Could You Train Yourself To Enjoy...

Arthur Brain

Well-known member
If somebody decides that something feels good or makes them feel good they learn to enjoy it.

I mean, did you 'decide' to feel uncomfortable the last time you stubbed your toe? Did you make a conscious decision to think: "Hmm, I didn't enjoy that very much"?

:think:
 

Arthur Brain

Well-known member
What exactly is it about a dry martini that confuses you?

Nothing. Are you arguing for enjoying the feelings of alcoholic intoxication without having the taste for a particular drink that can cause it? If so, weak argument, if not, then what?
 

Eeset

.
LIFETIME MEMBER
Nothing. Are you arguing for enjoying the feelings of alcoholic intoxication without having the taste for a particular drink that can cause it? If so, weak argument, if not, then what?
I'm not arguing at all. I asked you a question and you gave no answer.
 

Arthur Brain

Well-known member
I'm not arguing at all. I asked you a question and you gave no answer.

Sure I did, I answered "nothing". I'm quite partial to a dry martini on occasion so why would I be 'confused' by one?

:AMR:

What the heck was your 'point' with that question?
 

glassjester

Well-known member
I mean, did you 'decide' to feel uncomfortable the last time you stubbed your toe? Did you make a conscious decision to think: "Hmm, I didn't enjoy that very much"?

:think:

Again - our enjoyment of music (and any art) is way more complicated than a gut physical reaction.
 

glassjester

Well-known member
That don't undermine my position. I can associate a piece of music with a good time without intrinsically enjoying anything about the music in itself. Get the difference?

Can you define "enjoy" ?


It's not as though people don't associate things with times in their life including music, of course they do. But you've been suggesting that I can enjoy a piece of music in itself that I find completely banal.

You don't like any simple music?
I would guess there are plenty of boring things that you're perfectly capable of enjoying.


Do you get why I'm infuriated with this now?

Not really. It's not like I'm spouting personal attacks or insults.
 

Arthur Brain

Well-known member
Can you define "enjoy" ?

Well, this pretty much covers it:

take delight or pleasure in (an activity or occasion).
"I enjoy watching good films"
synonyms: like, love, be fond of, be entertained by, be amused by, be pleased by, find/take pleasure in, be keen on, delight in, appreciate, rejoice in, relish, revel in, adore, lap up, savour, luxuriate in, bask in, wallow in, glory in


You don't like any simple music?
I would guess there are plenty of boring things that you're perfectly capable of enjoying.

Didn't say that. What I am saying is that whatever piece of music I enjoy, be it complex and intricate to the simpler, from classical to industrial rock etc will have something about it that catches my ear, generally harmony.

What things? Watching paint dry? Unblocking a sink? Playing 'battleships' against myself?

:AMR:

Not really. It's not like I'm spouting personal attacks or insults.

Not saying you are but your stubborn insistence that people can enjoy things they find fundamentally boring and tedious is in itself becoming boring and tedious.
 

Quincy

New member
Music you find boring?

Foodstuffs you recoil at?

Reality TV if you cringe at it?

This is an offshoot from a conversation with Glassjester where he proposes that people can train themselves to enjoy things they have an aversion to. I say it's bunk and there's no evidence to support it.

Thoughts?

I think some people can make themselves do things that they would rather not, with the right motives, probably something ulterior in most cases. I wouldn't be able to, though.
 

Arthur Brain

Well-known member
I think some people can make themselves do things that they would rather not, with the right motives, probably something ulterior in most cases. I wouldn't be able to, though.

Well that's a much better argument and one that makes sense. I wouldn't argue that anyone certainly can't pretend to enjoy or like something with an underlying motive for it. I wouldn't argue that someone couldn't choose to do something they don't enjoy that isn't necessary either. Heck, if someone challenged me to listen to a Beyonce song on loop for ten hours for charity then I might consider it. I'd hate every damned, tedious, boring second of it whichever though...

:eek:
 

Quincy

New member
Well that's a much better argument and one that makes sense. I wouldn't argue that anyone certainly can't pretend to enjoy or like something with an underlying motive for it. I wouldn't argue that someone couldn't choose to do something they don't enjoy that isn't necessary either. Heck, if someone challenged me to listen to a Beyonce song on loop for ten hours for charity then I might consider it. I'd hate every damned, tedious, boring second of it whichever though...

:eek:

You sound like my family members who recently all boycotted the country music awards, :chuckle:
 

GusRowland

New member
Music you find boring?

Foodstuffs you recoil at?

Reality TV if you cringe at it?

This is an offshoot from a conversation with Glassjester where he proposes that people can train themselves to enjoy things they have an aversion to. I say it's bunk and there's no evidence to support it.

Thoughts?
I would have to say it depends on the necessity, or importance of the task or thing. Does ones life depend on it? Yes that's an extreme example but it's understood. Say a cop goes under cover in an ongoing investigation. He is to infiltrate a motorcycle gang for various info..Well to keep from blowing cover, there is a degree of tolerance needed for certain activities said gang participates in. Yes again it's extreme..But it's real and people do it and have done it. A spouse learns to enjoy certain aspects of their partner because they love them more than a dislike for that particular thing they do, be it their cooking skills or the way they fold the shirts...It's tolerance.

