Battle Talk ~ Battle Royale VII
- Thread starter Nathon Detroit
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I'm sure Hovind knows his money is safe. For starters, he says they have to prove #3: "The universe came into being by itself by purely natural processes (known as evolution) so that no appeal to the supernatural is needed." Nobody can prove that, because it's not true. It's stupid. A thing cannot create itself. That's moronic. If you think that's what evolution says, you have some reading to do. If you even think that's what theoretical science says, you are misguided.
Secondly, science cannot prove things to be true. It comes up with theories that best model the observable universe. That's it. It can prove things don't make predictions that are in line with the observed evidence.
--ZK
D the Atheist
New member
Thanks for looking for me tuxpower. My server is about to drop out. Will look in later.
Bysee
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Bysee
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I have seen this offer on his website, and I in fact send him a message through his website, I would have no problem in providing him whatever proof he wants.
Never got a reaction back from him, of course!
The man has a weird way of perceiving the material world, and wants to see proof for things, that can't possible be provided for, because he wants to have them in a way, which are alien to matter itself.
I mean, he wants to have proof of how matter can create itself.
But since matter isn't created, how can he want proof of that?
So, this "offer" is nothing but a joke.
So I offered him, I could provide him a better explenation of how the material world in fact works, and not how he thinks the material world works.
If he want a disproof for his own conceptual misunderstanding of the world, he can of course have it, but he doesn't seem to want that!
D the Atheist
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Without the help of the HTML gods I have changed my signature to David the Atheist.......I Hope?
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tuxpower
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ZroKewl
I made no assertion as to what I think evolution is or what I understand theoretical science to be. My area of study is computer science as that has a direct impact on my paycheck. Just trying to give you the opportunity to make a few bucks. As for having a lot of reading to do...I would say that is a correct statement since there are over 1700 posts in this thread so far.
I made no assertion as to what I think evolution is or what I understand theoretical science to be. My area of study is computer science as that has a direct impact on my paycheck. Just trying to give you the opportunity to make a few bucks. As for having a lot of reading to do...I would say that is a correct statement since there are over 1700 posts in this thread so far.
Flipper
New member
Tuxpower wrote:
{quote] A committee of trained scientists will provide peer review of the evidence offered and, to the best of their ability, will be fair and honest in their evaluation and judgment as to the validity of the evidence presented.
[/quote]
Do you happen to know the names of any of these scientists?
{quote] A committee of trained scientists will provide peer review of the evidence offered and, to the best of their ability, will be fair and honest in their evaluation and judgment as to the validity of the evidence presented.
[/quote]
Do you happen to know the names of any of these scientists?
tuxpower
New member
No, I haven't got a clue. That's just what his site says. Maybe heusdens knows b/c he's contacted them in the past. I probably won't post much more to this thread until I read more of it and have questions. Some stuff in this debate is pretty new to me so I have to soak it all in.
Re: Afraid to tread there?
Re: Afraid to tread there?
Here is the thing though. If he disproves that Bobs God exisits, wouldn't it stand to reason that what 33% of the world believes is a lie? It wouldn't mean that he has solved the does God exisit, but it would eliminate one of the most accepted Dieties on this planet. Gotta takes steps in order to get to the top of the building. I however don't think that in any of our lifetimes will anyone come close to proving/disproving God exists. Have to die to find that answer out :/
Spartin
Re: Afraid to tread there?
Here is the thing though. If he disproves that Bobs God exisits, wouldn't it stand to reason that what 33% of the world believes is a lie? It wouldn't mean that he has solved the does God exisit, but it would eliminate one of the most accepted Dieties on this planet. Gotta takes steps in order to get to the top of the building. I however don't think that in any of our lifetimes will anyone come close to proving/disproving God exists. Have to die to find that answer out :/
Spartin
Re: Re: Afraid to tread there?
Re: Re: Afraid to tread there?
The fact (is it a fact?) that 33% of the population of this planet still believes that there is a God, just proofs one thing:
That there is a desperate need for more qualtitatively good scientific education for the masses.
Are you in need of a disproof of God? It's no problem to me to give you a disproof of God (the proof itself is interactive though).
Re: Re: Afraid to tread there?
The fact (is it a fact?) that 33% of the population of this planet still believes that there is a God, just proofs one thing:
That there is a desperate need for more qualtitatively good scientific education for the masses.
