Why are christians celebrating christmas ?

[Ktoyou]

TRADITION? OF PAGANS UH ..?
.............................

No, but you are a nut, :dunce:

 

[Ktoyou]

No, no, you got that wrong. If you're going to cast out demons, do it in Yeshua's name for you have no power of your own to do so. You owe Ktoyou an apology.

I’m not holding my breath, not when it comes to comments from little cuckoo birds.

I wonder, why do so many of these crackpots want to play the great prophet? It seems like a fad, one for geeks with no technical talent?

One would assume that one would find out, as to whom one is addressing? Then think about it, they do not care about anyone, but their own kittle egos, unto themselves, as it does not shine for anyone else.

 

[Tambora]

I would guess that if you were to have taken a pole...every single person on TOL be it Christian or otherwise already knew that which you are suggesting so many don't know.

Yep.

Ferdin08 came barreling in, preaching to the choir.

 

[vegascowboy]

me annoying person i just posted why are seeing the post
go away satan

What is your problem?

Other than provoking good people, spewing vitriol, offending Christians as well as Jews (and those in between)?

 

[rocketman]

I love to see newbs come in swingin and snortin about all the things of Christianity they do not know. From the looks of this one I believe we have us a Seventh Day Adventist/Cultist posing as a Christian. :think:

 

[keypurr]

Truth really does hurt sometimes.
Why is everyone so defensive to what has been known for years?

.

 

[Tambora]

I love to see newbs come in swingin and snortin about all the things of Christianity they do not know. From the looks of this one I believe we have us a Seventh Day Adventist/Cultist posing as a Christian. :think:

The pamphlet he/she suggested is from the United Church of God, an offshoot the Worldwide Church of God.

Non-trinitarian.
Annihilation.
British Israelism.

 

[steko]

Welcome to TOL.

Happy Festivus!

 

[RevTestament]

I am a newbie here..! first of all thanks to everyone who are going to tell their opinion :dead:

Here are some facts :
1. There is no biblical evidence that Dec. 25 was Jesus birth date,

2.Luke tells us that the shepherds were keeping their sheep in the fields at night when Jesus was born. "And she [Mary] brought forth her firstborn Son, and wrapped Him in swaddling cloths, and laid Him in a manger, because there was no room for them in the inn. Now there were in the same country shepherds living out in the fields, keeping watch over their flock by night" (Luke 2:7-8
, emphasis added throughout).
But late December is Judea's cold and rainy season. Would shepherds actually keep their fragile flocks out in the open fields on a cold late-December night near Bethlehem?
No responsible shepherd would subject his sheep to the elements at that time of year when cold rains, and occasional snow, are common in that region.

3.Luke also tells us that Jesus was born at the time of a census ordered by the Roman emperor (Luke 2:1-3). The Romans were brilliant administrators; they certainly would not have ordered people to journey to be registered at a time of year when roads would have been wet and muddy and traveling conditions miserable. Such a move would have been self-defeating on its face.

4.If the Christmas holiday is an important celebration to honor the birth of Jesus Christ, why is it nowhere mentioned in the Bible? Why didn't Christ instruct His closest followers, His 12 chosen apostles, to keep Christmas? Why didn't they institute or teach it to the early Church?

**Before you answer, consider that Jesus gave great authority to His 12 apostles, assuring them that they will hold positions of great importance and responsibility in His Kingdom (Matthew 18:18
; 19:28; Luke 22:29-30). But since Jesus never taught His apostles to keep Christmas, nor did they ever teach it to the Church though they had years of opportunity to do so, shouldn't that make us question whether Christmas is something Jesus really wants or appreciates?**

5. Jeremiah 10:3-4
A tree from the forest is cut down
and worked with an axe by the hands of a craftsman.
4 They decorate it with silver and gold;
they fasten it with hammer and nails
so that it cannot move.
**see the orgin of xmas tree**

6.The Christmas holiday is largely a recycled pagan celebration.
Again, surprising but true! Read it for yourself in just about any encyclopedia.
Consider the customs associated with Christmas. What do decorated evergreen trees, holly, mistletoe, yule logs, a jolly plump man in a fur-lined red suit, sleighs and flying reindeer have to do with the birth of Jesus Christ?
None of these things have anything to do with Him, but they have a lot to do with ancient pagan festivals. (Read the eye-opening details in our free booklet Holidays or Holy Days: Does It Matter Which Days We Keep? )
And what about the date of Dec. 25? How did it come to be assigned as the supposed date of Jesus Christ's birth? Historians Gerard and Patricia Del Re explain:
"The tradition of celebrating December 25 as Christ's birthday came to the Romans from Persia. Mithra, the Persian god of light and sacred contracts, was born out of a rock on December 25. Rome was famous for its flirtations with strange gods and cults, and in the third century the unchristian emperor Aurelian established the festival of Dies Invicti Solis, the Day of the Invincible Sun, on December 25.
"Mithra was an embodiment of the sun, so this period of its rebirth was a major day in Mithraism, which had become Rome's latest official religion . . . It is believed that the emperor Constantine adhered to Mithraism up to the time of his conversion to Christianity. He was probably instrumental in seeing that the major feast of his old religion was carried over to his new faith" ( The Christmas Almanac, 1979, p. 17).
It's difficult to determine the first time anyone celebrated Dec. 25 as Christmas, but historians generally agree that it was sometime during the fourth century—some 300 years after Christ's death. And then a contrived date was chosen because it was already a popular pagan holiday celebrating the birth of the sun god!
Similarly, virtually all of the customs associated with Christmas are recycled from ancient pagan festivals honoring other gods.


