popsthebuilder
New member
You do realize that if you can't explain something then you don't understand it right?
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AUTHENTICITY OF TRUST
- Thread starter Truster
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popsthebuilder
New member
The following has little to do with prayer and nothing to do with prayer being sacrifice, and above all; absolutely nothing of prayer being sin.
It is about obedience and the fruit of the Spirit.
You show signs of neither, nor any knowledge of such.
1 Peter: 2. 1. Wherefore laying aside all malice, and all guile, and hypocrisies, and envies, and all evil speakings, 2. As newborn babes, desire the sincere milk of the word, that ye may grow thereby: 3. If so be ye have tasted that the Lord is gracious. 4. To whom coming, as unto a living stone, disallowed indeed of men, but chosen of God, and precious, 5. Ye also, as lively stones, are built up a spiritual house, an holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices, acceptable to God by Jesus Christ. 6. Wherefore also it is contained in the scripture, Behold, I lay in Sion a chief corner stone, elect, precious: and he that believeth on him shall not be confounded. 7. Unto you therefore which believe he is precious: but unto them which be disobedient, the stone which the builders disallowed, the same is made the head of the corner, 8. And a stone of stumbling, and a rock of offence, even to them which stumble at the word, being disobedient: whereunto also they were appointed.
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It is about obedience and the fruit of the Spirit.
You show signs of neither, nor any knowledge of such.
1 Peter: 2. 1. Wherefore laying aside all malice, and all guile, and hypocrisies, and envies, and all evil speakings, 2. As newborn babes, desire the sincere milk of the word, that ye may grow thereby: 3. If so be ye have tasted that the Lord is gracious. 4. To whom coming, as unto a living stone, disallowed indeed of men, but chosen of God, and precious, 5. Ye also, as lively stones, are built up a spiritual house, an holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices, acceptable to God by Jesus Christ. 6. Wherefore also it is contained in the scripture, Behold, I lay in Sion a chief corner stone, elect, precious: and he that believeth on him shall not be confounded. 7. Unto you therefore which believe he is precious: but unto them which be disobedient, the stone which the builders disallowed, the same is made the head of the corner, 8. And a stone of stumbling, and a rock of offence, even to them which stumble at the word, being disobedient: whereunto also they were appointed.
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The NT precepts are a guide for the justified. You have no part in the precepts or the evangelism.
popsthebuilder
New member
Using a peice of a single verse to suite your opinion is the definition of taking it out of context.
Let's check and see
con·text
?käntekst/
noun
the circumstances that form the setting for an event, statement, or idea, and in terms of which it can be fully understood and assessed.
"the decision was taken within the context of planned cuts in spending"
synonyms:circumstances,*conditions,*factors,*state of affairs,*situation,*background,*scene,*setting*More
the parts of something written or spoken that immediately precede and follow a word or passage and clarify its meaning.
"word processing is affected by the context in which words appear"
out of context
phrase of*context
1.
without the surrounding words or circumstances and so not fully understandable.
"comments that aides have long insisted were taken out of context"
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Let's check and see
con·text
?käntekst/
noun
the circumstances that form the setting for an event, statement, or idea, and in terms of which it can be fully understood and assessed.
"the decision was taken within the context of planned cuts in spending"
synonyms:circumstances,*conditions,*factors,*state of affairs,*situation,*background,*scene,*setting*More
the parts of something written or spoken that immediately precede and follow a word or passage and clarify its meaning.
"word processing is affected by the context in which words appear"
out of context
phrase of*context
1.
without the surrounding words or circumstances and so not fully understandable.
"comments that aides have long insisted were taken out of context"
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popsthebuilder
New member
Your opinion doesn't change the fact that the verse you took out of context had nothing to do with what you said.
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popsthebuilder
New member
Show how prayer is sacrifice and not sustenance.
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marhig
Well-known member
Prayer isn't a sacrifice, we are to offer spirtual sacrifices upon the alter of our hearts, we are the sacrifice, a living sacrifice. Prayer is communicating with God from the depths of our hearts, closing out the world, and asking for guidance and strength to do his will. And we are to pray through Christ Jesus.
