WHICH CHURCH WAS HEBREWS WRITTEN TO?

God's Truth

New member
How do you know that they are not "blood related to Abraham"?

They didn’t change their ethnicity. They are Gentiles who are converts to Judaism.
You have been going against me saying it could not happen, and now you are making a case for it. They are NOT blood related to Abraham. They are GENTILES who became converts. So no mixed messages from you, okay?
 

God's Truth

New member
The gentiles were not offered the first covenant. God specifically chose the nation of Israel to be His people.


Paul uses a lot of symbolic and metaphorical language. Paul says that he is a minister of the new covenant IN THE SPIRIT and NOT THE LETTER. The LETTER of the new covenant is that is new to Israel (old first with them and then new with them).


This mashing verse together to force it to agree with your story is no replacement for actually understanding what it really means.


You do not understand what Paul is talking about as per usual.


Jesus taught Israel to follow the law. Matthew 23:1-3, Matthew 28:20

GENTILES ARE NOT BLOOD RELATED to ABRAHAM.

The Gentiles COULD come into the covenant and be as Jews.

ANYONE who wanted to be in a covenant with God had to do the things Moses told them to do.
 

Right Divider

Body part
No, not just because you say so. You have no word from God on that.
I give you the Word of God rightly divided. You give a fairy tale where you throw the Bible in a blender and destroy the true meaning.

I obey everything that Jesus says to do to get saved.
You sure think so.

Jesus tells us how to get saved.
By grace through faith.... that's how the gospel of the grace of God works.

His words are not mashed and they are not only for a limited time and not only for the lost sheep of Israel.
YOU are the one that mashes His words.

You can frantically (as you always do) post your false beliefs here. It does not move any of us that know the truth.
 

Shasta

Well-known member
Right Divider;n2733542]
Only the blind cannot see the difference between what Paul wrote and what the rest wrote.

The Gnostics talked this way. They believed they had revelation knowledge which the ordinary believer COULD not see? Having heard the same kind of thing from many modern cultists, I find this kind of ad hominem argument unconvincing.

I simply follow what the scripture says.

Yes, that is what everyone says

Jeremiah quotes GOD Himself as saying that the new covenant is between Himself and Israel. The author of Hebrews confirms this by quoting Jeremiah.

I know this comes from Jeremiah 31 but what does the rest of it say?

33 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, declares the LORD: I will put my LAW WITHIN THEM, and I will WRITE IT ON THEIR HEARTS. And I will be their God, and they shall be MY PEOPLE. 34 And no longer shall each one teach his neighbor and each his brother, saying, ‘Know the LORD,’ for they shall all KNOW ME, from the least of them to the greatest, declares the LORD. For I will FORGIVE THEIR INIQUITY, and I will remember their sin no more.”
(Jeremiah 31:31-38)

So what would be the benefits of the New Covenant? According to Jeremiah they consisted of:
a. FORGIVENESS of sin
b. Becoming GOD'S PEOPLE
c. KNOWING God
d. Transformation: HAVING the law written on our hearts (by the Spirit)

All of these benefits were received by the Gentiles who believed. In fact, a great deal of what the NT is about is that Gentiles were meant to receive the Gospel too.
They were also to be joined with the Jews in the new covenant by Christ's BODY and BLOOD. Like the Seder, the Communion Supper is a re-enactment of Christ's death and the redemption of those who believe in Him.
19 And He took the bread, gave thanks and broke it, and gave it to them, saying, “This is My body, given for you; do this in remembrance of Me.” 20 In the same way, after supper He took the cup, saying, “This cup is the NEW COVENANT IN MY BLOOD, which is poured out for you.
(Luke 22:20)

That Gentiles believers were partakers of the new covenant along with the Jews was shown in their joint participation in the Eucharist. Sharing the wine and bread at a common table indicated that they shared a common life-source and were united together as one Body:

16 Is not the cup of blessing which we bless a sharing in the BLOOD of Christ? Is not the bread which we break a sharing in the BODY of Christ? 17 Since there is one bread, we who are MANY are ONE BODY; for we all PARTAKE OF ONE BREAD.
(1 Corinthians 10:12)

The word MANY refers to us as individuals. In Corinth individual believers consisted of BOTH JEWS and GENTILES. However, there was no PARTITION dividing the Body of Christ because IN CHRIST (i.e., soteriologically) God makes no distinction between racial groups.