What you gonna do christians? **for example** If you have a son/daughter and they have birthday on july 5,and am telling to celebrate it on september 16 means do you appreciate? then how the god can appreciate that?..

FAMOUS WORDS COME TO MIND - "If 50 million people believe a foolish thing, it's still a foolish thing." -- George Bernard Shaw.

wake up christians....worship the god our lord in the way he wanted...! God bless you all

WATCH THIS VIDEO BEFORE YOU DO ANY COMMENTS/DISCUSSIONS:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-RdJvQg7YqI

**share your thoughts**

This last Christ mass I wished everyone a happy Saturnalia here at TOL and then I flew in to be with my parents and in-laws for the holiday. I no longer try to make Christ mass about Christ's birth, but I do enjoy sharing gifts and being with family. I believe remembering Christ's sacrifice and resurrection is much more significant - and yes, I have a low opinion of "Easter."

 

[Tambora]

Truth really does hurt sometimes.
Why is everyone so defensive to what has been known for years?

.

Because it is suggesting that anything used by pagans cannot be used by Christians.


Pagans used animals for sacrifice.
Pagans used temples.
etc.
etc.
etc.

Those that worshiped the true God also used those things.
It's not the "thing" used that makes it pagan or Christian, it is always about which god you serve that makes it pagan or Christian.

No Christian serves Mithra, or Baal, or any other false god, when they set up a Christmas tree.

 

[genuineoriginal]

It's not the "thing" used that makes it pagan or Christian, it is always about which god you serve that makes it pagan or Christian.

Was it pagan to make the golden calf?

Exodus 32:8 CJB 8 So quickly they have turned aside from the way I ordered them to follow! They have cast a metal statue of a calf, worshipped it, sacrificed to it and said, ‘Isra’el! Here is your god, who brought you up from the land of Egypt!’”​

 

[steko]

Ferdin08: FAMOUS WORDS COME TO MIND - "If 50 million people believe a foolish thing, it's still a foolish thing." -- George Bernard Shaw.

George Bernard Shaw was a fool.

Psa 14:1 The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God.

 

[rainee]

..just dont stick with the tradition with out knowing

The people who lived back then, who knew all parts of their cultural heritage because they owned it and lived it -- they changed everything for their children and themselves when they became Christians. It is too late to tell them they couldn't do that for they already did. Saturnalia is gone, Greek gods are turned to myths, Norse paganism turned and bent more decoratively than a Celtic knot. It's done.

Try to bring "knowing" back if you want to now - that is fine. The Gentiles already have had their Christianity overcome all of those things it appears to me. Do you see it?


1 Corinthians 8:4-6
1 Corinthians 10:25-30

 

[rainee]

FOR 8 YEARS

I have been telling these posters here on TOL

that Christmas is a Pagan Tradition

which God Hates.

BUT THEY ARE STUCK IN THEIR PAGAN TRADITIONS.

Jer 10:3 For the customs of the people are vain:

for one cutteth a tree out of the forest, with the axe.

4 They deck it with silver and with gold

they fasten it with nails and with hammers, that it move not.

5 They are upright but speak not and they cannot do evil nor good.



Re 2:6 But this thou hast, that thou hatest the deeds of the Nicolaitans, which I also hate.

Re 2:15 So hast thou also them that hold the doctrine of the Nicolaitans, which thing I hate.

Omega,
I trust by faith that it is right for you to say what you say about the Nicolaitans because there is something we must remember about what God hates.

But I am not sure whether you are focusing on the point that it is why they do what they do that is so wrong - isn't that right?

The same with Jeremiah talking about idols.
I think many people today might think any icon is an idol. Which is wrong to me.

Icons are on my Windows, so that should tell us we need to remember it is what an icon represents that matters - isn't that right? Is that not what Paul said in Corinthians? Am I wrong, Omega?

If you say today an Icon of hundreds of years in age was of Isis and her child, however, the people after or during that time thought it was of Mary and the Lord Jesus as a baby - what will that mean to God?

What if they did not worship the Icon but they used it to bring to mind and remember the Gospel Story, to pray, and to teach their children? What if they could not read? What if.. He judges the heart?

Guys who worship their cars may be more guilty today than those people back then, isn't that possible?

 

[bornofgod]

What you gonna do christians? **for example** If you have a son/daughter and they have birthday on july 5,and am telling to celebrate it on september 16 means do you appreciate? then how the god can appreciate that?..

