Foundation.

[Tambora]

Here is the passage in question:

Therefore, as through one man’s offense judgment came to all men, resulting in condemnation, even so through one Man’s righteous act the free gift came to all men, resulting in justification of life.For as by one man’s disobedience many were made sinners, so also by one Man’s obedience many will be made righteous. - Romans 5:18-19 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Romans5:18-19&version=NKJV

I don't see Paul telling anyone to train themselves in those two verses. Try again.

She never addresses what you ask, but instead answers what she wished you had asked.
She does that all the time to try and throw you off track of her glaring errors.

 

[Tambora]

Who said it is forced?
Grace does not mean no obey, it means no circumcision and no animal sacrifices.

Grace is UNMERITED favor. No circumcision or animal sacrifice or any work of the law required for grace.

 

[God's Truth]

Grace is UNMERITED favor. No circumcision or animal sacrifice or any work of the law required for grace.

Can you give me the scripture about unmerited favor?
I check on everything someone tries to teach me.
I have been in many false denominations and I am careful not to believe any more teachings from men.

 

[God's Truth]

She never addresses what you ask, but instead answers what she wished you had asked.
She does that all the time to try and throw you off track of her glaring errors.

I can hardly believe you say that about me. It's like trying to explain to Meshak we can say we are saved.

 

[God's Truth]

Paul is saying that it is by the righteousness and obedience of one.
Why do you go against GOD's truth and try to change it to two?

Jesus says he choose to save those who obey.

 

[God's Truth]

Here is the passage in question:

Therefore, as through one man’s offense judgment came to all men, resulting in condemnation, even so through one Man’s righteous act the free gift came to all men, resulting in justification of life.For as by one man’s disobedience many were made sinners, so also by one Man’s obedience many will be made righteous. - Romans 5:18-19 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Romans5:18-19&version=NKJV

That grace can only be entered into one way, and that is by faith that is alive.
See Romans 5:2.
You should have read up a little bit more you might have seen that.

I don't see Paul telling anyone to train themselves in those two verses. Try again.

Are you denying the scripture where Paul says to train yourselves to be godly?

 

[JudgeRightly]

That grace can only be entered into one way, and that is by faith that is alive.
See Romans 5:2.
You should have read up a little bit more you might have seen that.

Spoiler

Therefore, having been justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ,through whom also we have access by faith into this grace in which we stand, and rejoice in hope of the glory of God.And not only that, but we also glory in tribulations, knowing that tribulation produces perseverance;and perseverance, character; and character, hope.Now hope does not disappoint, because the love of God has been poured out in our hearts by the Holy Spirit who was given to us.For when we were still without strength, in due time Christ died for the ungodly.For scarcely for a righteous man will one die; yet perhaps for a good man someone would even dare to die.But God demonstrates His own love toward us, in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us.Much more then, having now been justified by His blood, we shall be saved from wrath through Him.For if when we were enemies we were reconciled to God through the death of His Son, much more, having been reconciled, we shall be saved by His life.And not only that, but we also rejoice in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom we have now received the reconciliation.Therefore, just as through one man sin entered the world, and death through sin, and thus death spread to all men, because all sinned—(For until the law sin was in the world, but sin is not imputed when there is no law.Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over those who had not sinned according to the likeness of the transgression of Adam, who is a type of Him who was to come.But the free gift is not like the offense. For if by the one man’s offense many died, much more the grace of God and the gift by the grace of the one Man, Jesus Christ, abounded to many.And the gift is not like that which came through the one who sinned. For the judgment which came from one offense resulted in condemnation, but the free gift which came from many offenses resulted in justification.For if by the one man’s offense death reigned through the one, much more those who receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness will reign in life through the One, Jesus Christ.)Therefore, as through one man’s offense judgment came to all men, resulting in condemnation, even so through one Man’s righteous act the free gift came to all men, resulting in justification of life.For as by one man’s disobedience many were made sinners, so also by one Man’s obedience many will be made righteous.Moreover the law entered that the offense might abound. But where sin abounded, grace abounded much more,so that as sin reigned in death, even so grace might reign through righteousness to eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord. - Romans 5:1-21 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Romans5:1-21&version=NKJV

I don't see "faith that is alive" anywhere in that entire chapter. I also don't see "faith accompanied by works." I see faith giving us access to grace, though, and that we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ.

Are you denying the scripture where Paul says to train yourselves to be godly?

I'm saying that you're in the wrong chapter and/or book. We're talking about Romans 5 here.

 

[Tambora]

Can you give me the scripture about unmerited favor?
I check on everything someone tries to teach me.
I have been in many false denominations and I am careful not to believe any more teachings from men.

How do you ever get that you have to EARN grace????????

 

[God's Truth]

Spoiler

Therefore, having been justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ,through whom also we have access by faith into this grace in which we stand, and rejoice in hope of the glory of God.And not only that, but we also glory in tribulations, knowing that tribulation produces perseverance;and perseverance, character; and character, hope.Now hope does not disappoint, because the love of God has been poured out in our hearts by the Holy Spirit who was given to us.For when we were still without strength, in due time Christ died for the ungodly.For scarcely for a righteous man will one die; yet perhaps for a good man someone would even dare to die.But God demonstrates His own love toward us, in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us.Much more then, having now been justified by His blood, we shall be saved from wrath through Him.For if when we were enemies we were reconciled to God through the death of His Son, much more, having been reconciled, we shall be saved by His life.And not only that, but we also rejoice in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom we have now received the reconciliation.Therefore, just as through one man sin entered the world, and death through sin, and thus death spread to all men, because all sinned—(For until the law sin was in the world, but sin is not imputed when there is no law.Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over those who had not sinned according to the likeness of the transgression of Adam, who is a type of Him who was to come.But the free gift is not like the offense. For if by the one man’s offense many died, much more the grace of God and the gift by the grace of the one Man, Jesus Christ, abounded to many.And the gift is not like that which came through the one who sinned. For the judgment which came from one offense resulted in condemnation, but the free gift which came from many offenses resulted in justification.For if by the one man’s offense death reigned through the one, much more those who receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness will reign in life through the One, Jesus Christ.)Therefore, as through one man’s offense judgment came to all men, resulting in condemnation, even so through one Man’s righteous act the free gift came to all men, resulting in justification of life.For as by one man’s disobedience many were made sinners, so also by one Man’s obedience many will be made righteous.Moreover the law entered that the offense might abound. But where sin abounded, grace abounded much more,so that as sin reigned in death, even so grace might reign through righteousness to eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord. - Romans 5:1-21 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Romans5:1-21&version=NKJV

I don't see "faith that is alive" anywhere in that entire chapter. I also don't see "faith accompanied by works." I see faith giving us access to grace, though, and that we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ.



I'm saying that you're in the wrong chapter and/or book. We're talking about Romans 5 here.

I don't read long spoilers.

As for you saying it doesn't say living faith, you need to consider the whole counsel of God.

James says faith alone is dead and must be accompanied by right action.

Now that you know that James said that, you should now look at the word faith as it should be, and that is it must be alive.

 

[Tambora]

I can hardly believe you say that about me. It's like trying to explain to Meshak we can say we are saved.

Anybody can say they are saved.

 

[musterion]

How do you ever get that you have to EARN grace????????

Paul did call it a gift.

A gift can be refused but never earned.

GT doesn't believe that at all.

 

[Tambora]

Paul is saying that it is by the righteousness and obedience of one.
Why do you go against GOD's truth and try to change it to two?

Jesus says he choose to save those who obey.

How you get that your response even attempts to answer if Romans 5:18-19 says one or two?????????
Why is it that you think you have to avoid what that scripture says, GT??????????

HINT HINT HINT HINT HINT HINT
That one ain't you, GT.

 

[God's Truth]

How do you ever get that you have to EARN grace????????

So does that mean you do not have scripture that says grace is by unmerited favor?
I searched for it and I couldn't find it, so I was thinking that maybe you knew where that scripture is.
Grace is that we can be reconciled to God.
Jesus says he gives life to those he is pleased to give it.
Jesus tells us what we have to do to be the kind of people he saves.

 

[JudgeRightly]

I don't read long spoilers.

The spoiler is Romans 5 in it's entirety, so that you can reference it in our discussion about it.

As for you saying it doesn't say living faith, you need to consider the whole counsel of God.

James says faith alone is dead and must be accompanied by right action.

There you go again, not rightly dividing and using scripture that was intended for Israel and applying it to Christians...

Now that you know that James said that, you should now look at the word faith as it should be, and that is it must be alive.

I know that what James said in his book was intended for Israel (don't believe me? Read James 1:1), and not for Christians. And since Israel is under the covenant of law (which is faith and works) and not the covenant of grace (which is faith only), then we know that you're misusing scripture.

 

[musterion]

Paul said it is a gift.

 

[Tambora]

That grace can only be entered into one way, and that is by faith that is alive.
See Romans 5:2.
You should have read up a little bit more you might have seen that.



Are you denying the scripture where Paul says to train yourselves to be godly?

Galatians 2:20-21 KJV
(20) I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.
(21) I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.

Not by the faith IN the Son of God, but the faith OF the Son of God. (The faith of the Son.)

 

[God's Truth]

Anybody can say they are saved.

Right, but try to explain it to Meshak that someone CAN know they are saved is about as impossible to explain to you that Jesus saves us after we do some things that he tells us to do.

 

[Tambora]

So does that mean you do not have scripture that says grace is by unmerited favor?
I searched for it and I couldn't find it, so I was thinking that maybe you knew where that scripture is.
Grace is that we can be reconciled to God.
Jesus says he gives life to those he is pleased to give it.
Jesus tells us what we have to do to be the kind of people he saves.

How can you still owe something, GT, if the Lord Jesus Christ paid in FULL?

 

[God's Truth]

Paul did call it a gift.

A gift can be refused but never earned.

GT doesn't believe that at all.

Jesus chooses to give the gift to those who believe and obey him.

 

[Tambora]

Right, but try to explain it to Meshak that someone CAN know they are saved is about as impossible to explain to you that Jesus saves us after we do some things that he tells us to do.

Who cares what Meshak thinks?
What does Meshak have to do with YOU not believing GOD's word that it is by the righteousness and obedience of one, GT?