Creation vs. Evolution

[Interplanner]

You keep trying to add time into scripture.
We have about 4000 years of genealogies between first Adam and Last Adam.

Except that conservative Dr. Schaeffer showed in GENESIS IN SPACE AND TIME and in NO FINAL CONFLICT how many times those genealogies skip over insignificant figures. That's why the abrupt appearance of man doing history, art, records, tools about 15-20000 years ago is reality. That's why you need to integrate all data, so that all knowledge is stronger, not weaker. We cannot have a situation where the Bible is a separate method of knowledge on its historical and physical surfaces and edges.

There is no "trying" about it. 'ekpalai' is way back before "the ancient world" of 2 Pet 2 and of 3, two different contexts. You're ignorant of what it is saying, even when it is the NT interpreting the OT, and telling us what to do with the expression 'darkness on the surface of the deep' and of 'formless and void.'

You talk like you have a corner on it, but you don't.

Do you mind explaining your background at all?

I grew up fundamentalist. I was exposed to Schaeffer, L'Abri and the Australian Forum in Bible college. I completed 3 years of ancient Greek there and TA'd the final year. I took another year at master's level at Regent College in Vancouver, where I heard and read former DTS Hebrew scholar B. Waltke on Gen 1 and his book CREATION AND CHAOS. I did one term translating Josephus on the Jewish War. About 5 years after my master's in research I was invited to the Am. Assoc. of Pop Culture to speak on how the term 'nature' shifted after WW2. I was only published, however, on one item, which was the 'weak and miserable elements of the world' in Gal 4 and Col 2.

I'm not fooling around or inventing anything. I am finding you lagging in exposure on what the Bible is actually saying.

 

[MichaelCadry]

Dear patrick jane,

I just gave you some good rep on another thread! Mine doesn't go very far, but it helps. I tried to give you some twice, but it wouldn't let me. You sure have a lot of good rep yourself. Congrats! I forgive you about before.

Michael

 

[patrick jane]

Dear patrick jane,

I just gave you some good rep on another thread! Mine doesn't go very far, but it helps. I tried to give you some twice, but it wouldn't let me. You sure have a lot of good rep yourself. Congrats! I forgive you about before.

Michael

ok, i rep you when i can. spread it around -

 

[MichaelCadry]

We agree... Hebrews is part of God's Word.


No... its not what you say that matters. Its what God's Word says.


Nonsense.... You once again are trying to add things to God's Word. It says nothing at all about black holes in space.

Having 'slowed down to think'... I realize you keep trying to fabricate things into Gods Word. Jude and Peter say nothing about black holes in space being places of judgement.

Dear 6days,

Yes we agree. Jude and Peter say nothing about black holes in space. It's preposterous!

Michael

:wave2: :thumb: :cloud9: :angel:

 

[patrick jane]

We agree... Hebrews is part of God's Word.


No... its not what you say that matters. Its what God's Word says.


Nonsense.... You once again are trying to add things to God's Word. It says nothing at all about black holes in space.

Having 'slowed down to think'... I realize you keep trying to fabricate things into Gods Word. Jude and Peter say nothing about black holes in space being places of judgement.

Hebrews 11:3 KJV -

 

[patrick jane]

Yes
I do think modern humans have less intelligence than Adam and the first humans.
Quite possibly, Neandertals were also smarter than us, as they did have slightly bigger brains than us. Brain size alone does not confirm they were more intelligent, but its quite possible they were--contrary to the dim witted image evolutionists often used

i disagree, but it's hard to tell. after all, Adam & Eve displayed extremely poor judgement and decision making skills. having been told from the start the ONE thing they could not do !!

then ONLY Noah and his family were spared. i was speaking more about recent (3000 years) history. we are, as a world, smarter and much more advanced. we are living longer and as i said, IQ's are astonishingly up, all forms of science are more advanced.

unless you want to argue that pre-historic peoples were as advanced. i know the life spans were much longer in the days of Adam and Noah and Abraham etc. but there were no basic knowledge tests and advanced technologies. the Bible doesn't speak of schools, only temples and synagogues -

 

[MichaelCadry]

Maybe then, Michael, this is more serious than you realized. You speak of the lies being proven wrong. The trouble is, Michael, the scientists are not engaged in the business of lies. They honestly try to understand how the universe works. If they study, analyze, and then decide the best way to run an experiment – say about how old the earth is- and the answer says “very old”, then where is the deceit? It is not on the part of the scientists. If the answer they got is wrong, then the only other entity that might have been involved is - God Himself. If there is a lie somewhere, and that was not on the part of the scientists, then who must be the one that is being false? Is your God playing a joke on the scientists, or is it more serious – deliberate deception?

