have Yet to see our last Hurrah.

I believe that prayer is absolutely the final answer to how to solve our current catastrophe of such disunity. It's un-American, for one thing, but it's also perhaps the single thing that largely stands between us and the envelopment of the whole earth in Christianity. With a reunited Church, the rest of the world stands no earthly chance of resisting the Gospel, and even without the Lord's return, it'd be like living in His kingdom here on earth, in some ways.

I want us all to be Catholic priests, I want the Catholic Church to permit a dispensation during which all non-Catholic pastors can become ordained and resume their ministry with little change, except for crucially Catholic things, in large part just the valid celebration of the sacraments, and teaching according to the papacy's definition and authorized teachings. Submitting to our bishops, in brief other words.

I believe that Mary is the best pray-er that there is. When we ask one another to pray for us, that's what we're doing when we pray to her, we literally pray, "Mother of God, pray for us sinners." And we believe that she does, and we believe that of all the cloud of witnesses, the communion of saints in heaven, that she more than any other, has our Lord's ear.

I believe that in heaven we will communicate to the Lord Jesus and to the Father in prayer, just as we do now, even though we will be in the Real Presence of God.

=
I further believe that those attending the valid celebration of any Holy Catholic /Holy Orthodox Eucharist, are then in the Real Presence of God.

And I believe that when I am attending Mass, that I am in the Real Presence of God.

 

[way 2 go]

It is impossible for Jesus to be "Jehovah" because Jesus is NOT the source of the words he spoke, his God is.

His FATHER is Jehovah!

Jesus here is saying " his commandment"
Joh 12:50 And I know that his commandment is eternal life. What I say, therefore, I say as the Father has told me."

Jesus here is saying " my commandments "
Joh 14:15 "If you love me, you will keep my commandments.

still have not explained how your unijesus lies & calls them "my commandments" ?

if Jesus was just sent by God & not God then he was wrong to accept worship
Jesus accepted worship because Jesus is God
Mat 28:9 And behold, Jesus met them and said, "Greetings!" And they came up and took hold of his feet and worshiped him.

Mat 4:10 Then Jesus said to him, "Be gone, Satan! For it is written, "'You shall worship the Lord your God and him only shall you serve.'"
Mat_6:24 No man can serve two masters: for either he will hate the one, and love the other; or else he will hold to the one, and despise the other. Ye cannot serve God and mammon.



if Jesus was just sent by God & not God then he was wrong for saying "follow me" "serve me"
that is not honoring God Mat 4:10

Jesus says "follow me" "serve me" because Jesus is God .

Joh 8:12 Again Jesus spoke to them, saying, "I am the light of the world. Whoever follows me will not walk in darkness, but will have the light of life."
Joh 21:19 (This he said to show by what kind of death he was to glorify God.) And after saying this he said to him, "Follow me."
Joh 12:26 If anyone serves me, he must follow me; and where I am, there will my servant be also. If anyone serves me, the Father will honor him.

you still haven't explained your unijesus accepting worship or saying "follow me" "serve me" if your unijesus is not God ?

 

[Dartman]

He was alive spiritually.

No such thing.
Dead = NOT alive. Isa 38:1 .... thus saith Jehovah, Set thy house in order; for thou shalt die, and not live.

Rev 20:5 The rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years should be finished.

 

[Dartman]

Jesus here is saying " his commandment"
Joh 12:50 And I know that his commandment is eternal life. What I say, therefore, I say as the Father has told me."

Jesus here is saying " my commandments "
Joh 14:15 "If you love me, you will keep my commandments.

still have not explained how your unijesus lies & calls them "my commandments" ?

You already know, and intentionally left out the verses that explain PRECISELY why Jesus isn't the SOURCE of the commandments his God COMMANDED Jesus to teach.

The question is NOT WHETHER Jesus actually spoke the commandments, the question is WHERE DID JESUS GET THE COMMANDMENTS HE SPOKE;'

John 12:49 For I spake not from myself; but the Father that sent me, He hath given me a commandment, what I should say, and what I should speak.


Jesus NEVER denied SPEAKING the commandments, he CONSTANTLY denied being the SOURCE of the commandments Jesus spoke.


John 14:10 Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I say unto you I speak not from myself: but the Father abiding in me doeth his works.


John 14:24 He that loveth me not keepeth not my words: and the word which ye hear is not mine, but the Father's who sent me.

 

[Dartman]

if Jesus was just sent by God & not God then he was wrong to accept worship

Not true.
There are other people that are worshiped in Scripture, including David, as king of Israel;
1 Chron 29:20 And David said to all the assembly, Now bless Jehovah your God. And all the assembly blessed Jehovah, the God of their fathers, and bowed down their heads, and worshipped Jehovah, and the king.


The problem isn't worship in and of itself, the problem is elevating the person being worshiped ABOVE their true authority and power. It is just fine for us to honor the king, or the president ... but not as if they ARE God!
David wasn't worshiped as GOD, he was worshiped as the King.
Jesus is never to be worshiped as GOD, he deserves worship as our Lord, as our King, as God's anointed Christ.

 

[Apple7]

Adonee אדֹנִי is used for humans. It means "my master" or "my lord"
Adonai אֲדֹנָי generally refers to God.

אֲדֹנָ֥י is used 418 times in scripture, outside of Psalm 110.5, and, in each case, it refers to Yahweh.

Thus, when it is used in Psalm 110.5, in describing The Second Person of The Trinity, we can rest assured that The Son is indeed Yahweh.

 

[Apple7]

Where does "hand" appear in psalm 110?

יְמִֽינְךָ֑

 

[Apple7]

No, David as narrator quotes Jehovah, and prophetically reveals what Jesus would do.

Incorrect.

Psalm 110

A declaration of Yahweh to my Master: Sit at My right hand, until I place (First-Person),Your enemies as Your footstool. Yahweh shall send (Third-Person) the rod of Your strength out of Zion to rule in the midst of Your enemies. Your people shall have willingness in the day of Your might; in the majesties of holiness; from the womb of the dawn, to You is the dew of Your youth. Yahweh has sworn and will not repent: You are a priest forever according to the order of Melchizedek. The Master at Your right hand shatters kings in the day of His anger. He shall judge among the nations; He shall fill with dead bodies; He shall shatter heads over much land. He shall drink out of the torrent on the way; therefore, He shall lift up the head. (Psalm 110.1 - 7)

 

[Apple7]

Where?

Some simple examples...

David identified the Hand of Yahweh (1 Ch 28.19) as The Spirit (1 Ch 28.12).

Ezekiel identified the Hand of Yahweh (Eze 1.3; 3.22) as The Spirit ( Eze 3.14).

 

[Apple7]

Of course it is.
Jesus inherited the throne of his father David. Jesus will rule the planet from Jerusalem..... like David did.

Said scripture, never.

 

[Apple7]

Greetings again Apple7, The way I read Psalm 110 is that after a brief introduction by David, it is Yahweh that is speaking to and about David’s Lord. Yahweh, God the Father is this one speaker.


Kind regards
Trevor

Speak to scripture, and demonstrate what you believe...if you can, that is...