Why I Don't Believe in Calvinism or Predestination

[Robert Pate]

You repeatedly open new threads on Calvinism because the Gospel Truths of TULIP,
which you know are supported by the scriptures, serve to continually obsess / haunt you !

~~~~~

Please show me one scripture where God has predestinated someone to heaven or to hell.

TULIP is not supported by the Bible. In order to believe in Calvinism you have to assume that the scriptures are saying some things that they may not be saying at all.

The word "Predestinate" only appears in the New Testament 4 times. The words "Faith" and "Believe" appear hundreds of times.

If predestination was a true doctrine the Bible would be full of it. There is little to nothing.

 

[Robert Pate]

Is predestination the same as preordained, or destined? If it is then I must conclude that it is a truth as all things are predestined in our life and experiences prior to our conception in my opinion. Thanks.

Then you must believe that you are a puppet or a robot.

 

[popsthebuilder]

Then you must believe that you are a puppet or a robot.

Free will negates predestination by the will of God and His gift. This effectively removes any possibility of us acting similar to an inanimate object. Thank you.

 

[Robert Pate]

Free will negates predestination by the will of God and His gift. This effectively removes any possibility of us acting similar to an inanimate object. Thank you.

An inanimate object is a puppet or a robot, of which we are not of.

 

[Nanja]

Please show me one scripture where God has predestinated someone to heaven or to hell.

TULIP is not supported by the Bible. In order to believe in Calvinism you have to assume that the scriptures are saying some things that they may not be saying at all.

The word "Predestinate" only appears in the New Testament 4 times. The words "Faith" and "Believe" appear hundreds of times.

If predestination was a true doctrine the Bible would be full of it. There is little to nothing.

All whom God had Chosen in His Son Jesus Christ before the foundation of the world
were predestinated to receive the Adoption of Sons: An Eternal Inheritance!

Eph. 1:4,11 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world,
that we should be holy and without blame before him in love: (v.5) Having predestinated us
unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself according to the good pleasure of his will
(v.11) In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to
the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will.

These Chosen Sons of God were predestinated to an Eternal Inheritance.
That speaks of them forever being with Christ in Heaven!


But all the rest are the seed of the serpent:

John 8:44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do.
He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth,
because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own:
for he is a liar, and the father of it.

These are the goats which will hear Christ say:

Mat. 25:41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me,
ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels.

The same are the Vessels of Wrath fitted for destruction Rom. 9:22!

These are those the devil sowed in the world Mat. 13:38-39.
Their Eternal Destiny is Hell.

~~~~~

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

All whom God had Chosen in His Son Jesus Christ before the foundation of the world
were predestinated to receive the Adoption of Sons: An Eternal Inheritance!

Eph. 1:4,11 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world,
that we should be holy and without blame before him in love: (v.5) Having predestinated us
unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself according to the good pleasure of his will
(v.11) In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to
the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will.

These Chosen Sons of God were predestinated to an Eternal Inheritance.
That speaks of them forever being with Christ in Heaven!


But all the rest are the seed of the serpent:

John 8:44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do.
He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth,
because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own:
for he is a liar, and the father of it.

These are the goats which will hear Christ say:

Mat. 25:41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me,
ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels.

The same are the Vessels of Wrath fitted for destruction Rom. 9:22!

These are those the devil sowed in the world Mat. 13:38-39.
Their Eternal Destiny is Hell.

~~~~~

Your "Mentor" is B57, another crazy "Hyper-Calvinist!"

 

[Robert Pate]

All whom God had Chosen in His Son Jesus Christ before the foundation of the world
were predestinated to receive the Adoption of Sons: An Eternal Inheritance!

Eph. 1:4,11 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world,
that we should be holy and without blame before him in love: (v.5) Having predestinated us
unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself according to the good pleasure of his will
(v.11) In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to
the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will.

These Chosen Sons of God were predestinated to an Eternal Inheritance.
That speaks of them forever being with Christ in Heaven!


But all the rest are the seed of the serpent:

John 8:44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do.
He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth,
because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own:
for he is a liar, and the father of it.

These are the goats which will hear Christ say:

Mat. 25:41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me,
ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels.

The same are the Vessels of Wrath fitted for destruction Rom. 9:22!

These are those the devil sowed in the world Mat. 13:38-39.
Their Eternal Destiny is Hell.

