How Calvinism makes a sham out of Christianity

[glorydaz]

Explain to me how you have Faith in Christs Blood Rom 3:25

[FONT="]Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through [/FONT]faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;

​When you dont believe His Blood saved them it was shed for ?

The verse says quite clearly....."through FAITH in His blood".

You don't believe what is written.

 

[Ask Mr. Religion]

I don't think that Calvinist have really thought through their doctrine of predestination. If God has predestinated some certain people to eternal life and damned the rest to hell, then what implications does this have upon historical Christianity?

Wow! An anti-Calvinism thread. Who would have imagined it from the likes of Robert Pate? :AMR:

What is actually quite clear is that, you, Robert, are quite confused:

http://theologyonline.com/showthrea...ossians-2-10&p=5099677&viewfull=1#post5099677

And you have you very own notion of predestination:
http://theologyonline.com/showthrea...redestinated&p=4851757&viewfull=1#post4851757

Obviously, the anti-Calvinist may deny predestination as we Calvinists understand it to be, but in their denial, they set about crafting a typical anti-Calvinist version of predestination.

In the anti-Calvinist view, predestination implies that God chose certain qualities or properties of persons—faith, repentance, holiness, and perseverance—with a purpose of admitting to heaven all those, whoever they might be, who possess or exhibit these qualities or properties, and consigns to eternal punishment all those who, after being favored with suitable opportunities, who fail to exhibit these personal qualities.

Note carefully here what the anti-Calvinist believes: it is man who is responsible for his own salvation. In other words, the person who chooses wisely, a fallen person in Adam who seemingly possesses the moral ability to choose righteousness, is granted admittance to the Kingdom. Therefore, it must follow that the person who does not choose wisely, is consigned to eternal punishment. After all, surely no one but the errant open theist denies God knows the future choices of His creatures. The attempt to let God off the hook for one's final destiny is but a dilution of His sovereignty, relegating God to but a contingent being, while He wrings His hands, pleading and hoping His apparently autonomous creatures will make the right choices.

For anyone wanting to dig a wee bit deeper on the matter:
http://theologyonline.com/showthrea...n-s-Nazi-God&p=4917244&viewfull=1#post4917244

AMR

 

[Ktoyou]

Calvinist are not interest in the resurrection of Christ, why should they be? They have been predestinated.

It is not that simple

 

[Ktoyou]

Wow! An anti-Calvinism thread. Who would have imagined it from the likes of Robert Pate? :AMR:

What is actually quite clear is that, you, Robert, are quite confused:

.............
AMR

but he is slowly learning. allow him to acquire an advanced degree in theology and spend several years learning Calvinism, then he may be able to make more cogent arguments.

 

[glorydaz]

The attempt to let God off the hook for one's final destiny is but a dilution of His sovereignty, relegating God to but a contingent being, while He wrings His hands, pleading and hoping His apparently autonomous creatures will make the right choices.

The wringing the hands part is great for dramatic effect, but the idea that God loves all His creation, and puts forth great efforts to lead them to Himself is seen throughout Scripture. He is LOVE. He is long-suffering. His goodness leads men to Himself. The Cross draws all men. He sends out prophets and ambassadors to "beseech" men to be reconciled to Him. "Even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings..." These should not be written off as God "hand wringing," but of God's great love, and His provisions by which we could come.

2 Corinthians 5:20
Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech you by us: we pray you in Christ's stead, be ye reconciled to God.

2 Peter 3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

Matthew 23:37
O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not!

Acts 17:30 And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:
​

 

[beloved57]

The train has left and you didn't get on it. You just stood there like a blind fool and watched it leave.

Way to dodge! You don't have Faith in Christ Blood, your trust is in the will of man.

 

[beloved57]

The verse says quite clearly....."through FAITH in His blood".

You don't believe what is written.

You don't have Faith in Christ Blood if you believe that His Blood didn't save those it was shed for. Now do u believe that there are people who Christ shed His Blood for and they are lost? Yes or No

 

[glorydaz]

You don't have Faith in Christ Blood if you believe that His Blood didn't save those it was shed for. Now do u believe that there are people who Christ shed His Blood for and they are lost? Yes or No

I'm not your flunky. You haven't answered my question. Let me remind you...Why did God say this to Cain? Was God so unrighteous that He would give Cain false hope?

Gen. 4:6 And the Lord said unto Cain, Why art thou wroth? and why is thy countenance fallen? 7 If thou doest well, shalt thou not be accepted? and if thou doest not well, sin lieth at the door.​

 

[beloved57]

I'm not your flunky. You haven't answered my question. Let me remind you...Why did God say this to Cain? Was God so unrighteous that He would give Cain false hope?

Gen. 4:6 And the Lord said unto Cain, Why art thou wroth? and why is thy countenance fallen? 7 If thou doest well, shalt thou not be accepted? and if thou doest not well, sin lieth at the door.​

You dodging a bullet. Im not your flunky . But i know u don't have Faith in Christ Saving Blood!You don't have to answer that question because i know from reading your posts.