FAMOUS WORDS COME TO MIND - "If 50 million people believe a foolish thing, it's still a foolish thing." -- George Bernard Shaw.

wake up christians....worship the god our lord in the way he wanted...! God bless you all

WATCH THIS VIDEO BEFORE YOU DO ANY COMMENTS/DISCUSSIONS:



**share your thoughts**

What difference does it make to celebrate a birthday on the wrong day when they can't obey God's commandment; "Thou shalt not worship other gods before me"?

There's only one Creator of all things, not three in one. Read the prophecies to find out.

Isaiah 44
6: Thus says the LORD, the King of Israel and his Redeemer, the LORD of hosts: "I am the first and I am the last; besides me there is no god.
24: Thus says the LORD, your Redeemer, who formed you from the womb: "I am the LORD, who made all things, who stretched out the heavens alone, who spread out the earth -- Who was with me? --

I guarantee you that the little boy's birthday they celebrate isn't the Creator of all things. But I do know that this little boy's flesh was created by Him as His first saint with the knowledge of God to speak for Him. Then there were many other saints who spoke from the same knowledge of God that the first saint spoke from.

Isaiah 45
5: I am the LORD, and there is no other, besides me there is no God; I gird you, though you do not know me,
6: that men may know, from the rising of the sun and from the west, that there is none besides me; I am the LORD, and there is no other.
7: I form light and create darkness, I make weal and create woe, I am the LORD, who do all these things.

Amos 4
13: For lo, he who forms the mountains, and creates the wind, and declares to man what is his thought; who makes the morning darkness, and treads on the heights of the earth -- the LORD, the God of hosts, is his name!

 

[Tehmill]

What difference does it make to celebrate a birthday on the wrong day when they can't obey God's commandment; "Thou shalt not worship other gods before me"?

There's only one Creator of all things, not three in one. Read the prophecies to find out.

Isaiah 44
6: Thus says the LORD, the King of Israel and his Redeemer, the LORD of hosts: "I am the first and I am the last; besides me there is no god.
24: Thus says the LORD, your Redeemer, who formed you from the womb: "I am the LORD, who made all things, who stretched out the heavens alone, who spread out the earth -- Who was with me? --

I guarantee you that the little boy's birthday they celebrate isn't the Creator of all things. But I do know that this little boy's flesh was created by Him as His first saint with the knowledge of God to speak for Him. Then there were many other saints who spoke from the same knowledge of God that the first saint spoke from.
In the beginning was the word and the word was WITH God and the word WAS God and all things were made by Him...and the word became flesh and dwelt among us..

John writes so as to make each point UNassailable, it totally stitches you up. He was WITH God, He WAS God, He made all things, He became flesh, He dwelt among us.

You and your crowd are stitched up.

Isaiah 45
5: I am the LORD, and there is no other, besides me there is no God; I gird you, though you do not know me,
6: that men may know, from the rising of the sun and from the west, that there is none besides me; I am the LORD, and there is no other.
7: I form light and create darkness, I make weal and create woe, I am the LORD, who do all these things.

Amos 4
13: For lo, he who forms the mountains, and creates the wind, and declares to man what is his thought; who makes the morning darkness, and treads on the heights of the earth -- the LORD, the God of hosts, is his name!

 

[keypurr]

Because it is suggesting that anything used by pagans cannot be used by Christians.


Pagans used animals for sacrifice.
Pagans used temples.
etc.
etc.
etc.

Those that worshiped the true God also used those things.
It's not the "thing" used that makes it pagan or Christian, it is always about which god you serve that makes it pagan or Christian.

No Christian serves Mithra, or Baal, or any other false god, when they set up a Christmas tree.

No, I think it goes deeper than that Tam. Folks feel comfortable in their traditions. When they come into question, folks try to defend them rather than see if "maybe" they have been wrong all along.
.

 

[Tambora]

No, I think it goes deeper than that Tam. Folks feel comfortable in their traditions. When they come into question, folks try to defend them rather than see if "maybe" they have been wrong all along.
.

So, let me get this straight ......

You actually believe that your Christian neighbor that puts up a Christmas tree is doing so to worship a pagan god?

That is basing their belief entirely on a false perception of a "thing" rather than what is in their heart.

So, yeah, it does go deeper than that.
Deep into the heart.

 

[Delmar]

Was it pagan to make the golden calf?

Exodus 32:8 CJB 8 So quickly they have turned aside from the way I ordered them to follow! They have cast a metal statue of a calf, worshipped it, sacrificed to it and said, ‘Isra’el! Here is your god, who brought you up from the land of Egypt!’”​

I showed cattle in 4-H for ten years. I received lots of shinny cow trophies but never worshipped or sacrificed to to them and sure never said "Here is your god"

 

[GuySmiley]

Was it pagan to make the golden calf?

Exodus 32:8 CJB 8 So quickly they have turned aside from the way I ordered them to follow! They have cast a metal statue of a calf, worshipped it, sacrificed to it and said, ‘Isra’el! Here is your god, who brought you up from the land of Egypt!’”​

Yes, but they were worshiping it as a god.

Do you think people can accidentally or unknowingly worship something? I don't.