are you a feminist?

[chrysostom]

there are many ways to react to this thread

1. ignore it
2. don't reply to it
3. I am a feminist because......
4. I am not a feminist because.....
5. I resent the question because...
6. try to insult the one asking the question
7. start a thread about misogynists

 

[annabenedetti]

no I don't
and
that is why I am asking the questions

Do you want to understand how that looks to me?

the reaction to this question is irrational
and
you cannot explain it

I made a perfectly rational request for you to define what the term feminist means to you (and so did several men) and you refused. Why, I don't know.

 

[chrysostom]

Do you want to understand how that looks to me?




I made a perfectly rational request for you to define what the term feminist means to you (and so did several men) and you refused. Why, I don't know.

and I answered many times that it was not about me
it was not about my definition of a feminist
it is about how you feel about feminists and if you would call yourself one

I even accepted your link that explained feminism
and
you still had to play games with me

you have been clever but irrational throughout this thread
you are the one who needs to explain why

 

[Traditio]

I made a perfectly rational request for you to define what the term feminist means to you (and so did several men) and you refused. Why, I don't know.

Here's a possible definition:

Do you think that men and women should be arithmetically equal? That is, men and women should have exactly the same social roles, civil rights, etc.? That is, anything which it is permitted to a man to do, a woman also should be able to do, and the other way around?

 

[rexlunae]

Historically speaking, men were landed, and women were not! Do you want a historically unlanded people voting? That makes no sense. :nono:

Well, that's at least an argument I haven't heard before. So that's something.

 

[resurrected]

Historically speaking, men were landed, and women were not! Do you want a historically unlanded people voting? That makes no sense. :nono:

:think: historically, were philosophers landed?

 

[Rusha]

why don't we hear more from grandmothers

You have ... now why don't you speak out as most grandfathers who value their daughters and grand-daughters would?

 

[annabenedetti]

and I answered many times that it was not about me
it was not about my definition of a feminist
it is about how you feel about feminists and if you would call yourself one

I even accepted your link that explained feminism
and
you still had to play games with me

you have been clever but irrational throughout this thread
you are the one who needs to explain why

I haven't been irrational, chrys. You've been downright stubborn, that's all.

I'm not playing games, you just refuse to be helpful. If you'd been helpful, you'd have your answer from me by now. You're shooting yourself in the foot and blaming it on me.

I noticed too that you didn't answer if you wanted to understand how your list looked to me, either. I don't really believe you want to know what I think. I believe you want to be able to pin a label on me and sort me neatly into whatever box you think I belong.

 

[annabenedetti]

Well, that's at least an argument I haven't heard before. So that's something.

I've heard it before, from other men who don't believe women should vote.

 

[annabenedetti]

Here's a possible definition:

Do you think that men and women should be arithmetically equal? That is, men and women should have exactly the same social roles, civil rights, etc.? That is, anything which it is permitted to a man to do, a woman also should be able to do, and the other way around?

Civil rights? Of course. Why wouldn't they?

Social roles? I don't know what you have in mind. What are some examples?

 

[Rusha]

I've heard it before, from other men who don't believe women should vote.

I think there is a lot more of that than some people would wish to admit.

 

[resurrected]

these women shouldn't

 

[Traditio]

Well, that's at least an argument I haven't heard before. So that's something.

Here's another argument:

As a certain poster indicated in this thread, women are exceedingly busy. They have to have babies, take care of children, take care of their homes, have jobs, take care of their parents, and do a million and one other things...and all of this while fending off sexual harrassment.

Aren't they far too busy to keep up with politics? Wouldn't we actually be doing women a favor, making their lives easier and less complicated, if we disenfranchised then?

See? Women should be begging us to take way their right to vote, and thanking us for taking the trouble to lighten their burdens!

 

[kmoney]

Civil rights? Of course. Why wouldn't they?

Social roles? I don't know what you have in mind. What are some examples?

I second this.

 

[kmoney]

good question

what do you think?

My instinct is to say no. But I'm not sure. It may just be that women are more vocal about it and when it comes to actual voting the numbers are more similar. :idunno: Of course, Roe v Wade was a court case, not legislation. And was that Court made up of women or men?? :think:

According to Nick:

Of course. Abortions are performed where women are not even allowed to speak in public. Going by numbers alone, men are more "pro-choice" than women in the US.

If that stat is correct I'd be surprised.

 

[kmoney]

Another thing that I think of when I think of feminism is women who want to liberate themselves to be promiscuous. There is a double standard that allows men to sleep around and be womanizers but women are called whores if they do some of the same things. Some women want to break that double standard down. I won't say the double standard is right but I don't think their answer is the correct one.


There is an article about a new face of feminism on The Daily Beast today. It's not TOL friendly though. But one quote from it seems to speak to this.

“People are uncomfortable with the idea of a multidimensional women,” Sciortino says. “Either you’re the slutty sex monster or you’re a lawyer, whereas men can be both. We don’t have slutty role models.”

 

[aikido7]

We're in your face

Cool.

 

[aikido7]

That's exactly it ...

Kinda like Jesus, huh? He set the standard. I am trying to keep up but I keep limping along behind him.

 

[Arthur Brain]

there are many ways to react to this thread

1. ignore it
2. don't reply to it
3. I am a feminist because......
4. I am not a feminist because.....
5. I resent the question because...
6. try to insult the one asking the question
7. start a thread about misogynists

You left out the most prevalent response: Asking the author of the thread to define feminism so the thread could bring out productive conversation. When a link showing the varied and multifaceted aspects of the term was provided by another poster you identified as at least a 'first tier' feminist by conceding that women should be allowed to vote.

Did you forget that?

 

[chrysostom]

You left out the most prevalent response: Asking the author of the thread to define feminism so the thread could bring out productive conversation. When a link showing the varied and multifaceted aspects of the term was provided by another poster you identified as at least a 'first tier' feminist by conceding that women should be allowed to vote.

Did you forget that?

you prove my point
you are talking about anna who was clever enough to show that I was a feminist just because I agreed that women should be allowed to vote
I don't have a definition
and
this thread would be all about my definition
if
I were to present one

how many times do I have to explain this?

this is about how you think about feminists and whether or not you consider yourself one

nice try art
I am sure anna appreciates you efforts
looking forward to something new from you

I got you covered

6. try to insult the one asking the question