Creation vs. Evolution

[Cross Reference]

We are all indeed fortunate to have you to inform us as to what all geneticists will say. lain:

Then pay better attention. He is correct, though he could have said all but a few nut cases, and you dismiss it because you have no reply. There are none that state the reverse is also true. <You are dishonesty at its best>

 

[alwight]

Then pay better attention. He is correct, though he could have said all but a few nut cases, and you dismiss it because you have no reply. There are none that state the reverse is also true. <You are dishonesty at its best>

Since I'm still waiting for your display of something that I might respect and be impressed by due to its reasoning and rationality, rather than inane utterances and blind faith, so until then I'll not be completely mortified by your opinion of me. :nono:

 

[Cross Reference]

Since I'm still waiting for your display of something that I might respect and be impressed by due to its reasoning and rationality, rather than inane utterances and blind faith, so until then I'll not be completely mortified by your opinion of me. :nono:

Whose kidding who? Nothing I offer will ever be respected by you. RE faith: Mine is better founded than yours. The evidence offered you ignore, testifies to that being the truth.

 

[CabinetMaker]

The hopeful monster theory?


Natural selection is incapable of detecting the vast amount of mutations whether they are deleterious or slightly deleterious. Geneticists know these mutations accumulate in our genome leading to increased cases of birth defects and genetic diseases. There is not a geneticist on the planet that says beneficial mutations take care of the problem.*

No. A single small mutation that slightly changes the way a protein functions. The genetic monster theory is usually a chicken egg hatching with a hawk inside. I don't think the monster theory is of any value as it would require that a male and a female monster would have to be born, find each other and mate.

 

[6days]

No. A single small mutation that slightly changes the way a protein functions.

As in destroying or altering pre-existing existing information.

You seem to believe that mutations can create the genes that would be necessary put feathers on lizards? Its impossible.

 

[alwight]

Whose kidding who? Nothing I offer will ever be respected by you. RE faith: Mine is better founded than yours. The evidence offered you ignore, testifies to that being the truth.

What evidence have you got to offer?
Btw bald assertions do not count as evidence.

 

[Jose Fly]

As in destroying or altering pre-existing existing information.

"Information" that you've admitted you have no idea how to quantify. Given that, we simply look to the actual effect of mutations and we see all sorts of cases where mutations produce new traits, genetic sequences, and species, as well as all sorts of cases where fitness levels increase, decrease, and remain the same.

And when we add in other evolutionary mechanisms, we realize that every single new trait, ability, genetic sequence, and species that has arisen has done so via evolution. In all our collective observations, we've never seen any other process produce those things. Thus, when we think back on the history of life on earth and we wonder where all those traits, abilities, genetic sequences, and species came from, it's entirely reasonable to conclude that they arose via evolutionary mechanisms.

You seem to believe that mutations can create the genes that would be necessary put feathers on lizards? Its impossible.

Sorry, but the only person beholden to your incredulity is you.

 

[Cross Reference]

What evidence have you got to offer?
Btw bald assertions do not count as evidence.

Take a hike.:loser:

 

[Cross Reference]

As in destroying or altering pre-existing existing information.

You seem to believe that mutations can create the genes that would be necessary put feathers on lizards? Its impossible.

That fact that it is impossible and must be by man man interferring in the processes for it to perform doesn't faze their reprobate thinking one whit. I'm out of this.

 

[gcthomas]

I'm out of this.

:chuckle:

You were out of it days ago.

 

[alwight]

That fact that it is impossible and must be by man man interferring in the processes for it to perform doesn't faze their reprobate thinking one whit. I'm out of this.

Thanks for everything you've contributed to the discussion, do pop by anytime. :wave2:

 

[CabinetMaker]

As in destroying or altering pre-existing existing information.

Yes, as in an alteration of information.
I

You seem to believe that mutations can create the genes that would be necessary put feathers on lizards? Its impossible.

In one generation? I never said or implied that drastic changes take place in one generation and explained why - genetic monster. It won't work.

 

[6days]

Yes, as in an alteration of information.

Yes, mutations alter and destroy pre-existing information.

You seem to believe that mutations can create the genes that would be necessary put feathers on lizards? Its impossible.

In one generation? I never said or implied that drastic changes take place in one generation and explained why - genetic monster. It won't work.

Of course not in one generation.

But even more unlikely in a few thousand generations. Mutations destroy... Natural selection eliminates.