Or, Michael, just maybe neither the scientists nor God are being deceitful, and indeed the answer the scientists got is correct. Think about it, Michael, is your God lying to the scientists?

Oh Davis,

You know about Piltdown Man, Lucy, Calaveras, Haeckel's Whopper, etc. You can type in Science Evolution Bloopers in your browser and come up with plenty. You can type in Science Bloopers and get tons more mess-ups in Science. Who are you joking? Scientists are constantly being deceitful to try to get their 'facts' to fit into spaces they want to fill (fake scenarios). And dating things to be so old as for others to just say 'why bother to try to debate it' since they can't prove it didn't take that many years either or also. You know what I mean. Science lies and if you don't know that then you aren't being fair.

Michael

 

[MichaelCadry]

Hi Michael,
You make me so sad, I would pray for you if I thought there would be any point.

Dear alwight,

Do not be sad! This is all meant to happen. You'll understand in the near future. Don't cry about me, whatever you do. I'm ready for this.

Much Joy For You!!

Michael

:thumb: :wave2: :cloud9: :angel:

 

[MichaelCadry]

So now we are to ask you how God executes judgement or holding places? Give me a break. Read the material and you'll see again what the purpose of those places was. A judgement was rendered, they were imprisoned (the word in Peter is actually the chains of a dark dungeon, cut down to 'chains of darkness'), confined, and to do so is a punishment. You are simply not coherent with your Bible usage.

Dear Interplanner,

Those 'chains of darkness' are the utter blindness in the soul's vision. Each soul's vision. Do you understand? Souls are sent to Hell, the bottomless pit, as I was told by the angel, the center of our Earth, which is bottomless because everyone thinks they are on top because of gravity, and there is a center full of fire and lava, and magma. But it symbolically has no bottom, so it is the bottomless pit. It has a top and a center, but no bottom. If you have any problem with that, take it up with the Lord. He made it that way. I was also told that the 'Lake of Fire" was our Sun, where there is much fire and brimstone, and it is even hotter than Hell. Do you also know that a bolt of lightning is ten times hotter than the Sun? And it says in Rev. 20:14 that "Hell" shall give up those in hell to be judged and those who are not found written in the book shall be cast into the "Lake of Fire." There are a lot of things you do not know about. Like I said, don't kill the messenger. Take it up with the angel from the Lord, who told me. Do you understand all I have said here? It's ALL the TRUTH!! You'll find out when the time comes.

Keep Trying To Learn, Bro'!

Michael

:thumb: :wave2:

 

[MichaelCadry]

Except that conservative Dr. Schaeffer showed in GENESIS IN SPACE AND TIME and in NO FINAL CONFLICT how many times those genealogies skip over insignificant figures. That's why the abrupt appearance of man doing history, art, records, tools about 15-20000 years ago is reality. That's why you need to integrate all data, so that all knowledge is stronger, not weaker. We cannot have a situation where the Bible is a separate method of knowledge on its historical and physical surfaces and edges.

There is no "trying" about it. 'ekpalai' is way back before "the ancient world" of 2 Pet 2 and of 3, two different contexts. You're ignorant of what it is saying, even when it is the NT interpreting the OT, and telling us what to do with the expression 'darkness on the surface of the deep' and of 'formless and void.'

You talk like you have a corner on it, but you don't.

Do you mind explaining your background at all?

I grew up fundamentalist. I was exposed to Schaeffer, L'Abri and the Australian Forum in Bible college. I completed 3 years of ancient Greek there and TA'd the final year. I took another year at master's level at Regent College in Vancouver, where I heard and read former DTS Hebrew scholar B. Waltke on Gen 1 and his book CREATION AND CHAOS. I did one term translating Josephus on the Jewish War. About 5 years after my master's in research I was invited to the Am. Assoc. of Pop Culture to speak on how the term 'nature' shifted after WW2. I was only published, however, on one item, which was the 'weak and miserable elements of the world' in Gal 4 and Col 2.

