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God's Truth

God's Truth

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Spockrates said:
Then why do I fear letting him down? Perhaps because the fear of disappointing Him is not the kind of fear His love drives away?


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...but if you are disappointing Him, then it means you are not obeying Him. Why fear something you have no plan on doing? If you do not plan on disappointing God, then why would you fear it?
 
meshak

meshak

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So many churchgoers or Christians strive to accommodate already established corrupt faith.

their reasoning is full of holes that easy to detect.

OP is one of them,
 
Spockrates

Spockrates

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Foundation.

Truster said:
You do disappoint Him in every thought, word and deed. If you trust in your ability to please the Father you will always fail.

" This is my beloved Son, hear Him".
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Yeah, no. Not so sure he has the same disappointment in me that I have in myself. Think about it: If God lives outside time, He sees all of me--from the day I was born till the day I die. At the beginning he knows the end. I do not see what He sees--how my disappointments will shape me into what I want to become, into what he knows I am, when I finally get there.

So while my ending might be a disappointment to Him, how I fail Him now is likely only disappointing to me. At least it is if it's true that God's already in the future.


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Spockrates

Spockrates

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God's Truth said:
Of course we do not want to disappoint God. But I really think saying we fear disappointing Him goes around the truth, for the Bible says fear God because of wrath. I mean why would you fear disappointing Him? Why use the word fear when speaking of disappointment?
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Not sure I understand. You've never been afraid of failure? Perhaps we don't share the same experience. I fear I've been great disappointment to my earthly father.


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meshak

meshak

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Spockrates said:
Yeah, no. Not so sure he has the same disappointment in me that I have in myself. Think about it: If God lives outside time, He sees all of me--from the day I was born till the day I die. At the beginning he knows the end. I do not see what He sees--how my disappointments will shape me into what I want to become, into what he knows I am, when I finally get there.

So while my ending might be a disappointment to Him, how I fail Him now is likely only disappointing to me. At least it is if it's true that God's already in the future.


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I know God is merciful. I know I am powerless and cannot do much, but I know He knows I am trying. If we stop trying to please Him, then we are in trouble.

Jesus says with God, anything is possible. I believe what Jesus is saying is that if we strive to please Him, the Holy Spirit fills our imperfection work and make it perfect in God's eye.

this is my overall and contextual perspective.
 
T

Truster

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Spockrates said:
Yeah, no. Not so sure he has the same disappointment in me that I have in myself. Think about it: If God lives outside time, He sees all of me--from the day I was born till the day I die. At the beginning he knows the end. I do not see what He sees--how my disappointments will shape me into what I want to become, into what he knows I am, when I finally get there.

So while my ending might be a disappointment to Him, how I fail Him now is likely only disappointing to me. At least it is if it's true that God's already in the future.


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I asked you a few days ago to give an account of your salvation and you didn't. It's called "always being prepared to give an account for the hope that is in you". You didn't do so. I have answered questions for you so would you mind affording me the same courtesy.
 
Spockrates

Spockrates

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meshak said:
I know God is merciful. I know I am powerless and cannot do much, but I know He knows I am trying. If we stop trying to please Him, then we are in trouble.

Jesus says with God, anything is possible. I believe what Jesus is saying is that if we strive to please Him, the Holy Spirit fills our imperfection work and make it perfect in God's eye.

this is my overall and contextual perspective.
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Yes. Perhaps it's the desire of the heart and not the result of the action He sees?


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popsthebuilder

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Truster said:
Repentance does not mean sorry. Repentance does generate heart felt sorrow, but sorrow is not what repentance is. Sorrow is on two differing levels. Sorrow of the world which is spoken at the drop of a hat. It has no depth, is almost immediately forgotten and the matter for what "sorry" was expressed is repeated time and again.

Then we have reverent sorrow that is from the heart(will). It is sincere and makes sure the matter is not repeated. This sorrow flows from repentance, but as I said, it is the effect or fruit of repentance. This true sorrow also generates further repentance.
The betrayal being repeated proves that it was sorrow, as the world knows sorrow, and not the fruit of repentance."By their fruit ye shall know them".


"For reverent sorrow worketh repentance to salvation not to be repented of: but the sorrow of the world worketh death". 2 Corinthians 7:10

This verse condemns insincere sorrow. So everytime someone says sorry to you as you go through your day. They are killing themselves, because worldly sorrow worketh death.