Furthermore.......
Genesis 1:24 Then God said, “Let the earth produce every sort of animal, each producing offspring of the same kind—livestock, small animals that scurry along the ground, and wild animals.” And that is what happened. 25 God made all sorts of wild animals, livestock, and small animals, each able to produce offspring of the same kind. And God saw that it was good.

 

[Yorzhik]

A minor mutation may change the function of a protein slightly such that is better at a particular function than an un modified gene.

That's nice speculation. Show us the messages that improved this way and then we'll have reason to believe your hypothesis. Shannon says you cannot get more information in a received message than what was sent. And Shannon is a great deal more established than your idea.

Your problem is that you are assuming that variation in a gene is always bad.

This isn't true. I'll give you all the beneficial mutations you can find as evidence for your hypothesis.

 

[Jose Fly]

That's nice speculation. Show us the messages that improved this way and then we'll have reason to believe your hypothesis.

What, that mutations change function and improve fitness? Seriously? Where have you been?

Examples of beneficial mutations and natural selection

 

[patrick jane]

What, that mutations change function and improve fitness? Seriously? Where have you been?

Examples of beneficial mutations and natural selection

bacteria, viruses and yeast ?

 

[6days]

bacteria, viruses and yeast ?

Yup..... that is the very best of the best examples they have to offer, even though evolutionists have been studying mutations for 100 +years...hoping to show evolutionism is a credible belief system. Of these mutations that have a beneficial outcome are the result of a lack of overall fitness. For example, island populations are highly adapted to a very specific environment, but les fit...fragile to slight environmental change.

 

[alwight]

That's nice speculation. Show us the messages that improved this way and then we'll have reason to believe your hypothesis. Shannon says you cannot get more information in a received message than what was sent. And Shannon is a great deal more established than your idea.

Shannon was indeed concerned with messages and more importantly the transmission of them, but DNA represents information not a message to be transmitted. Transcription of that information is not the same thing as transmitting it, you are imo misapplying Shannon theory for no good rational reason at all.

 

[MichaelCadry]

Dear All,

Not much feedback on my last post. I can understand that. You see, the spirit of life in our souls, does not ever die. God did not make it except that it would always be alive. So when we 'die' or leave this Earth, our spirit pops out of our body, like being forced out, sometimes. There is more to this than I can share with you just yet, but maybe later. Anyway, it is now determined that if you want to be on Lucifer's/Satan's side and not believe that God is best, then you go be with him where he is found, which is in the pit. Lucifer's spirit has already been cast into the 'lake of fire'/our Sun, and Satan, Lucifer's protege, must be put into the bottomless pit, Hell, for the next 1,000 years. See Rev. 20:2-3KJV: And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years, and cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive nations no more, til the thousand years should be fulfilled; and after that he must be loosed a little season."

Now you will notice that the 'beast' or Antichrist, and the false prophet, will not be sent to Hell, but will go directly into the lake of fire/our Sun. See Rev. 19:20KJV, "...These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone/sulfur." Well, I've done my best to explain this. Now for some good news.

See Rev. 21:1-4, "And I saw a new heaven and a new earth; for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea. And I, John, saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband. And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, "Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God. And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain; for the former things are passed away..." See Rev. 21:5-8, "And he that sat upon the throne said, "Behold, I make all things new; And he said unto me; Write: for these words are true and faithful. And he said unto me, It is done. I am the Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end. I will give unto him who is athirst of the fountain of the water of life freely. He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son. But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone; which is the second death."

There is more that I could say, but this will have to do for now. I'm not trying to steer anyone wrong, but instead, so that we will ALL be together in the end and be happy in our new headquarters/home. And we can enjoy heaven and have fun, and life will be like it used to be and better. God is exceedingly better than Santa or the Easter Bunny and Good Fairy. He's real!! Okay, enough for now.

Tons Of Love Coming At You All,

Michael

 

[gcthomas]

Yup..... that is the very best of the best examples they have to offer, even though evolutionists have been studying mutations for 100 +years...hoping to show evolutionism is a credible belief system. Of these mutations that have a beneficial outcome are the result of a lack of overall fitness. For example, island populations are highly adapted to a very specific environment, but les fit...fragile to slight environmental change.

Can you define what you mean by "overall fitness" when applied to an organism that has increased fitness for its environment? "Overall fitness" is not a term I have ever seen used by biologists.