Are you in need of a disproof of God? It's no problem to me to give you a disproof of God (the proof itself is interactive though).
Re: Re: Re: Re: Afraid to tread there?
Re: Re: Re: Re: Afraid to tread there?
Ominous as in omnisience? "knowing everything?"
Let me say this. I know that what is needed to know that there is no God.
Do you know what God is, or stands for? No?
God stands for missing knowledge and understanding.
We have a hunger and thirst to knowledge and understanding.
If the means to have that hunger and thirst to knowledge have not been fulfilled (which was the case for the primitive men) and we lack a fundamental understanding of the world, this might be filled in with 'self created' Deities.
Our brains were in the ancient times as big and as good as they are now. We asked almost the same question as we ask ourselves now. The only difference is that in the course of history almost all those questions have been answered.
We don't live in the ancient past any longer. We have the means to know almost anything there is to know.
We can not longer deny that this knowledge is available to us.
So the only argument we can have for 'not knowing' is that we are ignorant of it.
Well if that is what you want to be, then that is your choice, but then don't come to me and tell me that science or materialism is wrong and theism is right.
For those who want to know: everything that can be known is available.
But the most important thing in the process of knowing, is to know what you don't know, or what you are puzzled about.
You should never be ashamed of asking a question. The only bad question that exists is the question you did not ask.
Re: Re: Re: Re: Afraid to tread there?
Ominous as in omnisience? "knowing everything?"
Let me say this. I know that what is needed to know that there is no God.
Do you know what God is, or stands for? No?
God stands for missing knowledge and understanding.
We have a hunger and thirst to knowledge and understanding.
If the means to have that hunger and thirst to knowledge have not been fulfilled (which was the case for the primitive men) and we lack a fundamental understanding of the world, this might be filled in with 'self created' Deities.
Our brains were in the ancient times as big and as good as they are now. We asked almost the same question as we ask ourselves now. The only difference is that in the course of history almost all those questions have been answered.
We don't live in the ancient past any longer. We have the means to know almost anything there is to know.
We can not longer deny that this knowledge is available to us.
So the only argument we can have for 'not knowing' is that we are ignorant of it.
Well if that is what you want to be, then that is your choice, but then don't come to me and tell me that science or materialism is wrong and theism is right.
For those who want to know: everything that can be known is available.
But the most important thing in the process of knowing, is to know what you don't know, or what you are puzzled about.
You should never be ashamed of asking a question. The only bad question that exists is the question you did not ask.
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Flake
New member
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Afraid to tread there?
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Afraid to tread there?
No, ominous as in ominous. It sounded like your interactive proof was going along the lines of "I will kill you then you will know if there is a god", maybe I misinterpreted it.
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Afraid to tread there?
No, ominous as in ominous. It sounded like your interactive proof was going along the lines of "I will kill you then you will know if there is a god", maybe I misinterpreted it.
I know what people say god stands for, where are you going with this, are you talking to me directly?
We live in the past of the future. I dont think we do have the means you suggest, or if we have the means we dont know fully how to implement it, maybe in the future, nobody knows.
You are sounding rather preachy Heus, but no matter, I concur with what you say.
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Afraid to tread there?
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Afraid to tread there?
Yeah. I meant interactive as in dialogue.
Yeah. I know it is a conviction of some sorts.
But what I said I meant. Taking all the questions one could in principle ask, and given all the answers already given, I would say there is not much room for not knowing.
I mean what is there to know that is not known?
We better put our efforts together to make this world a better place for anyone.
There are still so many REAL problems to be solved, why do we even bother with those theistic dilemma's in the first place?
And with REAL problem I mean REAL. Like some part of manhood is daily puzzled with the question: How am I gonna get something to eat tomorrow, how am I gonna feed my child, and get her some proper education or healthcare.
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Afraid to tread there?
Yeah. I meant interactive as in dialogue.
Yeah. I know it is a conviction of some sorts.
But what I said I meant. Taking all the questions one could in principle ask, and given all the answers already given, I would say there is not much room for not knowing.
I mean what is there to know that is not known?
We better put our efforts together to make this world a better place for anyone.
There are still so many REAL problems to be solved, why do we even bother with those theistic dilemma's in the first place?
And with REAL problem I mean REAL. Like some part of manhood is daily puzzled with the question: How am I gonna get something to eat tomorrow, how am I gonna feed my child, and get her some proper education or healthcare.
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