~~~~~

There is NOTHING in your post that proves predestination.

God chose all of humanity in his Son Jesus Christ before the foundation of the world.

You pick scriptures that you think prove predestination, but they don't.

 

[Cedarbay]

Your "Mentor" is B57, another crazy "Hyper-Calvinist!"

How do you define hyper-Calvinist? Calvinists accuse certain other Calvinists of this as well. Do you have experience with this? I forget whether you are former Calvinist.

 

[Nanja]

Your "Mentor" is B57, another crazy "Hyper-Calvinist!"

It comforts you greatly to say all kinds of evil against God's true servants,
yet because of it, God has Promised them a great reward Mat. 5:11-12!

However you, and so many others with blinded minds 2 Cor. 4:3-4,
don't believe all the scriptures, but pick and choose only the ones
which are palatable to your man-made, made-up false teachings
that support belief in your false gospel of works Gal 1:8.

Eph. 2:8-9 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves:
it is the gift of God: (v.9) Not of works, lest any man should boast.

2 Tim. 1:9
Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works,
but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began

Any profession of religion that teaches that one's Salvation is in any way dependent
on what the sinner does is a false religion.

A prime example is your repetitive boasting of how
you have placed your faith in Christ to have Eternal Life. :nono:

Salvation by Grace is exclusively for the Election of Grace Rom. 11:5-6.
And Faith, a Gift and Fruit of the Spirit Eph. 2:8; Gal. 3:22, is exclusively given to God's Elect Titus 1:1.

"A man can receive nothing, except it be given him from heaven." John 3:27!

So much for your confidence in the flesh: Your own "freewill" choosing!

~~~~~

 

[popsthebuilder]

All whom God had Chosen in His Son Jesus Christ before the foundation of the world
were predestinated to receive the Adoption of Sons: An Eternal Inheritance!

Eph. 1:4,11 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world,
that we should be holy and without blame before him in love: (v.5) Having predestinated us
unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself according to the good pleasure of his will
(v.11) In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to
the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will.

These Chosen Sons of God were predestinated to an Eternal Inheritance.
That speaks of them forever being with Christ in Heaven!


But all the rest are the seed of the serpent:

John 8:44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do.
He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth,
because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own:
for he is a liar, and the father of it.

These are the goats which will hear Christ say:

Mat. 25:41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me,
ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels.

The same are the Vessels of Wrath fitted for destruction Rom. 9:22!

These are those the devil sowed in the world Mat. 13:38-39.
Their Eternal Destiny is Hell.

~~~~~

That in no way means that the rest are going to hell.

All whom God had Chosen in His Son Jesus Christ before the foundation of the world
were predestinated to receive the Adoption of Sons: An Eternal Inheritance!

Eph. 1:4,11 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world,
that we should be holy and without blame before him in love: (v.5) Having predestinated us
unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself according to the good pleasure of his will
(v.11) In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to
the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will.

These Chosen Sons of God were predestinated to an Eternal Inheritance.
That speaks of them forever being with Christ in Heaven!


But all the rest are the seed of the serpent:

John 8:44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do.
He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth,
because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own:
for he is a liar, and the father of it.

These are the goats which will hear Christ say:

Mat. 25:41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me,
ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels.

The same are the Vessels of Wrath fitted for destruction Rom. 9:22!