What are we sacrificing by praying?
We pray earnestly to the father when we love him from the depths of our hearts. And we lay down our lives for others, and for Christ by the Spirit to do his works through, and worship the father in Spirit and in truth. This is the true sacrifice.
It depends on the type of prayer. Prayer can be an incense offering, (which symbolically ascends by the hand of an Angel, Rev 8:4). Hosea 14:2 says, "Take words with you, and turn unto the LORD: say to Him, "Take away all iniquity and receive us graciously", (we beseech You), and thus shall we offer up the calves/bullocks of our lips", (which is a prayer of repentance and therefore a spiritual sacrifice or ascending offering, (which the translators like to rather erroneously call a "burnt offering")). There are many more similar examples and this also reveals how and why the Torah is absolutely not "abolished", (because it is supernal and spiritual just as even Paul says).
popsthebuilder
New member
I must disagree (not that the Torah is not abolished). If one must equate prayer to an offering then it would be a free will offering in my opinion, and as such, not a sacrifice. A sacrifice is a loss, and our prayers are to be alway in all things; loss in our vein sight, and gain, spiritual and physical. A joyful countenance; eager and happy to abide are the truely faithful.
How can it be a sacrifice.
I do not deny that prayer is an offering or at very least is symbolic of an offering. I do not deny that we offer up our whole selves in faithful love for the Lord GOD. I cannot agree that prayer itself is a sacrifice, unless you consider it a sacrifice of pride/ a free will offering.
peace
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It's not my fault that you don't understand the NT symbolic meaning of sacrifice. It goes to prove that not only don't you know what you're talking about, but you don't even know how to serve or worship. That is why I say that your prayers, your worship and anything else you do in so called service is sinful.
Repent and trust.
Just because you don't understand the scriptures does not invalidate them.
popsthebuilder
New member
You've already be proven wrong on the account you wish to bring up again.
I will not willingly strive with another to no end.
New evidence or different subject.... You've lost as of now.
Learn from it.
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I'm not here to win. I'm here to ensure you are left without excuse. Every time you post you get closer to the edge of the pit.
All of the sacrifices in Torah have something or another to do with prayer and deeds or the cutting off thereof, (cutting off unrighteous deeds, whether physical, words spoken, or thoughts/mind/mental/and-or things of the heart).
Mark 9:43-49 KJV
43 And if thy hand offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter into life maimed, than having two hands to go into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:
44 Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
45 And if thy foot offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter halt into life, than having two feet to be cast into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:
46 Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
47 And if thine eye offend thee, pluck it out: it is better for thee to enter into the kingdom of God with one eye, than having two eyes to be cast into hell fire:
48 Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
49 For every one shall be salted with fire, and every sacrifice shall be salted with salt.
Cutting off sin also constitutes various spiritual sacrifices: it is all about the people and the temple of Elohim, our hearts, minds, souls, and body-temples; which things are no more our own when we enter into the faith that is in Messiah. It is not about animals and shedding innocent blood, (and it never was about those things to begin with either). I'm not trying to discredit your reasons for debating with Truster but rather just saying what I understand to be true from the Word regardless of who is arguing what for whatever reasons here, (in other words not taking sides).
popsthebuilder
New member
I agree with you about the symbolism from the Torah.
I believe we are to sacrifice wants of self and follow the will of GOD.
The only point I disagree on is that prayer is a form of sacrifice. Though to pray for the will of GOD in one's own life isn't done without giving ones self to GOD, the prayer in itself isn't a sacrifice but a plea. One can surely sacrifice the wants of the flesh in prayer, giving themselves to GOD however.
It is splitting hairs at this point.
If you think a prayer to/ pleaing with/ beseeching/ or making supplication towards GOD is a sacrifice then you are entitled to that opinion.
What do you sacrifice when you pray?
One can speak of sacrifices made or to be made in prayer, but this is wrong due simply to the countenance we are to have as believers. There is NO loss in prayer to our Lord GOD.
Show scripture speaking of prayer specifically and how it is a sacrifice.
