Christians worship Christ; JW's do not!

[God's Truth]

I believe that God can break through someone's hardened heart. Ezek. 36:26 I will give you a new heart and put a new spirit within you; I will remove your heart of stone and give you a heart of flesh.

God only saves people who repent of their sins. That is to whom God gives a new heart.

Ezekiel 18:31 Rid yourselves of all the offenses you have committed, and get a new heart and a new spirit. Why will you die, people of Israel?

 

[truthjourney]

God only saves people who repent of their sins. That is to whom God gives a new heart.

Ezekiel 18:31 Rid yourselves of all the offenses you have committed, and get a new heart and a new spirit. Why will you die, people of Israel?

God also draws people to him. John 6:44 “No man can come to me, unless The Father who has sent me will draw him, and I shall raise him in the last day.”

 

[God's Truth]

God also draws people to him. John 6:44 “No man can come to me, unless The Father who has sent me will draw him, and I shall raise him in the last day.”

...45 It is written in the Prophets: ‘And they will all be taught by God.’ Everyone who has heard the Father and learned from Him comes to Me—…

That was when Jesus was on earth. The lost sheep were drawn to Jesus because they already were saved and belonged God. They were God's and He gave them to Jesus, they now had to go through Jesus to remain God's. They were drawn to Jesus because they recognized what Jesus was saying as being God's words.


When Jesus was lifted up from the earth, crucified, then all are drawn to him.

John 12:32 And I, when I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all people to myself."

 

[truthjourney]

...45 It is written in the Prophets: ‘And they will all be taught by God.’ Everyone who has heard the Father and learned from Him comes to Me—…

That was when Jesus was on earth. The lost sheep were drawn to Jesus because they already were saved and belonged God. They were God's and He gave them to Jesus, they now had to go through Jesus to remain God's. They were drawn to Jesus because they recognized what Jesus was saying as being God's words.


When Jesus was lifted up from the earth, crucified, then all are drawn to him.

John 12:32 And I, when I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all people to myself."

So God didn't draw people to Him before that? Was there ever a time that God didn't draw people to Him?

 

[JudgeRightly]

The act of worshiping any being but Yahwah was punishable by death. Most likely the words "pay tribute" or "honor" were replaced with the word "worship." It is an act that is a very big deal in the Jewish community, but yet you see no mention in the New Testament or history about any Jews objecting. No one complained about him saying they are one, because they knew he was speaking about unity. The Messiah to come (yahshua) was never to be a being to be worshipped. This would have been an extremely big deal in the Jewish community if it was truly taking place. And that is one of a number of reasons the Jewish community rejects the New Testament as being the word of God. Yahshua directed us to worship Yahwah only, and stated that he does not accept any glory from mankind.

John 5:41
“I do not accept glorification from human beings,

Matthew 4:10
Jesus said to him, “Away from me, Satan! For it is written: ‘Worship the Lord your God, and serve him only.’ ”

Luke 4:8
Jesus answered, “It is written: ‘Worship the Lord your God and serve him only.’ ”

In the scripture he is quoting, "the Lord" is Yahwah. Yahshua did rebuke the woman, saying he did not have the authority to decide who sits by him.

"No one complained"?

Then the Jews said to Him, “You are not yet fifty years old, and have You seen Abraham?”Jesus said to them, “Most assuredly, I say to you, before Abraham was, I AM.”Then they took up stones to throw at Him; but Jesus hid Himself and went out of the temple, going through the midst of them, and so passed by. - John 8:57-59 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=John8:57-59&version=NKJV

My Father, who has given them to Me, is greater than all; and no one is able to snatch them out of My Father’s hand.I and My Father are one.”Then the Jews took up stones again to stone Him.Jesus answered them, “Many good works I have shown you from My Father. For which of those works do you stone Me?”The Jews answered Him, saying, “For a good work we do not stone You, but for blasphemy, and because You, being a Man, make Yourself God.” - John 10:29-33 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=John10:29-33&version=NKJV

Sounds like they thought He was claiming to be God to me... AND took issue with it...

 

[God's Truth]

So God didn't draw people to Him before that? Was there ever a time that God didn't draw people to Him?

They were drawn to Jesus because they recognized what Jesus said as being the words of God.

John 6:44 "No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws them, and I will raise them up at the last day. 45 It is written in the Prophets: ‘And they will all be taught by God.’ Everyone who has heard the Father and learned from Him comes to Me—

 

[truthjourney]

They were drawn to Jesus because they recognized what Jesus said as being the words of God.

