I guess that is why they are referred to as separate entities.
In the beginning was the Word
- Thread starter beameup
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I guess that is why they are referred to as separate entities.
God's Truth
New member
Jesus was God the Father with a body who spoke for God, even in heaven.
Mass confusion of very simple principles: a Father and His Son.
CherubRam
New member
Commentary on John 1:1.
Pantheion
Greek pantheion, from pan 'all' + theion 'Divine Eternal-s' (from theios 'divine.')
From Greek aion, meaning Eternal, for an infinite amount of time Pantheion: Pan/the/ion. All Divine Eternal-s. The word “All” makes it plural.
aeon or aion or eon
1. An immeasurably long period of time. From Greek, Aion, an infinitely long time.
Greek word TON and THEON.
From the Scripture4All program. Link: www.scripture4all.org/
The Greek word "TON" is translated 1583 times as "the;" And 18 times as "the -one." It is used before nouns to mean a {certain-one-person-s,} or place, or thing. However, different translations of Greek do not always agree. That is the reason for my interpretation of John 1:1 as "the only Divine Eternal." In English the word “one” can also be translated as “only.” TON: The only. THEON: Divine Eternal.
John 1:1
Greek:
en arche en ho logos kai ho logos en pros ton theon kai theos en ho logos
Interlinear:
en (in) arche (beginning) en (was) ho (the) logos (Word) kai (and) ho (the) logos (Word) en (was) pos (toward or with) ton (TON is a special definite article "the" meaning the one and only, it appears as TON instead of O in the Greek) theon (Divine Eternal) kai (and) theos (Divine) en (was) ho (the) logos (Word)
In English we have:
In beginning was the Word, and the Word was with the (one or only) Divine Eternal, and Divine was the Word.
The defining article "a" must be supplied for the English language, to define that there is another Divine that is not the "Divine Eternal."
Why do translators drop off the definite article TON (the one or only) before Divine Eternal?
Theon and Theos
They both mean Divine, but in different cases. Theos is the nominative, Theon is accusative. Another form is Theou, which is genitive.
John 1:1 reads: “In [the] beginning was the Word, and the Word was with [τὸν θεὸν, (TON THEON) literally, the only Divine Eternal], and the Word was divine. [θεὸς].”
In the first instance (“the Word was with the only Divine Eternal”) it is in the accusative case and thus is spelled θεὸν [theon] But in the second occurrence it is in the nominative case, and so it is spelled θεὸς [theos]
Ton Theon was also applied to Zeus, meaning "The Only Divine Eternal."
Eon or Aeon; a very long time.
The word aeon, also spelled eon or æon, originally means "life", and / or "being", though it then tended to mean "age", "forever" or "for eternity". It is a Latin transliteration from the koine Greek word ὁ αἰών (ho aion), from the archaic αἰϝών (aiwon).
In Homer it typically refers to life or lifespan. Its latest meaning is more or less similar to the Sanskrit word kalpa and Hebrew word olam. A cognate Latin word aevum or aeuum (cf. αἰϝών) for "age" is present in words such as longevity.
Although the term aeon may be used in reference to a period of a billion years, its more common usage is for any long, indefinite, period.
Eternity or age
The Bible translation is a treatment of the Hebrew word olam and the Greek word aion. Both these words have similar meaning, and Young's Literal Translation renders them and their derivatives as “age” or “age-during”. Other English versions most often translate them to indicate eternity, being translated as eternal, everlasting, forever, etc. However, there are notable exceptions to this in all major translations, such as Matthew 28:20: “…I am with you always, to the end of the age” (NRSV), the word “age” being a translation of aion.
Rendering aion to indicate eternality in this verse would result in the contradictory phrase “end of eternity”, so the question arises whether it should ever be so.
Proponents of Universal Reconciliation point out that this has significant implications for the problem of an eternal hell.
