Ask Knight (Archived)

[death2impiety]

:rotfl:

Errrr did I say....

Chocolate cream pie.

Or possibly chocolate cake.???

I meant to say....

The Sonoran Desert. :noid:

:noid:

I like the Sahara myself...

 

[death2impiety]

How long does it take before a bad leg evolves into a good wing?

 

[Nathon Detroit]

How long does it take before a bad leg evolves into a good wing?

Well... you are going to need pass on a series of helpful mutations to your future generations and hope 10's of thousands of those generations do likewise.

Be carefule though because one bad move and the whole process gets ruined.

 

[fool]

If you were a man in WWII Germany. And someone whom you had complete trust in directed you to toss a hand grenade into a house to kill everyone inside... would you do it?

Different situation. A hand grenade by it's very nature dosen't discriminate, and a house may conceal the enemy. Would I drop a nuke knowing that I'd kill children as well as adults? Sure, that's the nature of a nuke. But that's not what I'm asking, and I asked the question the way I did for a reason. We're talking you and a sword and an infant. See how that's different than a house and a grenade? So now will you answer or will you dodge again?

 

[Nathon Detroit]

Would I drop a nuke knowing that I'd kill children as well as adults? Sure

Why would you do it?

 

[fool]

Why would you do it?

You answer my question and I'll answer yours.
I'll even give you my answer about the nuke first, if you promise to give me your answer on the sword question. Deal?

 

[Nathon Detroit]

You answer my question and I'll answer yours.
I'll even give you my answer about the nuke first, if you promise to give me your answer on the sword question. Deal?

If the God of the universe told me to wipe out a tribe I would be stupid to do anything other than what He instructed.

 

[fool]

If the God of the universe told me to wipe out a tribe I would be stupid to do anything other than what He instructed.

So to put your answer in context of the original question: you would smite a baby with your sword?

 

[Nathon Detroit]

So to put your answer in context of the original question: you would smite a baby with your sword?

Yes, because it would be silly to disobey knowing I was disobeying the creator of the universe and everything in it.

Wouldn't you agree?

Now answer my question....

Why would you drop the bomb?

And I already have a followup question:

Would you drop the bomb if you were instructed to do so from a person you DIDN'T have trust in?

 

[fool]

Yes, because it would be silly to disobey knowing I was disobeying the creator of the universe and everything in it.

Wouldn't you agree?

No I wouldn't agree.
Do you believe in right and wrong?

Now answer my question....

OK

Why would you drop the bomb?

To protect my family.

And I already have a followup question:

Great!

Would you drop the bomb if you were instructed to do so from a person you DIDN'T have trust in?

No, even with a person I did trust, I would have to make my own decision.

 

[Nathon Detroit]

To protect my family.

Yet you are only dropping the bomb and protecting your family based on the trust you have in the person who told you that you should drop the bomb.

No, even with a person I did trust, I would have to make my own decision.

And you already admitted that you would drop the bomb to protect your family.

So therefore.....

YES, fool drops the bomb based on the instruction he is given from a trusted source.
NO, fool doesn't drop the bomb based on the instruction he is given from an untrusted source.

Can we conclude then that you believe that we should weight (or base) our decisions and actions based on the trust we have in the source of our instructions?

 

[fool]

Yet you are only dropping the bomb and protecting your family based on the trust you have in the person who told you that you should drop the bomb.

And you already admitted that you would drop the bomb to protect your family.

So therefore.....

YES, fool drops the bomb based on the instruction he is given from a trusted source.
NO, fool doesn't drop the bomb based on the instruction he is given from an untrusted source.

WRONG
Read it again.
I drop the bomb based on My decision.
The only way others come into play concerns whether or not I'd make into a position to drop the bomb.
So again this statement you made;

YES, fool drops the bomb based on the instruction he is given from a trusted source.

Is inaccurate what I said was;

No, even with a person I did trust, I would have to make my own decision.

Very different from what you said I said.
The difference is even with a person I trusted I would still evaluate the decision, hence an order recieved from a trusted person would not automaticly result in a bomb drop.

Can we conclude then that you believe that we should weight (or base) our decisions and actions based on the trust we have in the source of our instructions?

No, I have just explained we should weigh the actions themselves, the actions themselves should make sense regaurdless of the instructor.

 

[Nathon Detroit]

WRONG
Read it again.
I drop the bomb based on My decision.
The only way others come into play concerns whether or not I'd make into a position to drop the bomb.

The premiss of this topic - if you go back and look (you should know since you started it) - is that we are asked if we would do something based on being told to do so by someone else.

We are relying on the trustworthiness or lack-thereof of our instructor.

The difference is even with a person I trusted I would still evaluate the decision, hence an order received from a trusted person would not automaticly result in a bomb drop.

:duh: Who isn't going to evaluate the decision???? That's only stating the obvious.

I didn't ask you if you were going to "evaluate" your decision, I merely asked you if you would do it. And you didn't ask me if I was going to "evaluate" my decision, but only if I would do it. I think we can assume that whatever decision we make we will have evaluated it. :doh:

Try not to waste our time with meaningless, irrelevant side topics.

No, I have just explained we should weigh the actions themselves, the actions themselves should make sense regaurdless of the instructor.