These are those the devil sowed in the world Mat. 13:38-39.
Their Eternal Destiny is Hell.

~~~~~

 

[popsthebuilder]

It comforts you greatly to say all kinds of evil against God's true servants,
yet because of it, God has Promised them a great reward Mat. 5:11-12!

However you, and so many others with blinded minds 2 Cor. 4:3-4,
don't believe all the scriptures, but pick and choose only the ones
which are palatable to your man-made, made-up false teachings
that support belief in your false gospel of works Gal 1:8.

Eph. 2:8-9 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves:
it is the gift of God: (v.9) Not of works, lest any man should boast.

2 Tim. 1:9
Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works,
but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began

Any profession of religion that teaches that one's Salvation is in any way dependent
on what the sinner does is a false religion.

A prime example is your repetitive boasting of how
you have placed your faith in Christ to have Eternal Life. :nono:

Salvation by Grace is exclusively for the Election of Grace Rom. 11:5-6.
And Faith, a Gift and Fruit of the Spirit Eph. 2:8; Gal. 3:22, is exclusively given to God's Elect Titus 1:1.

"A man can receive nothing, except it be given him from heaven." John 3:27!

So much for your confidence in the flesh: Your own "freewill" choosing!

~~~~~

Salvation is through selfless Faith and the selfless works that stem from that Faith under God, with all praise to God.

All whom God had Chosen in His Son Jesus Christ before the foundation of the world
were predestinated to receive the Adoption of Sons: An Eternal Inheritance!

Eph. 1:4,11 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world,
that we should be holy and without blame before him in love: (v.5) Having predestinated us
unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself according to the good pleasure of his will
(v.11) In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to
the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will.

These Chosen Sons of God were predestinated to an Eternal Inheritance.
That speaks of them forever being with Christ in Heaven!


But all the rest are the seed of the serpent:

John 8:44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do.
He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth,
because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own:
for he is a liar, and the father of it.

These are the goats which will hear Christ say:

Mat. 25:41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me,
ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels.

The same are the Vessels of Wrath fitted for destruction Rom. 9:22!

These are those the devil sowed in the world Mat. 13:38-39.
Their Eternal Destiny is Hell.

~~~~~

 

[Robert Pate]

It comforts you greatly to say all kinds of evil against God's true servants,
yet because of it, God has Promised them a great reward Mat. 5:11-12!

However you, and so many others with blinded minds 2 Cor. 4:3-4,
don't believe all the scriptures, but pick and choose only the ones
which are palatable to your man-made, made-up false teachings
that support belief in your false gospel of works Gal 1:8.

Eph. 2:8-9 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves:
it is the gift of God: (v.9) Not of works, lest any man should boast.

2 Tim. 1:9
Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works,
but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began

Any profession of religion that teaches that one's Salvation is in any way dependent
on what the sinner does is a false religion.

A prime example is your repetitive boasting of how
you have placed your faith in Christ to have Eternal Life. :nono:

Salvation by Grace is exclusively for the Election of Grace Rom. 11:5-6.
And Faith, a Gift and Fruit of the Spirit Eph. 2:8; Gal. 3:22, is exclusively given to God's Elect Titus 1:1.

"A man can receive nothing, except it be given him from heaven." John 3:27!

So much for your confidence in the flesh: Your own "freewill" choosing!

~~~~~

You have a wrong view of God.

The God of the Bible..."So loved the world that he gave his only begotten Son, that WHOSOEVER believes in him should not perish, but have everlasting life" John 3:16.

 

[Nanja]

You have a wrong view of God.

The God of the Bible..."So loved the world that he gave his only begotten Son, that WHOSOEVER believes in him should not perish, but have everlasting life" John 3:16.

It is God's Will that your mind / understanding is darkened;
walking in the vanity of your mind Eph. 4:17.

Eph. 4:18: Having the understanding darkened,
being alienated from the life of God through the ignorance that is in them,
because of the blindness of their heart

The Truth of the scriptures remain hidden from you:
They are Spiritual 1 Cor. 2:13, but you remain carnal.

