Young Earth or Old?

[oatmeal]

Is the earth relatively young (6,000-10,000 years old) or is it old (millions or billions of years old)? This thread will discuss this subject. First, let us look at the following two verses which refer to the creation:

"In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth" (Gen.1:1).​

​

"For thus saith the LORD that created the heavens; God himself that formed the earth and made it; he hath established it, he created it not in vain, he formed it to be inhabited" (Isa.45:18).​

In the beginning the LORD created the earth and formed it to be inhabited. However, sometime after He formed it to be inhabited it became "without form" and dark so that it was no longer fitted to be inhabited:

"In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters. And God said, Let there be light: and there was light. And God saw the light, that it was good: and God divided the light from the darkness. And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day" (Gen.1:5).​

What is said in "bold" in the following statement refers to the earth being inhabited before it was in a state described as being without form:

"Of the origin of our world the first chapter of Genesis tells us nothing save that 'in the beginning,' whenever that was, God 'created' it. It may be, as Tyndall said in his Belfast address, that 'for eons embracing untold millions of years, this earth has been the theatre of life and death.' But as to this the 'Mosaic narrative' is silent. It deals merely with the renewing and refurnishing of our planet as a home for man" (Sir Robert Anderson, A DOUBTER'S DOUBTS About Science and Religion).​

Sometime after the world was no longer habitable the LORD began to re-form both the earth and the heavens to make it habitable and that took six days. So in the debate between Christian about whether the earth is young or old I say that it is old.

I agree.

If we look closely at the six days, not of creation, but of restoration, we see that the actual act of creation did not occur everyday in those six days.

If we correctly conclude that scripture is authored by God and God alone, we can certainly conclude that God knows what He did and that He described what he did accurately.

Does God say He created on the first day? That is, Genesis 1:3-5

3 And God said, Let there be light: and there was light.
4 And God saw the light, that it was good: and God divided the light from the darkness.
5 And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day.

God does describe His activity as "creating" but saying, God said, and saw and divided and called. Not one mention of creation.

I will go on further, if there is any interest

 

[Clete]

I agree.

If we look closely at the six days, not of creation, but of restoration, we see that the actual act of creation did not occur everyday in those six days.

If we correctly conclude that scripture is authored by God and God alone, we can certainly conclude that God knows what He did and that He described what he did accurately.

Does God say He created on the first day? That is, Genesis 1:3-5

3 And God said, Let there be light: and there was light.
4 And God saw the light, that it was good: and God divided the light from the darkness.
5 And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day.

God does describe His activity as "creating" but saying, God said, and saw and divided and called. Not one mention of creation.

I will go on further, if there is any interest

So there was a time before light existed, then God spoke and then it did exist but that isn't "creating light", according to you.

You are an idiot!

I see that there's still good reason to leave you on ignore.

 

[Rebel for truth]

Is the earth relatively young (6,000-10,000 years old) or is it old (millions or billions of years old)? This thread will discuss this subject. First, let us look at the following two verses which refer to the creation:

"In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth" (Gen.1:1).​

​

"For thus saith the LORD that created the heavens; God himself that formed the earth and made it; he hath established it, he created it not in vain, he formed it to be inhabited" (Isa.45:18).​

In the beginning the LORD created the earth and formed it to be inhabited. However, sometime after He formed it to be inhabited it became "without form" and dark so that it was no longer fitted to be inhabited:

"In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters. And God said, Let there be light: and there was light. And God saw the light, that it was good: and God divided the light from the darkness. And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day" (Gen.1:5).​

What is said in "bold" in the following statement refers to the earth being inhabited before it was in a state described as being without form:

"Of the origin of our world the first chapter of Genesis tells us nothing save that 'in the beginning,' whenever that was, God 'created' it. It may be, as Tyndall said in his Belfast address, that 'for eons embracing untold millions of years, this earth has been the theatre of life and death.' But as to this the 'Mosaic narrative' is silent. It deals merely with the renewing and refurnishing of our planet as a home for man" (Sir Robert Anderson, A DOUBTER'S DOUBTS About Science and Religion).​

Sometime after the world was no longer habitable the LORD began to re-form both the earth and the heavens to make it habitable and that took six days. So in the debate between Christian about whether the earth is young or old I say that it is old.

Good point .... There are a few ministers who are actually beginning to teach that the correct translation in Genesis should be the Earth *became* void and without form. And that would support why God told man to be fruitful multiply and *replenish* the Earth. And there is a strong possibility that the war that took place in heaven is behind whatever happened.

 

[oatmeal]

So there was a time before light existed, then God spoke and then it did exist but that isn't "creating light", according to you.

You are an idiot!

I see that there's still good reason to leave you on ignore.

Did God create it? God did not say He created it. He simply spoke.

If I ask you to turn on an electric lamp and you do it and light appears, are you going to claim you "created" light?

I would hope not. Humans do not create, only God can create.

Everything needed for the lamp to emit light was in place, all you did is turn the lamp on.

So, what now? Are you now a creator? Are you claiming to be God?

 

[Right Divider]

Did God create it? God did not say He created it. He simply spoke.

If I ask you to turn on an electric lamp and you do it and light appears, are you going to claim you "created" light?

I would hope not. Humans do not create, only God can create.

Everything needed for the lamp to emit light was in place, all you did is turn the lamp on.

So, what now? Are you now a creator? Are you claiming to be God?

I never cease to be amazed how dumb your posts are.

There was no light and then there was. Did God not create it? Whether is was created when He spoke or not is irrelevant.

 

[oatmeal]

I never cease to be amazed how dumb your posts are.

There was no light and then there was. Did God not create it? Whether is was created when He spoke or not is irrelevant.

Why not reply to my questions?

Why not?

Are my questions too hard for you?

Too much evidence and logic for you?

 

[Right Divider]

Why not reply to my questions?

Why not?

Are my questions too hard for you?

Too much evidence and logic for you?

Even dumber than your last post!

God created light. So says the Bible.

Gen 1:3 (AKJV/PCE)​

(1:3) And God said, Let there be light: and there was light.​

No light before... light after.

 

[JudgeRightly]

Too much evidence and logic for you?

What evidence? What logic?

 

[JudgeRightly]

There are a few ministers who are actually beginning to teach that the correct translation in Genesis should be the Earth *became* void and without form.

And they do so in spite of what the rest of Scripture says.

Which just makes them wrong.

And that would support why God told man to be fruitful multiply and *replenish* the Earth.

I already addressed this. Repeating your claim won't make it magically come true.

"Replenish" just means "to fill."

It does not mean "to fill again."

He taught wrongly.

There is no "became" in that verse.



Nope. Nothing happened between Genesis 1:1 and 1:2.



It's not so.



Nope.

"Replenish" is not the correct translation. It works, but only for one of it's definitions.

The word used in the original Hebrew text was "male" (pronounced "maw-lay"). and means "to fill or be full."

There is nothing in its meaning that implies being "filled again."



7500 years is definitely very old.



Genesis 1:6-8

The name of the earth was "Heaven."



Roughly 7500 years, give or take a century.

Adam fell within 14 days of Genesis 1:1.



You believe wrongly.



As always, when this comes up: The CONTEXT of the word yom ALWAYS specifies its meaning.

In Genesis 1, there is no other possibility for it to mean anything other than a literal, 24-hour period. The context does not allow it.

In other passages, yes, it means "age" or an undefined period of time. But in Genesis 1, the context defines it as a normal, literal day.



Ok, and?

And there is a strong possibility that the war that took place in heaven is behind whatever happened.

The "war that took place in heaven" took place in the Garden of Eden, which WAS Heaven, by every definition of the word. It happened around the time Adam and Eve sinned and were kicked out of the Garden.

There is no gap between Genesis 1:1 and 1:2.

The earth did not "become" void and without form.

God did not tell Adam and Eve to fill the earth "again."

All of these interpretations are solutions in search of a problem. God created a perfect world and universe, and took 6 days to do it, and then rested on the seventh. There was no sin and death prior to the Fall, no corruption.

Jesus said:

But from the beginning of the creation, God ‘made them male and female.’ ‘For this reason a man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh’; so then they are no longer two, but one flesh.

Bible Gateway passage: Mark 10:6, Mark 10:7, Mark 10:8 - New King James Version

But from the beginning of the creation, God ‘made them male and female.’

www.biblegateway.com

A clear reference to Genesis 1.

"From the beginning of the creation."

Not: "from the beginning of the re-creation that God had to do because the world had become void and without form."

"In the beginning" God "made them male and female."

The first six days is the beginning of the creation. Not some alleged unspecified eons that you assert exists (without evidence) between Genesis 1:1 and 1:2.

 

[Idolater]

I agree.

If we look closely at the six days, not of creation, but of restoration, we see that the actual act of creation did not occur everyday in those six days.

If we correctly conclude that scripture is authored by God and God alone, we can certainly conclude that God knows what He did and that He described what he did accurately.

Does God say He created on the first day? That is, Genesis 1:3-5

3 And God said, Let there be light: and there was light.
4 And God saw the light, that it was good: and God divided the light from the darkness.
5 And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day.

God does describe His activity as "creating" but saying, God said, and saw and divided and called. Not one mention of creation.

I will go on further, if there is any interest

What are you thinking you're going to accomplish by attempting to argue that God didn't create ex nihilo in Genesis one? What's the upshot? What are you getting out of this?

 

[Clete]

What are you thinking you're going to accomplish by attempting to argue that God didn't create ex nihilo in Genesis one? What's the upshot? What are you getting out of this?

Excellent question!

The fact that you're asking an intentionally irrational crazy person to make sense just means you won't get an answer.

 

[Clete]

Exodus 20:11a For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested the seventh day.

Exodus 31:17 It is a sign between Me and the children of Israel forever; for in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, and on the seventh day He rested and was refreshed.’ ”

 

[oatmeal]

Even dumber than your last post!

God created light. So says the Bible.

Gen 1:3 (AKJV/PCE)​

(1:3) And God said, Let there be light: and there was light.​

No light before... light after.

That's right! God did not have to create anything for light to happen. He spoke and light happened.

God accurately told us how light happened and how it did not happen. He did not create light, therefore, He did not say, "and God created light" but rather, God accurately described what He did.

Genesis 1:3

And God said, Let there be light: and there was light.

 

[oatmeal]

What evidence? What logic?

See my reply to Right divider

 

[oatmeal]

I never cease to be amazed how dumb your posts are.

There was no light and then there was. Did God not create it? Whether is was created when He spoke or not is irrelevant.

NO. God did not have to create light. No more than you create light when you turn on a lamp, or light a candle

 

[oatmeal]

Excellent question!

The fact that you're asking an intentionally irrational crazy person to make sense just means you won't get an answer.

God uses the word "create" in how many verses in Genesis 1?

Why don't you count them?

If God created in every act in Genesis 1, my question is why didn't God say create to describe every act He did in Genesis 1?

 

[oatmeal]

And they do so in spite of what the rest of Scripture says.

Which just makes them wrong.



I already addressed this. Repeating your claim won't make it magically come true.

"Replenish" just means "to fill."

It does not mean "to fill again."





The "war that took place in heaven" took place in the Garden of Eden, which WAS Heaven, by every definition of the word. It happened around the time Adam and Eve sinned and were kicked out of the Garden.

There is no gap between Genesis 1:1 and 1:2.

The earth did not "become" void and without form.

God did not tell Adam and Eve to fill the earth "again."

All of these interpretations are solutions in search of a problem. God created a perfect world and universe, and took 6 days to do it, and then rested on the seventh. There was no sin and death prior to the Fall, no corruption.

Jesus said:

But from the beginning of the creation, God ‘made them male and female.’ ‘For this reason a man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh’; so then they are no longer two, but one flesh.

Bible Gateway passage: Mark 10:6, Mark 10:7, Mark 10:8 - New King James Version

But from the beginning of the creation, God ‘made them male and female.’

www.biblegateway.com

A clear reference to Genesis 1.

"From the beginning of the creation."

Not: "from the beginning of the re-creation that God had to do because the world had become void and without form."

"In the beginning" God "made them male and female."

The first six days is the beginning of the creation. Not some alleged unspecified eons that you assert exists (without evidence) between Genesis 1:1 and 1:2.

It does not take a Phd in Theology to look up the meaning of the word "was" in a concordance. It clearly indicates that something came to pass. It became without form and void. God did not create a mess that He had to spent six days fixing. All Gods works are good, including the original act of creation in Genesis 1:1

To replenish or to fill is what God commanded them to do. There had never been humans before, although there had been apes before, therefore God told them to fill.

 

[Right Divider]

That's right! God did not have to create anything for light to happen. He spoke and light happened.

And how is this not creation? (Hint: it is creation).

 

[oatmeal]

And how is this not creation? (Hint: it is creation).

It is no more creation than when I turn on the lights in a room.

Everything that was necessary for light was already created in Genesis 1:1. In the beginning.

Since the earth became without form and void, God had to repair it.

Genesis 1:2
And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.

Jeremiah 4:23
I beheld the earth, and, lo, it was without form, and void; and the heavens, and they had no light.

Without form and void is tou bou.

God did not create a mess.

Isaiah 45:18
For thus saith the Lord that created the heavens; God himself that formed the earth and made it; he hath established it, he created it not in vain, he formed it to be inhabited: I am the Lord; and there is none else.

The word for vain in v 18 is the Hebrew word tou.

God did not create the heaven and the earth tou, thus something happened to the heaven and the earth to make it so.

God does not do slipshod workmanship.

Deu 32:4

He is the Rock, his work is perfect: for all his ways are judgment: a God of truth and without iniquity, just and right is he.

perfect here meaning complete,whole sound, healthful

The mutiny by Lucifer is the cause of the chaos. They were cast down.

Rev 12:9

And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.

 

[Right Divider]

It is no more creation than when I turn on the lights in a room.

Nope, it's nothing like that.

Everything that was necessary for light was already created in Genesis 1:1. In the beginning.

Light created... Got it.

World created and then formed.

You are wrong.