John 6:44 "No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws them, and I will raise them up at the last day. 45 It is written in the Prophets: ‘And they will all be taught by God.’ Everyone who has heard the Father and learned from Him comes to Me—

You didn't answer my question.

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

I have studied with the JW before. Can you name any specific that is in error?

Do you really think I have any interest in communicating with you? If you do, you're badly mistaken. No offence intended.

 

[JudgeRightly]

I believe that God can break through someone's hardened heart. Ezek. 36:26 I will give you a new heart and put a new spirit within you; I will remove your heart of stone and give you a heart of flesh.

Perhaps this is a discussion for another thread, but if you read the context of that verse, God is speaking to Israel, which is 1) His nation to begin with, and 2) a nation, not an individual. Maybe it's semantics for another time, but God's relationship with a nation is not the same as God's relationship with an individual.

Also, just a side note, the verse (again, semantics here) doesn't actually say God broke through their heart, just that He's giving them a new one, replacing the old.

 

[musterion]

Watch this be ignored.

Demand they refute it.

Feel free to repost.

 

[JudgeRightly]

Watch this be ignored.

Feel free to repost. Demand they refute it.

Potato quality. Could you find a higher resolution image?

 

[musterion]

You didn't answer my question.

You're asking for honesty from one of this board's most consistently dishonest posters.

 

[musterion]

Potato quality. Could you find a higher resolution image?

Phone functionality ain't great. Got it here.

http://jesusisyhwh.blogspot.com/2011/10/jesus-is-jehovah-contents.html?m=1

 

[JudgeRightly]

Phone functionality ain't great. Got it here.

http://jesusisyhwh.blogspot.com/2011/10/jesus-is-jehovah-contents.html?m=1

Excellent link, by the way...

 

[musterion]

Can you post a cleaner version?

 

[JudgeRightly]

Can you post a cleaner version?

Done.

 

[truthjourney]

Perhaps this is a discussion for another thread, but if you read the context of that verse, God is speaking to Israel, which is 1) His nation to begin with, and 2) a nation, not an individual. Maybe it's semantics for another time, but God's relationship with a nation is not the same as God's relationship with an individual.

Also, just a side note, the verse (again, semantics here) doesn't actually say God broke through their heart, just that He's giving them a new one, replacing the old.

I was thinking of it more in the context that God can change a person's heart even one that is hardened. But I guess I misunderstood what you meant by "break through".

 

[God's Truth]

You didn't answer my question.

I did answer your question. Try to explain better what you are asking and what you think I had said instead.

God had drawn people in the Old Testament with loving kindness, and He does the same in the New Testament.

Jeremiah 31:3 The LORD appeared to us in the past, saying: "I have loved you with an everlasting love; I have drawn you with unfailing kindness.


There is no Greater Love than Jesus.

Jesus died on the cross for us and draws us with that great love.

John 15:13 Greater love has no one than this: to lay down one's life for one's friends.

Hebrews 7:19 (for the law made nothing perfect), and a better hope is introduced, by which we draw near to God.

We DRAW near to God because of a better HOPE given us than that of the law; we hope in the perfection we receive through Jesus, the perfection we receive by being washed by his blood.

 

[truthjourney]

God had drawn people in the Old Testament with loving kindness, and He does the same in the New Testament.

Jeremiah 31:3 The LORD appeared to us in the past, saying: "I have loved you with an everlasting love; I have drawn you with unfailing kindness.

That's close enough.

 

[CherubRam]

"No one complained"?

Then the Jews said to Him, “You are not yet fifty years old, and have You seen Abraham?”Jesus said to them, “Most assuredly, I say to you, before Abraham was, I AM.”Then they took up stones to throw at Him; but Jesus hid Himself and went out of the temple, going through the midst of them, and so passed by. - John 8:57-59 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=John8:57-59&version=NKJV

My Father, who has given them to Me, is greater than all; and no one is able to snatch them out of My Father’s hand.I and My Father are one.”Then the Jews took up stones again to stone Him.Jesus answered them, “Many good works I have shown you from My Father. For which of those works do you stone Me?”The Jews answered Him, saying, “For a good work we do not stone You, but for blasphemy, and because You, being a Man, make Yourself God.” - John 10:29-33 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=John10:29-33&version=NKJV

Sounds like they thought He was claiming to be God to me... AND took issue with it...

One, as one in unity.

John 17:11
I will remain in the world no longer, but they are still in the world, and I am coming to you. Holy Father, protect them by the power of your name, the name you gave me, so that they may be one as we are one.
In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations

John 17:22
I have given them the glory that you gave me, that they may be one as we are one—
In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations