11-year-old Gang-Rape Victim: Should She Be Able To Legally Abort?

[quip]

I honestly don't care, at a personal level, but the fact that you don't see this is absolutely stupid.

Likewise to your blindness regarding LH's manipulation tactics.

 

[Christian Liberty]

I wonder about the poll also. Not their daughter ravaged by 11 animals. I would have no problem with an abortion in this case.

What kind of a Christian are you? No wonder you're so quick to defend the military as well.

I mean, it would be one thing to defend her choice with some form of rational analysis (I could provide one, but it would be purely devil's advocate and would give pro-choicers ammunition so I won't bother) but to actually have "No problem with it?"

Repent.

 

[Christian Liberty]

I wonder about the poll also. Not their daughter ravaged by 11 animals. I would have no problem with an abortion in this case.

Also: Shut up, you're making Reformed theology look bad in front of open theists...

 

[Bright Raven]

What kind of a Christian are you? No wonder you're so quick to defend the military as well.

I mean, it would be one thing to defend her choice with some form of rational analysis (I could provide one, but it would be purely devil's advocate and would give pro-choicers ammunition so I won't bother) but to actually have "No problem with it?"

Repent.

You are one who needs to respect the choices of others. I would not be so quick to condemn you.

 

[1PeaceMaker]

I believe Oz and Peace must clod only a few steps away from the rapists by holding the notion that she must have deserved to be raped...else their moral idealism ..ie.. "letting nature take its course" holds limited authority.

Trying to use the guilt by association fallacy? How many fallacies are you going to run through? I've never even thought such a thing.

As I've already stated, I am a mother to 6 children.

Hypothetically if one of them were conceived via rape they'd still be my children and that's all I'd be concerned with regarding their well being. Not who was their father.

I'm not into eugenics, and I don't see the child as deserving death to avoid motherhood or to clean a rapist's kid out of the gene pool.

Whenit's already been forced by the impregnation anyway killing the kid doesn't change the fact that I'm a mother, it just adds to it that I'm a killer if I do it.

People not letting me murder a child already forced on me is not forcing a pregnancy - that's already done, it's not letting me become a murderer through hatred for my rapists.

Besides, circumventing the natural process of birth puts a woman at a mental and physical disadvantage, which keeps being ignored by abortion supporters.

There is a hormonal symphony to be respected for the well being of a mother. But the psychological price of murder is even greater.

The interests of mother and baby are one when their bodies are one. What is bad for the babe is bad for the mom.

 

[Christian Liberty]

You are one who needs to respect the choices of others. I would not be so quick to condemn you.

I "respect": at least as far as the law concerns, virtually every choice that anyone could make. I am "Pro-choice" on virtually everything other than abortion.

Want to shoot heroin? Go ahead. I don't support it, but you get to pick what you put into your own body. Want to own an automatic weapon? Go ahead: just as long as you don't kill innocent people with it, and we ASSUME you won't do that until you actually do. No background checks, no registration, no nothing. You want to get gay married? Go ahead. I don't support the legal sham known as "Gay marriage" because its really just a way of getting government more involved in the issue, but I do absolutely support getting government out of marriage licensing altogether. Heck, forget gay marriage: want to be a polygamist? Go ahead. Sleep with an animal? I'll have nothing to do with anyone so perverted, but I don't advocate a law against it (Of course, the most common arguments in favor of such laws are "Animal rights" which is crap seeing as we eat animals all the time.) Want to start a business without a business license? Go right ahead. And no regulations. I doubt many people here would agree with me on eliminating the FDA, the EPA, anti-price gouging laws, medical licensing, and every other regulation known to man. I seriously doubt you agree with that. Want to sell your organs? Go ahead. Engage in duels to the death? If both parties consent, go right ahead.

And I respect the right of other countries to deal with their problems as they see fit, and the right of the American people to spend their money as they see fit, as such, I oppose any war not purely out of self-defense, including to stop genocide.

I don't support the right to murder the innocent. No matter what horrible crimes a rapist may have committed against a woman, that does not give her any right to murder her child. Although, as a constitutionalist, I do believe jurisdiction to punish such crimes belongs at the state level, not a Federal level.

There is nothing "Pro-choice" about a pro-murder stance, and the VAST majority of people who hold that stance don't support freedom of choice for virtually anything else.

Of course, most "pro-life" conservatives also proudly display and pledge the American flag, and proudly support the men and women who go overseas to slaughter other people in order to impose our will on their countries. So most of them aren't really "Pro-life" either. Raised in a pro-military culture, and considering you defend the same, Its not a surprise to me you'd be inconsistent in defending the unborn as well.


There you go, a post EVERYONE can hate!

 

[Bright Raven]

I "respect": at least as far as the law concerns, virtually every choice that anyone could make. I am "Pro-choice" on virtually everything other than abortion.

Want to shoot heroin? Go ahead. I don't support it, but you get to pick what you put into your own body. Want to own an automatic weapon? Go ahead: just as long as you don't kill innocent people with it, and we ASSUME you won't do that until you actually do. No background checks, no registration, no nothing. You want to get gay married? Go ahead. I don't support the legal sham known as "Gay marriage" because its really just a way of getting government more involved in the issue, but I do absolutely support getting government out of marriage licensing altogether. Heck, forget gay marriage: want to be a polygamist? Go ahead. Sleep with an animal? I'll have nothing to do with anyone so perverted, but I don't advocate a law against it (Of course, the most common arguments in favor of such laws are "Animal rights" which is crap seeing as we eat animals all the time.) Want to start a business without a business license? Go right ahead. And no regulations. I doubt many people here would agree with me on eliminating the FDA, the EPA, anti-price gouging laws, medical licensing, and every other regulation known to man. I seriously doubt you agree with that. Want to sell your organs? Go ahead. Engage in duels to the death? If both parties consent, go right ahead.

And I respect the right of other countries to deal with their problems as they see fit, and the right of the American people to spend their money as they see fit, as such, I oppose any war not purely out of self-defense, including to stop genocide.

I don't support the right to murder the innocent. No matter what horrible crimes a rapist may have committed against a woman, that does not give her any right to murder her child. Although, as a constitutionalist, I do believe jurisdiction to punish such crimes belongs at the state level, not a Federal level.

There is nothing "Pro-choice" about a pro-murder stance, and the VAST majority of people who hold that stance don't support freedom of choice for virtually anything else.

Of course, most "pro-life" conservatives also proudly display and pledge the American flag, and proudly support the men and women who go overseas to slaughter other people in order to impose our will on their countries. So most of them aren't really "Pro-life" either. Raised in a pro-military culture, and considering you defend the same, Its not a surprise to me you'd be inconsistent in defending the unborn as well.


There you go, a post EVERYONE can hate!

I respect your right to your opinion even if I don't agree with it.

 

[Christian Liberty]

I respect your right to your opinion even if I don't agree with it.

No personal hard feelings either. I fight hard in political debates, but don't usually have (Or at least retain) any hard feelings.

That said, I'd like you to defend the position that a baby's right to live can somehow be lost because of the actions of his/her father(s).

 

[Christian Liberty]

Even for the religious Christians here, I would like to remind them that the soul does not enter the embryo straight away, it takes over a month for an embryo to get a soul. The idea that life begins from conception is just not true, not even religiously.

That's not a Biblical concept.

Only if they don't know the reality of what actually goes on behind those closed doors.

You mean gay people having sex?

 

[Bright Raven]

No personal hard feelings either. I fight hard in political debates, but don't usually have (Or at least retain) any hard feelings.

That said, I'd like you to defend the position that a baby's right to live can somehow be lost because of the actions of his/her father(s).

I don't think there would be any true gain to debate of this subject. No matter which side is taken, the outcome is tragic. I'm just going to respectfully bow out.

 

[Christian Liberty]

I don't think there would be any true gain to debate of this subject. No matter which side is taken, the outcome is tragic. I'm just going to respectfully bow out.

Rape doesn't justify murder. It clearly, obviously does not, according to the Bible. Romans 3:8

 

[glorydaz]

The thing is this WoZ.
No matter how that baby got there I would never tell someone to kill their kid.

That "someone" is a kid. :dead: How much trauma would you like the child to endure? Should she have to marry one of the rapists, too?

If my 11 yrd old grandchild got raped, I would make sure she had a D&C ASAP. I wouldn't even let her know there could be a pregnancy. There is a place in the Law for MERCY, and if ever there was a case, it's this one.

 

[glorydaz]

Rape doesn't justify murder. It clearly, obviously does not, according to the Bible. Romans 3:8

The "evil" would be putting the child through more trauma than she'd already been through. Perhaps if you'd ever had a baby, you'd know why an 11 yr. old shouldn't be forced to be raped all over again just because some looker-on wanted to force his convictions on such an innocent.

 

[Rusha]

The "evil" would be putting the child through more trauma than she'd already been through. Perhaps if you'd ever had a baby, you'd know why an 11 yr. old shouldn't be forced to be raped all over again just because some looker-on wanted to force his convictions on such an innocent.

No one has argued in regards to the innocence of the rape victim. Oddly enough, what is being completely overlooked is the innocence of the unborn baby who some have no qualms with intentionally killing. IF the circumstance of how the pregnancy occurred is the determining factor for which babies should or should not be allowed to live, then there is no longer any basis to argue against ANY abortion.

Either unborn babies are innocent and deserving of life OR their value is determined by the mother in question. Which is it?

 

[ebenz47037]

I wasn't yet diagnosed, but thought I might have it based on the observations of others that I exhibited some of the symptoms. I was officially diagnosed in the summer of 2010.

Okay. Sorry about that. I thought you said something earlier.

 

[Granite]

Brandon has told us this before a few years ago (I can't remember the exact date). And, he told me (and I think a few others) when I took him to Denver for death2impiety's and Maximeee's wedding.

Ah, gotcha.

I've had the delightful little ball of sunshine and joy on ignore for a while now but since others aren't that prudent (zing) I occasionally see his posts. First time I've heard this.

 

[Granite]

That "someone" is a kid. :dead: How much trauma would you like the child to endure? Should she have to marry one of the rapists, too?

If my 11 yrd old grandchild got raped, I would make sure she had a D&C ASAP. I wouldn't even let her know there could be a pregnancy. There is a place in the Law for MERCY, and if ever there was a case, it's this one.

Exactly. Letting the rapist win, or re-traumatizing an eleven-year-old, or causing more agony for the entire family, seem like the "tender mercies of the wicked" that the proverb warns about.

 

[Christian Liberty]

That "someone" is a kid. :dead: How much trauma would you like the child to endure? Should she have to marry one of the rapists, too?

If my 11 yrd old grandchild got raped, I would make sure she had a D&C ASAP. I wouldn't even let her know there could be a pregnancy. There is a place in the Law for MERCY, and if ever there was a case, it's this one.

There's a place for mercy. If due to emotional trauma the 11 year old were to have an abortion, I wouldn't advocate her execution.

Nonetheless, murder of an innocent child is NOT OK just because another innocent child was raped.

The "evil" would be putting the child through more trauma than she'd already been through. Perhaps if you'd ever had a baby, you'd know why an 11 yr. old shouldn't be forced to be raped all over again just because some looker-on wanted to force his convictions on such an innocent.

I haven't, but I know people who have that agree with me. And I don't agree with her being forced to be raped again, I support not allowing her to murder her child.

No one has argued in regards to the innocence of the rape victim. Oddly enough, what is being completely overlooked is the innocence of the unborn baby who some have no qualms with intentionally killing. IF the circumstance of how the pregnancy occurred is the determining factor for which babies should or should not be allowed to live, then there is no longer any basis to argue against ANY abortion.

Either unborn babies are innocent and deserving of life OR their value is determined by the mother in question. Which is it?

Exactly.

Exactly. Letting the rapist win, or re-traumatizing an eleven-year-old, or causing more agony for the entire family, seem like the "tender mercies of the wicked" that the proverb warns about.

How is that "Letting the rapist win?" Feel free to execute the rapist. Only in the mind of a twisted atheist would allowing the unborn child to live be "Letting the rapist win."

Repent.

 

[Lighthouse]

Even for the religious Christians here, I would like to remind them that the soul does not enter the embryo straight away, it takes over a month for an embryo to get a soul. The idea that life begins from conception is just not true, not even religiously.

And you have Bible passages to support that posit?

Likewise to your blindness regarding LH's manipulation tactics.

What manipulation tactics?

You mean gay people having sex?

No.

 

[illusionray]

And you have Bible passages to support that posit?

No I don't and I don't need to. The Qur'an suffices as a mouthpiece for the Bible. It's not like the Bible has any worth anymore, it is hopelessly outdated, and the cherry picking of the Bible by Christians is really getting tiring, but it is necessary to keep the book alive.