Sent from my Z716BL using TheologyOnline mobile app
 

Arthur Brain

Well-known member
I would have to say it depends on the necessity, or importance of the task or thing. Does ones life depend on it? Yes that's an extreme example but it's understood. Say a cop goes under cover in an ongoing investigation. He is to infiltrate a motorcycle gang for various info..Well to keep from blowing cover, there is a degree of tolerance needed for certain activities said gang participates in. Yes again it's extreme..But it's real and people do it and have done it. A spouse learns to enjoy certain aspects of their partner because they love them more than a dislike for that particular thing they do, be it their cooking skills or the way they fold the shirts...It's tolerance.

Sent from my Z716BL using TheologyOnline mobile app

That's a separate argument really. Tolerating something or enduring it for the sake of necessity isn't the same as being able to train oneself to actually 'enjoy' a thing that's completely mundane or boring.
 

glassjester

Well-known member
Well, this pretty much covers it:

take delight or pleasure in (an activity or occasion).
"I enjoy watching good films"
synonyms: like, love, be fond of, be entertained by, be amused by, be pleased by, find/take pleasure in, be keen on, delight in, appreciate, rejoice in, relish, revel in, adore, lap up, savour, luxuriate in, bask in, wallow in, glory in


Didn't say that. What I am saying is that whatever piece of music I enjoy, be it complex and intricate to the simpler, from classical to industrial rock etc will have something about it that catches my ear, generally harmony.

What things? Watching paint dry? Unblocking a sink? Playing 'battleships' against myself?

:AMR:


Not saying you are but your stubborn insistence that people can enjoy things they find fundamentally boring and tedious is in itself becoming boring and tedious.

Hello Arthur, and Merry Christmas!

I haven't gotten back to this thread in a while because I got the sense you were getting pretty fed up with the topic!

Anyway, in case you're not...

That's a suitable definition for "enjoy," I think.
"Be entertained by" is definitely apt.

So you could be entertained by a song for many different reasons, right?

Christmas music makes for a great example.

It occurred to me while driving the other day, and I had on one of those radio stations that plays only Christmas music for the weeks leading up to Christmas. I was fully enjoying that music. Singing along, drumming on the steering wheel. And I kind of caught myself enjoying it.

Now I don't really even like the genre of music of that particular song (what style of music would "Jingle Bells" even be?). Heck, I wouldn't even sit and listen to it any other time of year. But there I was, truly enjoying the song because of all the positive associations I have with it, and probably because of how familiar it is. That's, I think, the biggest reason people enjoy Christmas music, anyway.

It's entirely conceivable to me, that this same phenomenon could occur with other songs and styles of music as well. Why couldn't it?
 

Arthur Brain

Well-known member
Hello Arthur, and Merry Christmas!

I haven't gotten back to this thread in a while because I got the sense you were getting pretty fed up with the topic!

Anyway, in case you're not...

And a merry Christmas to you in turn sir!

:e4e:

That's a suitable definition for "enjoy," I think.
"Be entertained by" is definitely apt.

So you could be entertained by a song for many different reasons, right?

Yes, but it would depend on what the entertainment factor actually is. I like the "Lumberjack song" from 'Monty Python' but it's because of the sketch and comedy as oppose to the music. The music itself does nothing.

Christmas music makes for a great example.

It occurred to me while driving the other day, and I had on one of those radio stations that plays only Christmas music for the weeks leading up to Christmas. I was fully enjoying that music. Singing along, drumming on the steering wheel. And I kind of caught myself enjoying it.

Now I don't really even like the genre of music of that particular song (what style of music would "Jingle Bells" even be?). Heck, I wouldn't even sit and listen to it any other time of year. But there I was, truly enjoying the song because of all the positive associations I have with it, and probably because of how familiar it is. That's, I think, the biggest reason people enjoy Christmas music, anyway.

It's entirely conceivable to me, that this same phenomenon could occur with other songs and styles of music as well. Why couldn't it?

I was out with a friend on Christmas day at a private lock in in a local pub and we were both fed up of the usual Christmas 'fare' and so were others so it turned into an internet music free for all over the sound system. Unfortunately I still hated most of it so hey...
 

glassjester

Well-known member
And a merry Christmas to you in turn sir!

:e4e:

Yes, but it would depend on what the entertainment factor actually is. I like the "Lumberjack song" from 'Monty Python' but it's because of the sketch and comedy as oppose to the music. The music itself does nothing.


I like to press wild flowers...
(I've always loved the Lumberjack Song)

So you enjoy the song, yes?


I was out with a friend on Christmas day at a private lock in in a local pub and we were both fed up of the usual Christmas 'fare' and so were others so it turned into an internet music free for all over the sound system. Unfortunately I still hated most of it so hey...

Bah, humbug!
 
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