Everything Christian

Jacob

Jacob

BANNED
Banned
What does it mean to be a Christian?

I am both Jewish and Christian though neither by birth both by choice. I observe things considered to be Jewish by most Christians.

Can you share what you believe Christianity to be about? What is Christian and what does it mean to be Christian or to be a Christian?
 
H

HisServant

New member
You cannot be both... to be Jewish is to cling to the law... to be Christian is to be free from it.

Also, given how the Jewish people behaved in the Old Testament, I would be ashamed to call myself a Jew, if I were one.
 
Jacob

Jacob

BANNED
Banned
HisServant said:
You cannot be both... to be Jewish is to cling to the law... to be Christian is to be free from it.

Also, given how the Jewish people behaved in the Old Testament, I would be ashamed to call myself a Jew, if I were one.
Click to expand...
Not all who are Jewish cling to the Law. There are different views of the new covenant in Judaism.
 
H

HisServant

New member
Untellectual said:
The new covenant was first spoken of explicitly by the prophet Jeremiah. See Jeremiah 31:31-34.
Click to expand...

And that covenant was promised to NON-JEWS.. the house of Israel.. not the house of Judah (Jews).

And the giving of the Holy Spirit at Pentecost was that promised covenant... while the Jews are still blinded.
 
Jacob

Jacob

BANNED
Banned
HisServant said:
And that covenant was promised to NON-JEWS.. the house of Israel.. not the house of Judah (Jews).

And the giving of the Holy Spirit at Pentecost was that promised covenant... while the Jews are still blinded.
Click to expand...
Here are the verses so you can see them.

Jeremiah 31:31-34 NASB - 31 "Behold, days are coming," declares the LORD, "when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah, 32 not like the covenant which I made with their fathers in the day I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt, My covenant which they broke, although I was a husband to them," declares the LORD. 33 "But this is the covenant which I will make with the house of Israel after those days," declares the LORD, "I will put My law within them and on their heart I will write it; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people. 34 "They will not teach again, each man his neighbor and each man his brother, saying, 'Know the LORD,' for they will all know Me, from the least of them to the greatest of them," declares the LORD, "for I will forgive their iniquity, and their sin I will remember no more."
 
H

HisServant

New member
Untellectual said:
Here are the verses so you can see them.

Jeremiah 31:31-34 NASB - 31 "Behold, days are coming," declares the LORD, "when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah, 32 not like the covenant which I made with their fathers in the day I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt, My covenant which they broke, although I was a husband to them," declares the LORD. 33 "But this is the covenant which I will make with the house of Israel after those days," declares the LORD, "I will put My law within them and on their heart I will write it; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people. 34 "They will not teach again, each man his neighbor and each man his brother, saying, 'Know the LORD,' for they will all know Me, from the least of them to the greatest of them," declares the LORD, "for I will forgive their iniquity, and their sin I will remember no more."
Click to expand...

Yup, that covenant is with the House of Israel... which is very distinct from the house of Judah!

I also find it interesting that God refers to the non-Jewish House of Israel as HIS PEOPLE and leaves the Jews out in the cold.
That verse says nothing about what the promised covenant is to the house of Judah.
 
Jacob

Jacob

BANNED
Banned
HisServant said:
Yup, that covenant is with the House of Israel... which is very distinct from the house of Judah!

I also find it interesting that God refers to the non-Jewish House of Israel as HIS PEOPLE and leaves the Jews out in the cold.
That verse says nothing about what the promised covenant is to the house of Judah.
Click to expand...
The verse you are objecting to is the first one.

Jeremiah 31:31 NASB - 31 "Behold, days are coming," declares the LORD, "when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah,
 
H

HisServant

New member
Untellectual said:
The verse you are objecting to is the first one.

Jeremiah 31:31 NASB - 31 "Behold, days are coming," declares the LORD, "when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah,
Click to expand...

But later, he explicitly says this is the covenant I will make with the House of Israel.

Why mention both houses in the beginning and then only mention one when stating the promise? He mentions both because they are different.

Obviously, the promise is not for the House of Judah.
 
Jacob

Jacob

BANNED
Banned
HisServant said:
But later, he explicitly says this is the covenant I will make with the House of Israel.

Why mention both houses in the beginning and then only mention one when stating the promise? He mentions both because they are different.

Obviously, the promise is not for the House of Judah.
Click to expand...
Think about it. Do you believe the house of Israel was in the land during the time of Jesus? The house of Judah was for certain (I have asked others about the house of Israel before). Jesus was of the tribe of Judah. Paul was of the tribe of Benjamin. Barnabas was of the tribe of Levi.
 
H

HisServant

New member
Untellectual said:
Think about it. Do you believe the house of Israel was in the land during the time of Jesus? The house of Judah was for certain (I have asked others about the house of Israel before). Jesus was of the tribe of Judah. Paul was of the tribe of Benjamin. Barnabas was of the tribe of Levi.
Click to expand...

Israel being back in the land was not a requirement of this covenant.
 
H

HisServant

New member
Untellectual said:
Do you recognize the covenant as having come in the first century or in the time corresponding to the first century?
Click to expand...

As Paul goes to great lengths to show in Romans... the covenant had nothing to do with ethnic Israel or Jews... Abraham's seed is evidenced by the faith he had.

Paul was so distraught over it, he would rather have seen himself cut off for the sake of the Jews.... he realized the truth.
 
Jacob

Jacob

BANNED
Banned
HisServant said:
As Paul goes to great lengths to show in Romans... the covenant had nothing to do with ethnic Israel or Jews... Abraham's seed is evidenced by the faith he had.

Paul was so distraught over it, he would rather have seen himself cut off for the sake of the Jews.... he realized the truth.
Click to expand...
The covenant didn't come with Paul, it came with Jesus.
 
H

HisServant

New member
Untellectual said:
The covenant didn't come with Paul, it came with Jesus.
Click to expand...

Yes, it did come with Jesus.... but like with most things Jewish, when God finally arrived on the scene and started fulfilling his promises they were so entrenched into their understandings and traditions of their faith, they were blind to it.

Which is why Paul had to explain it.... the Jews are blind to the fact that God fulfilled his promise and they refuse to admit it.

Which is expected behavior, given the record of their historical behavior in the Old Testament.... God had to call prophets again and again and again because they were so hard headed they kept losing their way.

Which brings me back to the fact that I view Judaism as the single biggest FAILURE of all time... if God could love them, he can love anyone.
 
Jacob

Jacob

BANNED
Banned
HisServant said:
Yes, it did come with Jesus.... but like with most things Jewish, when God finally arrived on the scene and started fulfilling his promises they were so entrenched into their understandings and traditions of their faith, they were blind to it.

Which is why Paul had to explain it.... the Jews are blind to the fact that God fulfilled his promise and they refuse to admit it.
Click to expand...
The early church was entirely Jewish.
 
H

HisServant

New member
Untellectual said:
The early church was entirely Jewish.
Click to expand...

There were Greeks and others... it was not entirely Jewish. Ethiopian Eunuch, etc.

Jesus work was to the Jew first and then the Gentile... one can wonder whether he was using the Jews only as a stepping stone for something greater.
 
H

HisServant

New member
Untellectual said:
After the church was born there were Gentiles who came to believe, they came to have faith.
Click to expand...

There was no 'church' born. Jesus and the Apostles were shepherds of an ekklesia.... those who heard the word and believed and were indwelt with the holy spirit. They were called out by God. Ethnicity did not matter.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top