Contrast readings of Matthew 25:46 in well-known English translations with its rendering in Young's Literal Translation:
And these shall go away to punishment age-during, but the righteous to life age-during. (YLT)
Then they will go away to eternal punishment, but the righteous to eternal life. (NIV)
These will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life. (NASB)
And these shall go away into everlasting punishment, but the righteous into life eternal. (KJV)
And these will depart into everlasting cutting-off, but the righteous ones into everlasting life. (NWT)
The word "Divine" is a translation, and the word "god" is an interpretation. The reason the word "god" is an interpretation, is because it derived from the name of a Pagan god.
Additional Note.
Theosophy
Theosophy (from Greek θεοσοφία theosophia, from θεός theos, divine + σοφία sophia, wisdom; literally "divine wisdom")
The word theosophia appeared in both Greek and Latin in early Christian writings as a synonym for “theology”. The theosophoi are “those who know divine matters.”
Pantheion
Greek pantheion, from pan 'all' + theion 'Divine Eternal-s' (from theios 'divine.')
From Greek aion, meaning Eternal, for an infinite amount of time Pantheion: Pan/the/ion. All Divine Eternal-s. The word “All” makes it plural.
aeon or aion or eon
1. An immeasurably long period of time. From Greek, Aion, an infinitely long time.
Greek word TON and THEON.
From the Scripture4All program. Link: www.scripture4all.org/
The Greek word "TON" is translated 1583 times as "the;" And 18 times as "the -one." It is used before nouns to mean a {certain-one-person-s,} or place, or thing. However, different translations of Greek do not always agree. That is the reason for my interpretation of John 1:1 as "the only Divine Eternal." In English the word “one” can also be translated as “only.” TON: The only. THEON: Divine Eternal.
John 1:1
Greek:
en arche en ho logos kai ho logos en pros ton theon kai theos en ho logos
Interlinear:
en (in) arche (beginning) en (was) ho (the) logos (Word) kai (and) ho (the) logos (Word) en (was) pos (toward or with) ton (TON is a special definite article "the" meaning the one and only, it appears as TON instead of O in the Greek) theon (Divine Eternal) kai (and) theos (Divine) en (was) ho (the) logos (Word)
In English we have:
In beginning was the Word, and the Word was with the (one or only) Divine Eternal, and Divine was the Word.
The defining article "a" must be supplied for the English language, to define that there is another Divine that is not the "Divine Eternal."
Why do translators drop off the definite article TON (the one or only) before Divine Eternal?
Theon and Theos
They both mean Divine, but in different cases. Theos is the nominative, Theon is accusative. Another form is Theou, which is genitive.
John 1:1 reads: “In [the] beginning was the Word, and the Word was with [τὸν θεὸν, (TON THEON) literally, the only Divine Eternal], and the Word was divine. [θεὸς].”
In the first instance (“the Word was with the only Divine Eternal”) it is in the accusative case and thus is spelled θεὸν [theon] But in the second occurrence it is in the nominative case, and so it is spelled θεὸς [theos]
Ton Theon was also applied to Zeus, meaning "The Only Divine Eternal."
Eon or Aeon; a very long time.
The word aeon, also spelled eon or æon, originally means "life", and / or "being", though it then tended to mean "age", "forever" or "for eternity". It is a Latin transliteration from the koine Greek word ὁ αἰών (ho aion), from the archaic αἰϝών (aiwon).
In Homer it typically refers to life or lifespan. Its latest meaning is more or less similar to the Sanskrit word kalpa and Hebrew word olam. A cognate Latin word aevum or aeuum (cf. αἰϝών) for "age" is present in words such as longevity.
Although the term aeon may be used in reference to a period of a billion years, its more common usage is for any long, indefinite, period.
Eternity or age
The Bible translation is a treatment of the Hebrew word olam and the Greek word aion. Both these words have similar meaning, and Young's Literal Translation renders them and their derivatives as “age” or “age-during”. Other English versions most often translate them to indicate eternity, being translated as eternal, everlasting, forever, etc. However, there are notable exceptions to this in all major translations, such as Matthew 28:20: “…I am with you always, to the end of the age” (NRSV), the word “age” being a translation of aion.