Paul who ministered to Jews, as well as Gentiles in Corinth, said he was a minister of the New Covenant.

Not that we are adequate in ourselves to consider anything as coming from ourselves, but our adequacy is from God, 6 who also made us adequate as SERVANTS of a NEW COVENANT, not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life (2 Corinthians 3:5-16)

Gentile believers were ALWAYS allowed to join with Israel. That does not make them Israel.

Whether or not a Gentile become a Jew is irrelevant to his salvation. If a Gentile believer had to become a Jew the early Church would have insisted that they be circumcised

Paul says that there are NEITHER Jew NOR Greek in the body of Christ.

NEITHER is NOT the same as AND.

Their racial identity was not erased. At the same time, both were part of the same Body.
 

Right Divider

Body part
The Gnostics talked this way. They believed they had revelation knowledge which the ordinary believer COULD not see? Having heard the same kind of thing from many modern cultists, I find this kind of ad hominem argument unconvincing.
False accusation.

I know this comes from Jeremiah 31 but what does the rest of it say?

33 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, declares the LORD: I will put my LAW WITHIN THEM, and I will WRITE IT ON THEIR HEARTS. And I will be their God, and they shall be MY PEOPLE. 34 And no longer shall each one teach his neighbor and each his brother, saying, ‘Know the LORD,’ for they shall all KNOW ME, from the least of them to the greatest, declares the LORD. For I will FORGIVE THEIR INIQUITY, and I will remember their sin no more.”
(Jeremiah 31:31-38)
All about the nation of Israel and their relationship with God.

So what would be the benefits of the New Covenant? According to Jeremiah they consisted of:
a. FORGIVENESS of sin
b. Becoming GOD'S PEOPLE
c. KNOWING God
d. Transformation: HAVING the law written on our hearts (by the Spirit)
The context is God's relationship with Israel.

The body of Christ is not under the law. So why would we need the law written in/on our hearts?
 

God's Truth

New member
I give you the Word of God rightly divided. You give a fairy tale where you throw the Bible in a blender and destroy the true meaning.


You sure think so.


By grace through faith.... that's how the gospel of the grace of God works.


YOU are the one that mashes His words.

You can frantically (as you always do) post your false beliefs here. It does not move any of us that know the truth.

We have to believe that we have to obey this man who came along and said we have to go through him now to belong to God.

We have to believe that we have to now obey Jesus.

No such teaching from Jesus or anyone of God that we don't have to obey God and Jesus.

No such thing as Jesus' words only being for Jews.

No such thing that Paul came alone teaching a different way than what Jesus taught.
 

God's Truth

New member
Jesus came to earth to teach the way to God the Father.

He came to make a new covenant based on faith.

Jesus' covenant is a Last Will and Testament, not unlike the Last Will and Testament that humans make

Jesus came for those who already belonged to God by faith.

They were God's but they now had to go through Jesus to keep being God's.

Jesus said when he is crucified, then all---ALL can come to him to be saved, even the cut off Jews and disobedient Gentiles.


John 12:32 And I, when I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all people to myself."
 

Right Divider

Body part
We have to believe that we have to obey this man who came along and said we have to go through him now to belong to God.

We have to believe that we have to now obey Jesus.

No such teaching from Jesus or anyone of God that we don't have to obey God and Jesus.

No such thing as Jesus' words only being for Jews.

No such thing that Paul came alone teaching a different way than what Jesus taught.

This is a story that you've invented (or someone invented and you follow them). You twist the scripture beyond recognition to "support" your story.
 

God's Truth

New member
Just imagine what some here want everyone to believe.

