ECT God never predestines anyone to hell.
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Word based mystic
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scripture
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1 tim 2:4 This is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior, 4who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth. 5For there is one God, and one mediator also between God and men, the man Christ Jesus,…
mediator between God and men verifies the desire for all men to be saved
Gods desire is that (all) (men) to be saved.
God Brought Christ for the opportunity and possibility that All Men to be saved.
2 peter 3:9 The Lord is not slow about His promise, as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, not wishing for any to perish but for all to come to repentance.
Gods desire that NO ONE or (any) should perish was so strong He is willing to be PATIENT for the possibility and opportunity that (ALL) come to repentance.
you would add to scripture by implying words like (ALL) and (ANY) be ignored to fit your calvinistic man made philosophy.
You're anger and hate towards men guides your interpretation of scripture to ignore main themes of Gods love, patience, longsuffering characters
God would not need the characteristics of longsuffering and patience if He had Predestined only (SOME) not all men to have the possibility and opportunity to be saved.
you are not walking in Gods Love in this you do not agree with Gods desire that (ALL MEN) nor is your character developed in patience and longsuffering.
So one would wonder due to your elimination of words and Gods desires Whether you KNOW God and His love for all His creation.
Do you preach the Gospel to all creation and every man you meet?
Or do you figure why bother GOD only wants to save SOME Men?
you have in the past ignored main theme and contentions of peoples reply to you and harped with one liners without going through each point.
you also in the past have ignored scriptures that contradict your hateful view of lost sinners and those who disagree with you.
scripture
This is not a universalist reply.
1 tim 2:4 This is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior, 4who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth. 5For there is one God, and one mediator also between God and men, the man Christ Jesus,…
mediator between God and men verifies the desire for all men to be saved
Gods desire is that (all) (men) to be saved.
God Brought Christ for the opportunity and possibility that All Men to be saved.
2 peter 3:9 The Lord is not slow about His promise, as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, not wishing for any to perish but for all to come to repentance.
Gods desire that NO ONE or (any) should perish was so strong He is willing to be PATIENT for the possibility and opportunity that (ALL) come to repentance.
you would add to scripture by implying words like (ALL) and (ANY) be ignored to fit your calvinistic man made philosophy.
You're anger and hate towards men guides your interpretation of scripture to ignore main themes of Gods love, patience, longsuffering characters
God would not need the characteristics of longsuffering and patience if He had Predestined only (SOME) not all men to have the possibility and opportunity to be saved.
you are not walking in Gods Love in this you do not agree with Gods desire that (ALL MEN) nor is your character developed in patience and longsuffering.
So one would wonder due to your elimination of words and Gods desires Whether you KNOW God and His love for all His creation.
Do you preach the Gospel to all creation and every man you meet?
Or do you figure why bother GOD only wants to save SOME Men?
you have in the past ignored main theme and contentions of peoples reply to you and harped with one liners without going through each point.
you also in the past have ignored scriptures that contradict your hateful view of lost sinners and those who disagree with you.
beloved57
Well-known member
So where is the scripture that says :
God never predestines anyone to hell ?
Cross Reference
New member
Which never violates 'Himself' when exercised by Him.
"I AM that I AM" means, 'I will be whatever I need to be that people understand'.
beloved57
Well-known member
What scripture says that is what it means ? Please provide it, or should we take your word for it ?
He is what He is but no one can come unless God does something first while the sovereignty of God is so hateful to Humanism and Arminianism
Word based mystic
New member
Romans 10:9
that if you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved;
you can toss this scripture out as well to suit your calvi gospel.
words like (if) and (confess), believe in your heart, you will be saved.
how much more scripture will you dismiss. (IF),
Romans 10:9-10
that if you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved; for with the heart a person believes, resulting in righteousness, and with the mouth he confesses, resulting in salvation.
ephesians 2:8-9
For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; not as a result of works, so that no one may boast.
This scripture verifies that The Work on the cross and by His grace and Righteousness we are saved.
Not by any works or obedience to the law, because that is insufficient.
we do not boast because Righteousness is (in) HIM not of ourselves.
The above scripture shows the fullness of the salvation process.
He does the work. AND we respond by confessing and believing.
2 kings 13:19
Then he said, "Take the arrows," and he took them. And he said to the king of Israel, "Strike the ground," and he struck it three times and stopped. 19So the man of God was angry with him and said, "You should have struck five or six times, then you would have struck Aram until you would have destroyed it. But now you shall strike Aram only three times.
John 3:16
"For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life.
That (whoever) any and all men that (believes) responsive believing to a gift offered.
you can twist and ignore the words and principles all you like it does not change it.
John 1:12 John 1:12
But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, even to those who believe in His name
(received Him) passive acceptance of HIS Work/Gift.
Even to those who (Believe) in His name. Believe another passive/responsive action to HIS Righteous Work.
John 12:32 And I, if I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all men to Myself."
draw (all men) to myself brings a full context to
John 6:44
"No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him; and I will raise him up on the last day.
So we know it is the fathers desire/drawing that all men should be saved.
Not all respond to the Gift
But We preach the gospel to all men/creatures so that they may have the opportunity to respond to HIS WORK.
that if you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved;
you can toss this scripture out as well to suit your calvi gospel.
words like (if) and (confess), believe in your heart, you will be saved.
how much more scripture will you dismiss. (IF),
Romans 10:9-10
that if you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved; for with the heart a person believes, resulting in righteousness, and with the mouth he confesses, resulting in salvation.
ephesians 2:8-9
For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; not as a result of works, so that no one may boast.
This scripture verifies that The Work on the cross and by His grace and Righteousness we are saved.
Not by any works or obedience to the law, because that is insufficient.
we do not boast because Righteousness is (in) HIM not of ourselves.