2 Cor. 4:3-4 But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost:
(v.4) In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them
which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ,
who is the image of God, should shine unto them.

~~~~~

 

[Robert Pate]

It is God's Will that your mind / understanding is darkened;
walking in the vanity of your mind Eph. 4:17.

Eph. 4:18: Having the understanding darkened,
being alienated from the life of God through the ignorance that is in them,
because of the blindness of their heart

The Truth of the scriptures remain hidden from you:
They are Spiritual 1 Cor. 2:13, but you remain carnal.

2 Cor. 4:3-4 But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost:
(v.4) In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them
which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ,
who is the image of God, should shine unto them.

~~~~~

You think that I am unsaved, don't you?

You think that I am unsaved because I don't believe in Calvinism.

You apparently believe that you are saved because you believe in Calvinism and anyone that doesn't believe in Calvinism is lost.

So there is a contradition, because you keep saying that there is nothing we can do to save ourselves, yet you believe that you are saved because you believe in Calvinism.

Is not that something that you do?

 

[Nanja]

You think that I am unsaved, don't you?

You think that I am unsaved because I don't believe in Calvinism.

You apparently believe that you are saved because you believe in Calvinism and anyone that doesn't believe in Calvinism is lost.

So there is a contradition, because you keep saying that there is nothing we can do to save ourselves, yet you believe that you are saved because you believe in Calvinism.

Is not that something that you do?

There is absolutely nothing, no action whatsoever, we can do to become saved, period!

But Believing the Truth is the evidence that one is Saved, because belief / faith in the Truth
is a fruit and gift of the Spirit given in the New Birth. So before one is Born of God he is unable to come to Truth,
or do anything else that pleases God Rom. 8:7-8.


2 Thes. 2:13-14
But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because
God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:
(v.14) Whereunto he called you by our gospel, to the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ.


Now for those who do not believe in the Gospel of God's Electing Grace (Acts 20:24; 2 Tim. 1:9):

2Thes. 2:10-12
And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth,
that they might be saved. (v.11) And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
(v.12) That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.


Calvinism's doctrinal Truths of TULIP, are founded strictly upon the Word of God.
If you don't believe all of the Word of God you are in a state of unbelief and apostasy.

~~~~~

 

[Robert Pate]

There is absolutely nothing, no action whatsoever, we can do to become saved, period!

But Believing the Truth is the evidence that one is Saved, because belief / faith in the Truth
is a fruit and gift of the Spirit given in the New Birth. So before one is Born of God he is unable to come to Truth,
or do anything else that pleases God Rom. 8:7-8.


2 Thes. 2:13-14
But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because
God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:
(v.14) Whereunto he called you by our gospel, to the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ.


Now for those who do not believe in the Gospel of God's Electing Grace (Acts 20:24; 2 Tim. 1:9):

2Thes. 2:10-12
And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth,
that they might be saved. (v.11) And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
(v.12) That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.


Calvinism's doctrinal Truths of TULIP, are founded strictly upon the Word of God.
If you don't believe all of the Word of God you are in a state of unbelief and apostasy.

~~~~~

Did you not chose Calvinism? That is something that you did.

 

[Nanja]

Did you not chose Calvinism? That is something that you did.

You mean "choose"?

Absolutely not, is was not my choice.

None of us has a choice whether we believe the Truth or not: It is all of God's choosing!

2 Thes. 2:13-14
But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because
God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:
(v.14) Whereunto he called you by our gospel, to the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ.

~~~~~

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

You mean "choose"?

Absolutely not, is was not my choice.

None of us has a choice whether we believe the Truth or not: It is all of God's choosing!

2 Thes. 2:13-14
But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because
God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:
(v.14) Whereunto he called you by our gospel, to the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ.

~~~~~

You seek to spread the "false doctrine" of Hyper-Calvinism. You
people believe that God creates all sin. You also believe God
choose certain people to save (The Elect) and the rest were
chosen for eternal damnation. Those are lies!

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

B57 and Nanja are "Hyper-Calvinist Fanatics."

 

[Nanja]

B57 and Nanja are "Hyper-Calvinist Fanatics."

Instead of your obnoxious regurgitation of the same old, same old...

Bring some pertinent scriptures from the Word of God to the table to substantiate your careless refutation.

~~~~~