Does God know the future?
- Thread starter intro2faith
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intro2faith
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Okay, I think you may have changed my mind on this subject. MAYBE. I do have one question though, and if someone can answer this Biblically, then I guess I'll have switched sides on this matter 
Okay here it goes. WHY is God limited to time? Why can't He be living in the past, present and future all at once?
Okay here it goes. WHY is God limited to time? Why can't He be living in the past, present and future all at once?
Z Man, I am not going to bicker with you any longer. I am not going to play these games.Z Man said:
I like you. I bet we would be great buddies if we were neighbors.
I apologize for any hurt feelings I may have caused in this thread. How would you like to go "One on One" with me for a week, that way you can address any scripture that you desire. Deal?
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nancy said:
Circular reasoning/begging the question/assuming what you are trying to prove. Eternity, in the Hebraic mindset, means an everlasting duration of time (Ps. 90:2; Rev. 1:8). There are a couple verses in Revelation that show there is time in heaven (1/2 hour), which is eternity. Timelessness is a pagan, Platonic concept of eternity. "Eternity means no succession" is your view, not explicitly biblical...from everlasting to everlasting is endless time with history in between.
intro2faith said:Okay, I think you may have changed my mind on this subject. MAYBE. I do have one question though, and if someone can answer this Biblically, then I guess I'll have switched sides on this matter
Okay here it goes. WHY is God limited to time? Why can't He be living in the past, present and future all at once?
Presentism. The past no longer exists, the future is not yet, only the present is experientially real.
Because He is a Living God. God is rational in that He can think one thought after another, do one thing after another etc.intro2faith said:Okay, I think you may have changed my mind on this subject. MAYBE. I do have one question though, and if someone can answer this Biblically, then I guess I'll have switched sides on this matter
Okay here it goes. WHY is God limited to time? Why can't He be living in the past, present and future all at once?
He created and then rested. He didn't rest and then create or rest and create all at the same time.
Genesis 2:2 And on the seventh day God ended His work which He had done, and He rested on the seventh day from all His work which He had done.
Christ is no longer suffering on the cross. It's over, it's finished!
John 19:30 So when Jesus had received the sour wine, He said, “It is finished!” And bowing His head, He gave up His spirit.
There are literally thousands of examples like this on almost every page of the Bible.
The Bible presents God in a rational way and He is a rational God. We are created in His image and therefore also experience one thought after another in a sucession.
intro2faith
New member
Knight said:
Okay, that completely makes sense to me. I'm officially switched to the other side!
I just thought I'd let you know that the post by JCAthiest(post #897) is the thing that really convinced me. Not only was it an awesome analogy, but he presented it in a loving manner. Thanks
Excellent! :up:intro2faith said:I just thought I'd let you know that the post by JCAthiest(post #897) is the thing that really convinced me. Not only was it an awesome analogy, but he presented it in a loving manner. Thanks
Now I want to go back and read that post, it sounds like a good one.
Z Man
New member
The Bible says He is.intro2faith said:Okay, I think you may have changed my mind on this subject. MAYBE. I do have one question though, and if someone can answer this Biblically, then I guess I'll have switched sides on this matter
Okay here it goes. WHY is God limited to time? Why can't He be living in the past, present and future all at once?
Time is not fatalistic or capricious, but, according to Scripture, under God's personal direction and control. Time began at creation and becomes the agency through which God continues to unveil his divine purpose for it.
God is transcendent over time. He established the cycle of days and seasons by which time is known and reckoned (Gen 1:14) and possesses the power to dissolve them according to his eternal purposes (Isa 60:19-20); moreover, he controls world history, determining in advance the times set for all nations and bringing them to pass (Dan 2:21; Acts 17:26). But God is not limited by time (Psalm 90:4). It in no sense diminishes his person or work: the eternal God does not grow tired or weary (Isa 40:28) and his purposes prevail (Prov 16:4; Isa 46:10).
Genesis 1:14
Then God said, "Let there be lights in the expanse of the sky to separate the day from the night. They will serve as signs for festivals and for days and years.
Isaiah 60:19-20
The sun will no longer be your light by day,
and the brightness of the moon will not shine on you;
but the Lord will be your everlasting light,
and your God will be your splendor.
Your sun will no longer set,
and your moon will not fade;
for the Lord will be your everlasting light,
and the days of your sorrow will be over.
Daniel 2:21
And He changes the times and the seasons; He removes kings and raises up kings; He gives wisdom to the wise And knowledge to those who have understanding.
Acts 17:26
And He has made from one blood every nation of men to dwell on all the face of the earth, and has determined their preappointed times and the boundaries of their dwellings,
Psalms 90:4
For a thousand years in Your sight are like yesterday when it is past, and like a watch in the night.
Isaiah 40:28
Have you not known? Have you not heard? The everlasting God, the Lord, The Creator of the ends of the earth, Neither faints nor is weary. His understanding is unsearchable.
Proverbs 16:4
The Lord has made all for Himself, Yes, even the wicked for the day of doom.
Isaiah 46:10
Declaring the end from the beginning, And from ancient times things that are not yet done, Saying, 'My counsel shall stand, And I will do all My pleasure,'
Furthermore, God imminently expresses concern for his creation. He reveals himself in history according to the times and dates set by his own authority (Acts 1:7) and will bring about in his own time the consummation of world history in Jesus' return (Eph 1:9-10; 1 Tim 6:15).