Rendering aion to indicate eternality in this verse would result in the contradictory phrase “end of eternity”, so the question arises whether it should ever be so.
Proponents of Universal Reconciliation point out that this has significant implications for the problem of an eternal hell.
Contrast readings of Matthew 25:46 in well-known English translations with its rendering in Young's Literal Translation:
And these shall go away to punishment age-during, but the righteous to life age-during. (YLT)
Then they will go away to eternal punishment, but the righteous to eternal life. (NIV)
These will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life. (NASB)
And these shall go away into everlasting punishment, but the righteous into life eternal. (KJV)
And these will depart into everlasting cutting-off, but the righteous ones into everlasting life. (NWT)
The word "Divine" is a translation, and the word "god" is an interpretation. The reason the word "god" is an interpretation, is because it derived from the name of a Pagan god.
Additional Note.
Theosophy
Theosophy (from Greek θεοσοφία theosophia, from θεός theos, divine + σοφία sophia, wisdom; literally "divine wisdom")
The word theosophia appeared in both Greek and Latin in early Christian writings as a synonym for “theology”. The theosophoi are “those who know divine matters.”
S-word.........Ahh you poor deceived child of that woman who sits on the seven hills of Rome, who claims to be the bride of Christ, but who instead, is the bride of the dead Emperor Constantine.
The Lord says in Revelation 18: 4-8.
Come out of her my people do not share in her sins
You must not share her punishment, her judgement day has come.
For her sins are piled to heaven, and God recalls her evil ways,
She says; “ I am no widow and I will never see the grave.”
Because of that, in just one day disease will strike her down
Plagues and famine she’ll receive, til finally she’ll be burned.
You must pay her back two fold for all that she has done
Fill her cup as she filled yours, but make it twice as strong.
For all the glory she has claimed and all her luxury,
Will be repaid this very day, with pain and misery.
Elizabeth, the mother of John the Baptist, and Hanna, the mother of Mary were sisters, making John and Mary first cousins.
John, who was chosen by the “Light of Man” the controlling personality within the Logos, to Baptise with water, which was symbolic of the great flood, when the old body of Adam was submerged in water and the new body of Enoch, ‘The Anointed One=The Christ’ arose.
John knew that his cousins son ‘Jesus’ was greater than he, and at first, refused to baptise him, but he did not know at that time, that Jesus was the one chosen by the “Light of Man” who told John that the man on whom he saw the spirit descend upon in bodily form was the one he had chosen to baptise with that spirit, which he was to receive. And it was only after John had baptised his cousin's son that he saw the spirit descend upon Jesus.
If John had believed that his cousin Mary was an ever virgin, and that Jesus was born without male semen having been introduced into her dormant female egg, something that has never been known to have happened, do you think that he would have doubted that Jesus was the chosen Messiah? But he did. While in prison awaiting his execution, he sent his disciples to ask Jesus, if he was really the one, or if they had to wait for another.
If Jesus had been born of a pure virgin, this would have been the greatest miracle of all, as being raised from the dead was old hat, Elijah had done it and his successor Elisha had done it also .
But Mark, who is believed to have been Mark the son of Peter, and John the beloved disciple of Jesus, Both ignore the physical birth of Jesus as being totally irrelevant, and begin their accounts of the salvation, with the spiritual birth of Jesus, when the spirit of the lord descended upon Jesus in the form of a dove as the heavenly voice was heard to say; “You are my son (My chosen heir and successor) this day I have begotten thee---This day I have become your Father.”
Matthew is mentioned in Matthew 9:9 and Matthew 10:3 as a publican who, while sitting at the "receipt of custom" in Capernaum, was called to follow Jesus. And Matthew simply confirms that Jesus was the fulfilment of the Lords prophecy through his prophet Isaiah, who said than an Almah=a young unmarried woman who is pregnant will bear a son, who would be the vessel in which the Lord would reveal himself to the world, the Emmanuel.