They want us to believe that all of Jesus' teachings on what to do, how to eat him, how to receive eternal life....is all for the Jews; and, that Jesus gave Paul ANOTHER teaching not like the one Jesus gave!

That makes Paul STILL the chief of all sinners by going AGAINST THE CHURCH, like he used to!

Galatians 1:13 For you have heard of my previous way of life in Judaism, how intensely I persecuted the church of God and tried to destroy it.



It makes Paul a hypocrite and self cursed person---if we are to believe that he taught another gospel.


Galatians 1:6-8 Only One Gospel

6 I marvel that you are turning away so soon from Him who called you in the grace of Christ, to a different gospel, 7 which is not another; but there are some who trouble you and want to pervert the gospel of Christ. 8 But even if we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel to you than what we have preached to you, let him be accursed.



Paul isn't a hypocrite who curses himself.


Romans 1:1 Paul, a servant of Christ Jesus, called to be an apostle and set apart for the gospel of God—


NOT ANOTHER GOSPEL!


Paul was an IMITATOR of Christ.

1 Corinthians 11:1 Be imitators of me, just as I also am of Christ.
 

Right Divider

Body part
Just imagine what some here want everyone to believe.

They want us to believe that all of Jesus' teachings on what to do, how to eat him, how to receive eternal life....is all for the Jews; and, that Jesus gave Paul ANOTHER teaching not like the one Jesus gave!

That makes Paul STILL the chief of all sinners by going AGAINST THE CHURCH, like he used to!

Galatians 1:13 For you have heard of my previous way of life in Judaism, how intensely I persecuted the church of God and tried to destroy it.

It makes Paul a hypocrite and self cursed person---if we are to believe that he taught another gospel.

Galatians 1:6-8 Only One Gospel

6 I marvel that you are turning away so soon from Him who called you in the grace of Christ, to a different gospel, 7 which is not another; but there are some who trouble you and want to pervert the gospel of Christ. 8 But even if we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel to you than what we have preached to you, let him be accursed.

Paul isn't a hypocrite who curses himself.

Romans 1:1 Paul, a servant of Christ Jesus, called to be an apostle and set apart for the gospel of God—

NOT ANOTHER GOSPEL!

Paul was an IMITATOR of Christ.

1 Corinthians 11:1 Be imitators of me, just as I also am of Christ.

You continue to lie about what we are telling you. You refuse to see the truth.

If what you (and many here) say was true... there was no reason for God to call Paul and separate him from the twelve.
 

Right Divider

Body part
A Jew is a PERSON BLOOD related to Abraham, ISAAC, and JACOB.
No kidding.

A Jew is a person who CAME INTO the covenant by getting circumcised in the flesh, and obeying the old law.
No kidding.

YOU said THIS
GENTILES ARE NOT BLOOD RELATED to ABRAHAM.
And that is WRONG!!!!

Abraham had MANY, MANY descendants (BLOOD RELATED) that are GENTILES.

I try to help you, but you prefer to remain ignorant.
 

God's Truth

New member
You continue to lie about what we are telling you. You refuse to see the truth.

If what you (and many here) say was true... there was no reason for God to call Paul and separate him from the twelve.

Paul was destroying the church. Paul said he was destroying the church and that Jesus saved him and showed him what he must suffer for it now. Paul said he was saved to show that the worst of sinners could still be saved.
 

God's Truth

New member
No kidding.


No kidding.

YOU said THIS

And that is WRONG!!!!

Abraham had MANY, MANY descendants (BLOOD RELATED) that are GENTILES.

I try to help you, but you prefer to remain ignorant.

Gentiles are not blood related to Abraham.

Show where a person related to Abraham is called a Gentile.

Use scripture to prove what you say.


Gentile (from Latin gentilis 'of or belonging to the same people or nation', from gēns 'clan; tribe; people, family') is a term that usually means 'someone who is not a Jew'. Other groups that claim Israelite heritage sometimes use the term to describe outsiders.https://www.google.com/search?q=Gent...hrome&ie=UTF-8
 
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