Acts 1:7
And He said to them, "It is not for you to know times or seasons which the Father has put in His own authority."
Ephesians 1:9-10
...having made known to us the mystery of His will, according to His good pleasure which He purposed in Himself, that in the dispensation of the fullness of the times He might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven and which are on earth--in Him.
1 Timothy 6:15
...which He will manifest in His own time, He who is the blessed and only Potentate, the King of kings and Lord of lords...
God as "the First and Last" (Isa 41:4; 44:6; 48:12), "the Beginning and End" (Rev 21:6), "the one who is, was, and is to come" (Rev 1:4,8), "King of the Ages" (1 Tim 1:17; Rev 15:3) further points out his lordship over time.
Isaiah 41:4; 44:6; 48:12
Who has performed and done it, Calling the generations from the beginning? ' I, the Lord, am the first; And with the last I am He.' "
"Thus says the Lord, the King of Israel, And his Redeemer, the Lord of hosts: 'I am the First and I am the Last; Besides Me there is no God.'"
"Listen to Me, O Jacob, And Israel, My called: I am He, I am the First, I am also the Last"
Revelations 21:6
And He said to me, "It is done! I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End. I will give of the fountain of the water of life freely to him who thirsts."
Revelations 1:4, 8
John, to the seven churches which are in Asia:Grace to you and peace from Him who is and who was and who is to come, and from the seven Spirits who are before His throne...
"I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End," says the Lord, "who is and who was and who is to come, the Almighty."
1 Timothy 1:17
Now to the King eternal, immortal, invisible, to God who alone is wise, be honor and glory forever and ever. Amen.
Revelations 15:3
They sing the song of Moses, the servant of God, and the song of the Lamb, saying: "Great and marvelous are Your works, Lord God Almighty! Just and true are Your ways, O King of the saints!
The New Testament presents Jesus as Lord over time. With the Father, he existed prior to the beginning of time, created all things, and sustains all things (John 1:1-3; Col 1:16-17; Heb 1:2-3). He is neither limited by time, nor adversely affected by it: "Jesus Christ is the same yesterday and today and forever" (Heb 13:8). He too is properly called "the Alpha and Omega, the First and Last, the Beginning and End" (Rev 22:13).
John 1:-3
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God. All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made.
Colossians 1:16-17
For by Him all things were created that are in heaven and that are on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers. All things were created through Him and for Him. And He is before all things, and in Him all things consist.
Hebrews 1:2-3
...has in these last days spoken to us by His Son, whom He has appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the worlds; who being the brightness of His glory and the express image of His person, and upholding all things by the word of His power, when He had by Himself purged our sins, sat down at the right hand of the Majesty on high...
Hebrews 13:8
Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today, and forever.
Revelations 22:13
I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End, the First and the Last.
- Taken from HERE
Z Man none of those verses support the conclusion you have made. All of them could just as easily support my view. I think your lens makes you see more than what is actually there. IMHO.
Z Man
New member
Well, I wasn't playing games. I was honestly trying to show you that the Bible does teach that God's ordaining and our responsibility go hand in hand, seriously.Knight said:
I like you too Knight. Thanks.
I too think we'd be good neighbors. And you don't have to worry about 'apologies'; you haven't hurt my feelings. I understand this is a debate forum. I also realize, and hope, that some of the attitudes and character displayed on this site isn't the same way a person is in real life. Again, this is just a debate forum. I discuss Scripture with people in real life a lot differently than I do here, that's for sure!
Anyways, I'm not sure what One on One is. I don't want to fall into one of your traps where I'm a lone ranger and you and your OV buds gang up on me...
It's in the Exclusively Christian Theology forum but that's not how I found it. I just went to the home page, clicked on the search button and typed in "Calvinism makes me" in the drop down box and I think the thread was on the second page of found threads.Z Man said:
You shouldn't have brought it up then Z Man. You make accusations and then when pressed to substanciate them it's suddenly no big deal and you want to just leave it in the past.
You're dishonest Z Man, you should be ashamed of yourself. You may not like my style or my attitude and I readily admit that I sometimes get more angry than I should but at least when I say something I mean it and can back it up with cold hard verifiable facts even when I am angry.
Resting in Him,
Clete
How could going One on One with me be like "ganging up"?Z Man said:
Or are you commenting on my the fact I have truth on my side?
Are you an open theist now?nancy said:
He is the beginning and the end, the first and the last!Z Man said:
He created us (the beginning) and He will eventually stop all this silliness on Earth (the end). His existence spans any other existence.
Z Man said:
Z Man,
Knight is right. All of the verses that whomever you were quoting from used do not teach what you are saying they teach. What that person did was read Calvinism into those verses. If someone who was totally uninitiated in the Christian faith and simply read those passages they would not come away from them believe that God exists outside of time.
I don't have time to respond to the whole thing but just take the fist part of what you said...
Z Man said:
The existence or removal of clocks does not make or remove time. It took time to make the Sun, Earth, Moon and stars and it would take time to destroy them and after they were gone there would be events that occured AFTERWARD (a reference to time). There just isn't anything here that says anything like God created time. He definately created things by which time is reconned but that is not the same thing.
Resting in Him,
Clete