The above scripture shows the fullness of the salvation process.
He does the work. AND we respond by confessing and believing.
2 kings 13:19
Then he said, "Take the arrows," and he took them. And he said to the king of Israel, "Strike the ground," and he struck it three times and stopped. 19So the man of God was angry with him and said, "You should have struck five or six times, then you would have struck Aram until you would have destroyed it. But now you shall strike Aram only three times.
John 3:16
"For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life.
That (whoever) any and all men that (believes) responsive believing to a gift offered.
you can twist and ignore the words and principles all you like it does not change it.
John 1:12 John 1:12
But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, even to those who believe in His name
(received Him) passive acceptance of HIS Work/Gift.
Even to those who (Believe) in His name. Believe another passive/responsive action to HIS Righteous Work.
John 12:32 And I, if I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all men to Myself."
draw (all men) to myself brings a full context to
John 6:44
"No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him; and I will raise him up on the last day.
So we know it is the fathers desire/drawing that all men should be saved.
Not all respond to the Gift
But We preach the gospel to all men/creatures so that they may have the opportunity to respond to HIS WORK.
Human beings has no interest in seeking after God (Romans 3:11), our will chooses, 100% of the time, to turn from God rather than towards him.
Word based mystic
New member
see beloved you did not respond to the scriptures that give the context that God wants and desires and gives the opportunity for all men to come to him and not perish
you just proved one of my points about you closing your ears and eyes to the obvious Intent that (GOD DOES NOT DESIRE THAT ANY SHOULD PERISH)
shouting through satans deafening your ears and blinding your eyes.
you just proved one of my points about you closing your ears and eyes to the obvious Intent that (GOD DOES NOT DESIRE THAT ANY SHOULD PERISH)
shouting through satans deafening your ears and blinding your eyes.
Cross Reference
New member
Sorry but, that doesn't compute since God did all up front that man is left without an excuse for not coming to Him.. Learn that to know the book you have been reading about the sovereignty of God is based upon a false religious doctrine that, among other things, renders God unjust.
Cross Reference
New member
Gen 4:26 KJV. Deal with it.
The convent family was making its petition and praise in the name of the lord, glorifies God, not man
Cross Reference
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What covenant family? Is that what your book is telling you?
Word based mystic
New member
well, nicely put but not in full context
you also ignore the receptive/passive response to The Gift of salvation.
His Work enables us to respond to the Gift. We can't WORK for it. His work on the cross not our observation of the (law).
continue on in romans for a fuller context
your one liners dont do anyone justice (full context please) the full context is repenting, believing, confessing. Ignore those words all you want but in ignoring them you ignore the main them and fullness of scripture.
Romans 2-5
For if Abraham were justified by works, he hath whereof to glory; but not before God.
3 For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness.
4 Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt.
5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.
believing on him. His work. not ours.
his Faith (abrahams)
faith is responsive action.
you also took the romans 3:11 out of context to our discussion.
continue to read romans 3:19-22 It is pointedly discussing the law.
vs 22 reaffirms what we are speaking of in receiving and responding to Gift of salvation "the righteousness of God through (faith) in Jesus Christ for (all) those who (believe)
vs 28 also reaffirms "for we maintain that a man is justified by (faith) apart from the (works) of the law
NOT our works of the law But Christs work we (believe, repent, confess) in
Romans 6 and 7 affirm that we are all sinful yes everyone.
no one here has said otherwise.
Romans 6:11-13New American Standard Bible (NASB)
11 Even so consider yourselves to be dead to sin, but alive to God in Christ Jesus.
12 Therefore do not let sin reign in your mortal body so that you obey its lusts, 13 and do not go on presenting [a]the members of your body to sin as instruments of unrighteousness; but present yourselves to God as those alive from the dead, and your members as [c]instruments of righteousness to God.
notice the active roll we take in the above scripture. our flesh/soul should not control our actions, but rather submit to the Spirits working and will in our inner man.
please read all of romans 6 and 7 for the full context not your one liner doctrine
for you have not (received) a spirit of slavery but you have (received)
a spirit of adoption
notice the word (receive) receptive, passive embracing of a free gift.
Cross Reference
New member
Genesis 4:26 needs no context. Let it say what it says. Once one does that limits are placed upon speculation.
Word based mystic
New member
great scripture
great scripture
great scripture i will remember that one.
Here is another that shows Gods latitude in how man responds to God.
2 kings 13:19
Then he said, "Take the arrows," and he took them. And he said to the king of Israel, "Strike the ground," and he struck it three times and stopped. 19So the man of God was angry with him and said, "You should have struck five or six times, then you would have struck Aram until you would have destroyed it. But now you shall strike Aram only three times.
great scripture
great scripture i will remember that one.
Here is another that shows Gods latitude in how man responds to God.
2 kings 13:19
Then he said, "Take the arrows," and he took them. And he said to the king of Israel, "Strike the ground," and he struck it three times and stopped. 19So the man of God was angry with him and said, "You should have struck five or six times, then you would have struck Aram until you would have destroyed it. But now you shall strike Aram only three times.
Cross Reference
New member
Notice that God makes no exceptions in what man determines for himself. He never goes against his will in either direction either for good or evil. God tells us here that wouldn't: "And the LORD smelled a sweet savour; and the LORD said in his heart, I will not again curse the ground any more for man's sake; for the imagination of man's heart is evil from his youth; neither will I again smite any more every thing living, as I have done." Genesis 8:21 (KJV)
Translation: Though God reserved for Himself, should the need arise for man's cooperation in a matter of His concern, the means to persuade him, He declared He would not otherwise interfere will the will of man which left man the freedom to move about independent of any decree aside from His law that would regulate morality.
Has he not said, "Ye are gods"?
beloved57
Well-known member
Promoting salvation by works, by what a person does, so that is boasting !