 

[Robert Pate]

Wow! An anti-Calvinism thread. Who would have imagined it from the likes of Robert Pate? :AMR:

What is actually quite clear is that, you, Robert, are quite confused:

http://theologyonline.com/showthrea...ossians-2-10&p=5099677&viewfull=1#post5099677

And you have you very own notion of predestination:
http://theologyonline.com/showthrea...redestinated&p=4851757&viewfull=1#post4851757

Obviously, the anti-Calvinist may deny predestination as we Calvinists understand it to be, but in their denial, they set about crafting a typical anti-Calvinist version of predestination.

In the anti-Calvinist view, predestination implies that God chose certain qualities or properties of persons—faith, repentance, holiness, and perseverance—with a purpose of admitting to heaven all those, whoever they might be, who possess or exhibit these qualities or properties, and consigns to eternal punishment all those who, after being favored with suitable opportunities, who fail to exhibit these personal qualities.

Note carefully here what the anti-Calvinist believes: it is man who is responsible for his own salvation. In other words, the person who chooses wisely, a fallen person in Adam who seemingly possesses the moral ability to choose righteousness, is granted admittance to the Kingdom. Therefore, it must follow that the person who does not choose wisely, is consigned to eternal punishment. After all, surely no one but the errant open theist denies God knows the future choices of His creatures. The attempt to let God off the hook for one's final destiny is but a dilution of His sovereignty, relegating God to but a contingent being, while He wrings His hands, pleading and hoping His apparently autonomous creatures will make the right choices.

For anyone wanting to dig a wee bit deeper on the matter:
http://theologyonline.com/showthrea...n-s-Nazi-God&p=4917244&viewfull=1#post4917244

AMR

The God of Calvinism cannot be loved or trusted.

How can anyone possibly love a God that predestinates people to hell before they are born?

The doctrine of Calvinism is so far off the wall that it is impossible with anyone that has any sense to believe it.

Which makes me believe that Calvinist must be demon possessed.

 

[beloved57]

The God of Calvinism cannot be loved or trusted.

How can anyone possibly love a God that predestinates people to hell before they are born?

The doctrine of Calvinism is so far off the wall that it is impossible with anyone that has any sense to believe it.

Which makes me believe that Calvinist must be demon possessed.

The christ of pateism is a false christ because sinners it died for are still lost and condemned! Thats not true of the Christ of Scripture!

 

[God's Truth]

The christ of pateism is a false christ because sinners it died for are still lost and condemned! Thats not true of the Christ of Scripture!

Pate and you both are preaching falseness.

Pate preaches that we can only believe and not obey.

You preach we cannot believe and we cannot obey.

You both condemn those who are thirsty and you both nullify Jesus' words.

 

[beloved57]

Pate and you both are preaching falseness.

Pate preaches that we can only believe and not obey.

You preach we cannot believe and we cannot obey.

You both condemn those who are thirsty and you both nullify Jesus' words.

Both you and pate show disregard for the Death of Christ by teaching that sinners He died for are yet lost and condemned!

 

[God's Truth]

Both you and pate show disregard for the Death of Christ by teaching that sinners He died for are yet lost and condemned!

Do you honor Jesus when you say those who believe and obey him are condemned?

Does it make sense to you that we have to say we adhere to the teachings of John Calvin in order to be saved?

 

[Robert Pate]

The christ of pateism is a false christ because sinners it died for are still lost and condemned! Thats not true of the Christ of Scripture!

Poor blind fool wants us to believe that Jesus died on the cross for sins, but no one is supposed to know that or respond to it.

 

[beloved57]

Do you honor Jesus when you say those who believe and obey him are condemned?

Does it make sense to you that we have to say we adhere to the teachings of John Calvin in order to be saved?

I dont honor the christ u serve ! You dont Honor the Christ of scripture, you teach that sinners He shed His Blood for are still lost and condemned ! That dishonors Him !

 

[beloved57]

Poor blind fool wants us to believe that Jesus died on the cross for sins, but no one is supposed to know that or respond to it.

You believe that sinners Christ died for are stilll lost, so His death doesnt save according to your beliefs. Thats unbelief !

 

[God's Truth]

Poor blind fool wants us to believe that Jesus died on the cross for sins, but no one is supposed to know that or respond to it.

How about you? What do you teach? Do you not teach that if anyone responds to what Jesus taught is then eternally condemned? I read what the scriptures says and I followed the instructions, then I was saved. There were not instructions that say believe and be careful not to obey, like Pate teaches.

You are just as bad as the Calvinists.

 

[God's Truth]

I dont honor the christ u serve ! You dont Honor the Christ of scripture, you teach that sinners He shed His Blood for are still lost and condemned ! That dishonors Him !

There is a lake of fire for a reason.

 

[Robert Pate]

How about you? What do you teach? Do you not teach that if anyone responds to what Jesus taught is then eternally condemned? I read what the scriptures says and I followed the instructions, then I was saved. There were not instructions that say believe and be careful not to obey, like Pate teaches.

You are just as bad as the Calvinists.

You followed the instructions and were saved?

You are about as lost as they come.