But your mother church continues the lie, by saying that a virgin would bear that child, when they have been forced to admit, that Isaiah never did say that. Read Isaiah 7: 14.
And Luke reveals that Jesus was the biological son of Mary and her half brother Joseph who were both sired by Alexander Helios=Heli.
But I realise that your mother church has deceived you with her lies, that your head is so mixed up and set as hard as concrete, that one would have to use a sledge hammer to shatter that conglomerate and let the light of truth shine in.
1Mind1Spirit
Literal lunatic
Nope.
I posted the no jew, Gentile, male, female verse so she would know I wasn't hacking on her being a woman with my Ribeye statement.
Guess that is why they are spoken of as different entities in the scriptures.
God's Truth
New member
There is only one God and He is the Father.
God the Father invisible, and God the Father made visible with a body.
I guess you believe that Jesus is another God?
God's Truth
New member
You haven't disproved what I said.
Why do you think that calling Jesus the Son makes him any less God?
It is the language of calling Himself the Son that is common to us.
Who put a son or a daughter comes from one?
God's Truth
New member
You know better than that don't you?
Do you really get another God when I say they are the same?
You do not understand the differences.
God's Truth
New member
Be careful how you judge, for you are exposing who you are and what you do. I know now to what and whom I am debating.
Speak according to the Holy Bible. Show scripture for what you say.
You act as if they all lived together and you act as if Mary and Joseph told everyone their business. You think the writers of the New Testament scriptures were idiots and did not think of things, while they were making it up, according to you?
Being raised from the dead is easier to prove than being born of a virgin. You have no sense.
You defeat yourself with your own argument. What is so miraculous about a young married woman having a child?
I believe that God the creator of everything knows how to preserve His Word, and He did, in the Holy Bible.
God's Truth
New member
I know Jesus saved me. I know he is living inside me. You figure it out for yourself.
"Why do you think that calling Jesus the Son makes him any less God?"
Because he himself says so in John 14:28. It does not take hardly anything to disprove what you said because what you said has no basis in common sense or reality and neither does your theory have any representation in the natural creation of Elohim. A father is never his own son and a son is never his own father. If what you said is true then someone else can come along after you, and based on what you have said, that person coming along after you can say, "the Father begat the Son and the Son begat the Father because they are equal and one and the same", but that would be ridiculous because everyone knows that the Father is unbegotten, (not begotten). Additionally the statement from John 14:28 employs μειζων which is not just "greater" but at the same time both ELDER and OLDER.
End of story: your doctrine is untrue according to the Master Teacher himself, (John 14:28).
God's Truth
New member
Tell me what one is called when they come from another?
Even if we could clone you, what would you call the one who came from you?
Jesus Christ is Lord, not YHWH.
Act 2:36 Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made that same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ.
LA
God's Truth
New member
Jesus is God there is only One.
The natural creation is given to man for examples, to exhibit supernal and spiritual things to mankind, as even taught by Paul in the first chapter of the epistle to the Romans. Cloning is unnatural and rather, an invention of man, by way of "tinkering" with the natural creation of Elohim. The natural creation of Elohim does not work in that way. Elohim gave us the example of a father and his offspring so as to teach us supernal and spiritual things by way of our own natural creation. That is why I said your theory denies the most basic principles: for you essentially ignore the natural creation, the meanings of the very words "father", and "son", and proceed to make up things that are not seen in the natural creation of Elohim, that is, "a Father who is His own Son, and a Son who is his own Father", which is ludicrous because it confounds everything that is shown to us in the natural creation of Elohim. There is no such thing as "a father who is his own son", or "a mother who is her own daughter", and so on, and so on. It is mass confusion to say such unnatural things and at the same time it confounds the scripture, which is logical, intelligent, and full of logos-reasoning. When you throw logic out the window you get chaos and mass confusion.