I'm not fooling around or inventing anything. I am finding you lagging in exposure on what the Bible is actually saying.

Dear Interplanner,

It's not how much schooling you have or how much you think you know. It is how much you DO know. How much has been taught to you by the Lord or angels? Do you have a monopoly on that? 6days has a lifetime of experience and is surely older than you. With age, comes wisdom. I'm not saying 6days is older than you, but he sure is wiser.

Michael

:wave:

 

[MichaelCadry]

ok, i rep you when i can. spread it around -

Dear patrick jane,

Thank you!! I surely do spread it around. Whenever I get the chance. I have to hunt sometimes for posts that you've posted on recently to get where you are at and the same thing with other people. But I do that and give other people good rep. pts. Of course! How do you get so much rep? You've got tons!

God Be With You!!

Michael

 

[patrick jane]

Dear patrick jane,

Thank you!! I surely do spread it around. Whenever I get the chance. I have to hunt sometimes for posts that you've posted on recently to get where you are at and the same thing with other people. But I do that and give other people good rep. pts. Of course! How do you get so much rep? You've got tons!

God Be With You!!

Michael

Philippians 4:13 -

 

[MichaelCadry]

Dear patrick jane,

Thanks pj!! Me too!! Much Love Coming Your Way!!! When are you going to get PMs or Visitor Messages on your Profile Page??

Michael

 

[MichaelCadry]

Dear 6days,

I do not know where you got 'dim-witted' from? I did not notice it before. I barely understand what you mean in the context you've used it. See Post #12767.

Michael

 

[MichaelCadry]

Dear patrick jane,

I love the Scripture you used in your post, about Hebrews 11:3. That really hits the spot. Thanks Tons!!

May God Increase Your Countenance Threefold!!

Michael

 

[MichaelCadry]

Dear alwight,

How's it going 2nite? I hope all is fine with you. I also hope you got good weather. They're getting stormy weather where I used to live {in Michigan} for Labor Day. We're going to have good weather here on Labor Day. How about you? I'm afraid to ask! Well, I'm going to have to go to sleep now because I am really sleepy. It is 3am and you still haven't come on the board, so I'll chat with you later.

Good Night, alwight!!

Michael

 

[alwight]

Dear alwight,

How's it going 2nite? I hope all is fine with you. I also hope you got good weather. They're getting stormy weather where I used to live {in Michigan} for Labor Day. We're going to have good weather here on Labor Day. How about you? I'm afraid to ask! Well, I'm going to have to go to sleep now because I am really sleepy. It is 3am and you still haven't come on the board, so I'll chat with you later.

Good Night, alwight!!

Michael

We don't have Labor Day here Michael, but we had August Bank Holiday last Monday. It's still cool for the time of year here but at least it's sunny today.

 

[rstrats]

Interplanner,
re: "Did you mean that the belief has it's source in choosing to have them...?

Just the opposite. I maintain that beliefs cannot be consciously chosen.

 

[rstrats]

MichaelCadry,
re: "Are you sure you don't mean 'engineered'?"

Yes, very sure.

 

[alwight]

Oh Davis,

You know about Piltdown Man, Lucy, Calaveras, Haeckel's Whopper, etc. You can type in Science Evolution Bloopers in your browser and come up with plenty. You can type in Science Bloopers and get tons more mess-ups in Science. Who are you joking? Scientists are constantly being deceitful to try to get their 'facts' to fit into spaces they want to fill (fake scenarios). And dating things to be so old as for others to just say 'why bother to try to debate it' since they can't prove it didn't take that many years either or also. You know what I mean. Science lies and if you don't know that then you aren't being fair.

Michael

Michael, science doesn't lie. Yes some scientists have lied, scientists are human beings, but other scientists found them out and that way science itself keeps heading in generally the right direction.
The agenda of science is science, not to falsify religious belief.
Science draws its own conclusions based on evidence regardless of anyone's religious doctrine but if those conclusions happen to contradict a literal Genesis then that is not because of any agenda other than the gaining of real knowledge.
Should a list of false prophets, fake psychics and religious charlatans shatter your religious faith?