The premiss of your original question does not outline our actions in detail which makes it all the more important that we trust our source. In your original example I have no idea if the tribe is good, bad, demonic, contaminated, etc. I only have my source to go by.

So... lets try again and see if you can answer without equivocating.

You are flying along in a bomber.

You are flying with a person (the Pilot) who you have complete trust in.

He tells you to open the hatch and drop the atomic bomb. You have no idea where you are or who you are dropping the bomb on, all you know is you have complete trust in your instructor (the Pilot). You know for a fact that the Pilot would never tell you to do anything you shouldn't do, you know that the Pilot would want to protect your family just as much as you would. Do you drop the bomb?

 

[fool]

The premiss of this topic - if you go back and look (you should know since you started it) - is that we are asked if we would do something based on being told to do so by someone else.

Not quite, the premise was would you do something that you would normally consider wrong because Yaweh told you too. You have already responded that you would.

We are relying on the trustworthiness or lack-thereof of our instructor.

Ah-ha, here's were we part, You ask only if Yaweh told you to or not. Correct?
I ask myself "what am I doing?"

:duh: Who isn't going to evaluate the decision???? That's only stating the obvious.

I would hope that it would be obvious, but apparently what's obvious to me isn't to you.
Do you evaluate the decision beyond whether or not Yaweh told you to?

I didn't ask you if you were going to "evaluate" your decision, I merely asked you if you would do it. And you didn't ask me if I was going to "evaluate" my decision, but only if I would do it. I think we can assume that whatever decision we make we will have evaluated it. :doh:

Again, do you evaluate your decision beyond whether or not Yaweh told you to?

Try not to waste our time with meaningless, irrelevant side topics.

Good idea, why don't we table the nuke discussion for now and concentrate on the sword/baby duel.

The premiss of your original question does not outline our actions in detail which makes it all the more important that we trust our source.

I thought it was pretty clear on the premise, you've killed all the adults, and now you're down to the children.
A nuke dosen't dicriminate.
Neither does a hand grenade.
A sword, however, is a one-thrust-one-kill kinda tool.
You've already told us you'd thrust away.
So we know that about you.

In your original example I have no idea if the tribe is good, bad, demonic, contaminated, etc. I only have my source to go by.

Does it matter?
What "source" makes plunging a sword into a newborn right!?
Lets see if you can answer without equivocating.
A sword isn't a nuke or a grenade, it's a sword, you can walk right by that baby and pretend you didn't see it, you could even hide it! imagine that!
The question is; are you sinning when you tell God "no, I won't do that"?

So... lets try again and see if you can answer without equivocating.

You are flying along in a bomber.

You are flying with a person (the Pilot) who you have complete trust in.

He tells you to open the hatch and drop the atomic bomb. You have no idea where you are or who you are dropping the bomb on, all you know is you have complete trust in your instructor (the Pilot). You know for a fact that the Pilot would never tell you to do anything you shouldn't do, you know that the Pilot would want to protect your family just as much as you would. Do you drop the bomb?

Flawed premise, the bold explains it.
And as an aside, it take an agreement of two officers to release nuclear weapons.

 

[Nathon Detroit]

Not quite, the premise was would you do something that you would normally consider wrong because Yaweh told you too. You have already responded that you would.

:doh:

I realize this thread has become painful for you. Too bad for you!

Dropping bombs on anything without knowing precisely what you are doing isn't by definition the "right" thing to do. And since we know nothing of the most important variable..... "the who, what and why", my example is no different than yours.

And as an aside, it take an agreement of two officers to release nuclear weapons.

:rotfl:

And it takes a notarized G-334c form signed by God the Father before you can slay a village.

fool would you say its generally a good idea to follow instructions from a source you trust?

 

[fool]

:doh:

I realize this thread has become painful for you. Too bad for you!

Dropping bombs on anything without knowing precisely what you are doing isn't by definition the "right" thing to do. And since we no nothing of the most important variable..... "the who, what and why", my example is no different than yours.
:rotfl:

And it takes a notarized G-334c form signed by God the Father before you can slay a village.

fool would you say its generally a good idea to follow instructions from a source you trust?

I thought we were gonna get off these side trails?
Do you understand the difference between a sword and a nuke?

 

[fool]

Oh yeah, ya skipped this question;
Does it matter?
What "source" makes plunging a sword into a newborn right!?
Lets see if you can answer without equivocating.
A sword isn't a nuke or a grenade, it's a sword, you can walk right by that baby and pretend you didn't see it, you could even hide it! imagine that!
The question is; are you sinning when you tell God "no, I won't do that"?

 

[fool]

The question is; are you sinning when you tell God "no, I won't do that"?

 

[Nathon Detroit]

What "source" makes plunging a sword into a newborn right!?

The source doesn't make the action any more or less right.

However our trust in our source directly relates to how we should respond to theirs instructions.

Lets see if you can answer without equivocating.

I already answered directly.

Now its time for you to answer...

fool would you say its generally a good idea to follow instructions from a source you trust?

And if so why?

 

[fool]

Ya know what this is pointless.
You can't comprehend telling God no, so I don't think we're gonna get any further,
Thanks for your time.