Jerry Shugart
Well-known member
A steep price was paid to redeem us and we belong to Him. Therefore, He will not let the things which belong to Him just leave.
Believing in vain- 1Co 15:2
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A steep price was paid to redeem us and we belong to Him. Therefore, He will not let the things which belong to Him just leave.
Jerry Shugart
Well-known member
You might want to reread it, as I just now edited it, adding some more as well
By the way, how is your health, dear brother - may you be well.
I am doing much better! Anything is better than being bed-ridden for almost a year! First, I had two operations to remove a tumor from my adrenal gland and complications which followed. Then when in the hospital I broke my leg at the hip so that called for another operation. At the present time I am learning to walk again and it isn't easy.
But it is much better than laying flat on my back month after month.
Thanks for asking!
Jamie Gigliotti
New member
To clarify your view; once a person willfully says yes to Christ they no longer possess free will??
Jerry Shugart
Well-known member
No, I am saying not saying that. Instead, we are brought with a steep price (the blood of the Lord Jesus) and therefore we belong to the Lord:
"For ye are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God's" (1 Cor.6:20).
Since we are the LORD's possession and He paid an extremely high price for us He will not let His possessions just walk away.
Jamie Gigliotti
New member
How could we be free if He won't let us walk away?
Isnt that exactly what the prodigal child was "allowed" to do?
Jerry Shugart
Well-known member
Since we belong to the LORD then why would you think that we are free?
Sweet Bondage!
Jamie Gigliotti
New member
The always saved argument breaks down as Calvinism does at freedom. Love is free. It is shared in chosen humility and trust towards Christ. He is the lover of souls.
It seems the fear of losing oneself, ones pride has ingratiated irresponsibility.
Jerry Shugart
Well-known member
Then answer this for me. The Scriptures reveal that the Christian has already been given "eternal life" (1 Jn.5:11). And here is what the Lord and Savior says about those to whom He has given eternal life:
"And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand" (Jn.10:28).
Tell me how it is possible for any Christian to perish?:
"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life" (Jn.3:16).
Jamie Gigliotti
New member
Your verses are congruent with all of the New Testament, such as:
"If anyone does not remain in me, he is like a branch that is thrown away and withers, such branches are picked up thrown into the fire and burned." John 15:6
"Do not be deceived. God can not be mocked. A man reaps what he sows. The one who sows to please his sinful nature will from that nature reap destruction; the one who sows to please the Spirit, will from the Spirit reap eternal life. " Galatians 6:7-8
Your theology is not congruent with them.
Jamie Gigliotti
New member
Your verses are congruent with all of the New Testament, such as:
"If anyone does not remain in me, he is like a branch that is thrown away and withers, such branches are picked up thrown into the fire and burned." John 15:6
"Do not be deceived. God can not be mocked. A man reaps what he sows. The one who sows to please his sinful nature will from that nature reap destruction; the one who sows to please the Spirit, will from the Spirit reap eternal life. " Galatians 6:7-8
Your theology is not congruent with them.
Jerry Shugart
Well-known member
All you did was to quote verses in a failed effort to prove that the Lord Jesus was wrong when he said this:
"And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand" (Jn.10:28).
Those words cannot be misunderstood and since they contradict your ideas you quote verses which you do not even understand in a failed effort to prove that the Lord Jesus is wrong. I will quote you more of His words so that you can stay in practice in your effort to try to prove Him wrong:
"All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out" (Jn.6:37).
I am sure that if you search the Scriptures long enough you will find verses which you think proves that the Lord Jesus was in error when He said that.
Jerry Shugart
Well-known member
Here it tells us exactly how a person "overcomes":
"For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, even our faith" (1 Jn.5:4).
This is what is said about those with faith, the ones who "overcome":
"He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son" (Rev.21:7).
"He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; He that overcometh shall not be hurt of the second death" (Rev.2:11).
"To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne" (Rev.3:21).
And what happens to those who fail to overcome whatever it is Christ expects them to overcome during this age?
1Mind1Spirit
Literal lunatic
If Peter is not one of the 12 who are the 12?
1Co 15:5 And that he was seen of Cephas, then of the twelve:
Jerry Shugart
Well-known member
Those without faith will not be saved.
Do what? The word "Peter" comes from Greek and Cephas is Aramaic, but it is the same person.
Cephas is one of the twelve men who were given the authority to legislate what was binding for the church.
Paul was given the authority to teach what the twelve apostles bound and loosed.
What a colossal failure that would be on God's part. After all, Jesus was not sent to condemn the world, but to save the world.
Humans are not God's first rodeo. I think you are selling God short.
1Mind1Spirit
Literal lunatic
So are you saying that then meant that Peter was one of the 12 which would imply at some later point that he wasn't?
1Co 15:5 And that he was seen of Cephas, then of the twelve:
Or does it mean he was first seen of Peter then the 12 later?
Why the word then?