We all know the obvious symbolism of the law throughout our faith, but that doesn't justify the claim in itself.
peace
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Go up to the great high mountain of Elohim and look behind you: in the mountain of Elohim it shall be seen-provided, (Gen 22:13-14 KJV). I have a spotless Lamb of Elohim who is also a ram, the Ram, which I offer up in all my prayers: this may begin twice daily for starters, a continual evening and morning ascending offering, but the hours of the prayer times are the third hour, the sixth hour, and the ninth hour of the day, (and this is a little different from the statement which Paul makes, "pray without ceasing").
Do you have a spotless Lamb of Elohim to offer up in your ascending prayer offerings? I offer up my Lamb by way of his Righteous Testimony in my ascending offerings of prayer. Can your Lamb of Elohim speak? Did he ever testify? Also, he must be the son of a year, (Exo 29:38,39,40,41,42,43), and that means his ministry was indeed just a little over one year, (in case you might want to apply that to your doctrine elsewhere, such as, your understanding of the chronology laid out in the Gospel of John).
popsthebuilder
New member
My whole point was that we as believers in Christ and the teaching there of, and that His word is faithful, should never callbthe prayers of another sin which is what someone did openly. We are to hide the sin of another. We are not to attempt to break the faith of another. Telling one their prayer is sin is basically attempting to get them to stop praying.
All truster does is attempt to side step and confuse all while producing wholly evil fruit masked as righteousness.
We shouldn't allow ourselves to squint at a gnat and ignore the real issue, which is the fact that someone used out of context scripture to attempt to support a wrongful claim about a good woman.
It is never good or right to assume the substance of another's faith. It is much worse to proclaim such an assumption openly.
Maybe we can address the whole taking away from scripture thing he likes to do, or the fact that when he doesn't want to be shown to be wrong he hides the book chapter and number.
I have never seen anyone literally divide a single verse to suit their own motives until today. I thought it was just understood among believers that it simply isn't to be done, namely due to fear of hell.
peace
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All truster does is attempt to side step and confuse all while producing wholly evil fruit masked as righteousness.
We shouldn't allow ourselves to squint at a gnat and ignore the real issue, which is the fact that someone used out of context scripture to attempt to support a wrongful claim about a good woman.
It is never good or right to assume the substance of another's faith. It is much worse to proclaim such an assumption openly.
Maybe we can address the whole taking away from scripture thing he likes to do, or the fact that when he doesn't want to be shown to be wrong he hides the book chapter and number.
I have never seen anyone literally divide a single verse to suit their own motives until today. I thought it was just understood among believers that it simply isn't to be done, namely due to fear of hell.
peace
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popsthebuilder
New member
There is only One spotless Lamb. I am personally wary of equating the Lamb to a ram or goat though.Go up to the great high mountain of Elohim and look behind you: in the mountain of Elohim it shall be seen-provided, (Gen 22:13-14 KJV). I have a spotless Lamb of Elohim who is also a ram, the Ram, which I offer up in all my prayers: this may begin twice daily for starters, a continual evening and morning ascending offering, but the hours of the prayer times are the third hour, the sixth hour, and the ninth hour of the day, (and this is a little different from the statement which Paul makes, "pray without ceasing").
Do you have a spotless Lamb of Elohim to offer up in your ascending prayer offerings? I offer up my Lamb by way of his Righteous Testimony in my ascending offerings of prayer. Can your Lamb of Elohim speak? Did he ever testify? Also, he must be the son of a year, (Exo 29:38,39,40,41,42,43), and that means his ministry was indeed just a little over one year, (in case you might want to apply that to your doctrine elsewhere, such as, your understanding of the chronology laid out in the Gospel of John).
He tends all His flock friend.
peace
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Father Abraham did not know the name Tetragrammaton name of the Father, (Exo 6:3). Think about that friend, (it is too far off topic). Also you might want to check the Septuagint reading for Gen 22:14.
popsthebuilder
New member
Names are only symbols.Father Abraham did not know the name Tetragrammaton name of the Father, (Exo 6:3). Think about that friend, (it is too far off topic). Also you might want to check the Septuagint reading for Gen 22:14.
The Spirit of GOD is eternal.
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