Repentance is a spiritual endowment. It is one of the gifts that heirs receive under the terms of the “will” of the Eternal Almighty. Repentance and by default the ability to repent is not inherent in man. It cannot be apprehended by learning nor by religious experience. The gift of repentance is received upon regeneration. It is not of the soul and therefore not an emotion, although it does generate reverent sorrow.
Repentance is a spiritual change in which the eyes of the understanding are opened and a vision of the attributes of Deity are clearly perceived for the first time. There is no room for doubt in that first, penetrating beam of spiritual light, and the repentant sinner knows things and can see things clearly for the very first time. Repentance and trust are spiritual gifts that are permanently entwined, so that one both confirms and strengthens the other. The gift of trust and repentance received at one and the same time, is the most exhilarating experience and a man will always remember where he was and when the eyes of his understanding were first opened. He is suddenly a new man and he knows for an absolute fact he will never be the same again. In the weeks months and years following there will be more times of repentance. The experience does not diminish and can only be described as extreme blessing. You begin to realise, on each and every occasion, you have been granted repentance that you have changed inside and have a certain knowledge you’ll never be the same again. The inner man is being renewed day, by day. I used to describe the experience like climbing a mountain. The struggle to reach what seems like the top only to discover another top. You reach a plateau of rest and pleasant walking where you enjoy the views, before taking on, or rather, being taken to new heights. Just as climbing is exhausting in the physical sense repentance is spiritually exhausting, because each time a part of the “old self” dies before being replaced with another mentality.

In his natural, fallen state, man has a viewpoint that is clouded by and with sin. In his regenerate state all things are become new and the eyes of the understanding or the mind are part of that renewal. Repentance is “another mentality”. There was an old, natural mentality, that we inherit from Adam and there is the new mentality that we inherit from the Last Adam and our Eternal Saviour.
This lines up with “But we have the mind of Messiah”. 1 Corinthians 2:16 KJV 2 Corinthians 5:17 and Romans 12:2
The latter verse confirms that repentance once received is ongoing. Justification is an event that happens once, is complete, cannot be added to and is final, eternal and blessed. Amen. Repentance is the power behind sanctification and we are always being sanctified. Justification is permanent. Sanctification is by degree and therefore repentance, once received, is ongoing.
A man cannot pray for repentance, but a repentant man will pray in spirit. A man does not repent to be re-born again from above. A man repents, because he has been born again from above.
In the first creation Elohim said, “let there be Light and Light became”. In the new creation Elohim says, “Let there be Light and the man is inwardly enlightened” not from power within, but from Almighty Power without, enlightening the inner man.


Repentance is finding the strait gate. Passing through the gate is repentance being applied to the Sovereignty of Elohim. Walking the narrow way is a life of repentance in which the comforts and enjoyments of what the world has to offer are slowly, but surely recognised for their sinfulness and discarded. You are actually called "narrow minded" and there is no greater blessing and amen.

Natural man will despise this truth, but the renewed man will embrace it, because he’ll recognise the experience. When I was converted I wanted everybody I knew and those I didn’t know. To have what I have, to know what I know, to love how I love and to fellowship in the Father, Son and Holy Spirit with me. It was not the case and as my signature states, “I have since been further confirmed in this truth, because it was revealed to me who never sought it and never expected it and is withheld from thousands who are working hard to get it”.
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I ask you again; how does repentance cause sorrow. It is the spirit that works within the heart that brings about shame.

Sorrow is not repentance. We agree there. Sorrow brings about repentance I thought.

peace
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meshak

meshak

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Spockrates said:
I hear what you're saying. What God's Truth says sounds logical, too. Maybe you both have part of the full picture?


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I am not eloquent. My writing is not perfect.

Yes, we should strive to obey but I know we cannot achieve it perfectly because Jesus' standard is perfection. That's why we need HS's help.
 
Spockrates

Spockrates

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God's Truth said:
...but if you are disappointing Him, then it means you are not obeying Him. Why fear something you have no plan on doing? If you do not plan on disappointing God, then why would you fear it?
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Oh, yeah, I see now. Why do I fear disappointing God if I've already mad up my mind to sin, and so already decided to let him down.

Is that what you mean?


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popsthebuilder

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Spockrates said:
A more modern translation uses more familiar words to me:

2 Corinthians 7:10 "Godly sorrow causes repentance that leads to salvation and leaves no regret, but worldly sorrow causes death."

I'm thinking you're right. Godly sorrow is a cause of repentance, and it's logical to me that the thing caused cannot be the same as that which causes it. For an effect is never the same as its cause. So the effect we call repentance cannot possibly be the same as its cause, which we call godly sorrow.

Since repentance isn't godly sorrow, what then is it?


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It is to change direction; not in a wholly literal sense. It also means to stop.

When you see it says "repent not" in scripture in means do not stop.

peace

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