What is the Gospel?

[meshak]

What "ostracized Christians" are you talking about, Meshak?

They are called non-believers, heretics and cult.

 

[Tambora]

Sure, go ahead.

Start one, Tam, I'd like to the consider the idea that time is cyclical, and God is in the Center....always present in time. Like a clock...around and around without end.

Done.

http://theologyonline.com/showthrea...thropomorphism-with-GOD&p=5149784#post5149784

 

[Danoh]

You are still at it hah?

All I can say is watch out for your false beliefs.

JWs are much more Christian than most of you.

Your road to hell remains paved with the fool intention of men in their supposed good works in the flesh, in their ignorance of Romans 1 - 8.

2 Corinthians 10:2 But I beseech you, that I may not be bold when I am present with that confidence, wherewith I think to be bold against some, which think of us as if we walked according to the flesh. 10:3 For though we walk in the flesh, we do not war after the flesh:

But that is you and your JW based confusion - it is all about some notion of "more Christian" or walking in the flesh for you.

And the cure for such is the exact same cure for your Mormon cousins.

This elixer, right here...

Galatians 2:21 I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.

Galatians 3:1 O foolish Galatians, who hath bewitched you, that ye should not obey the truth, before whose eyes Jesus Christ hath been evidently set forth, crucified among you? 3:2 This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith? 3:3 Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?

3:6 Even as Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.

Nevertheless, Romans 5:6-8 ever awaits you.

 

[meshak]

Your road to hell remains paved with the fool intention of men in their supposed good works in the flesh, in their ignorance of Romans 1 - 8.

2 Corinthians 10:2 But I beseech you, that I may not be bold when I am present with that confidence, wherewith I think to be bold against some, which think of us as if we walked according to the flesh. 10:3 For though we walk in the flesh, we do not war after the flesh:

But that is you and your JW based confusion - it is all about some notion of "more Christian" or walking in the flesh for you.

And the cure for such is the exact same cure for your Mormon cousins.

This elixer, right here...

Galatians 2:21 I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.

Galatians 3:1 O foolish Galatians, who hath bewitched you, that ye should not obey the truth, before whose eyes Jesus Christ hath been evidently set forth, crucified among you? 3:2 This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith? 3:3 Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?

3:6 Even as Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.

Nevertheless, Romans 5:6-8 ever awaits you.

suit yourself with majority approved beliefs.

Remember Jesus says narrow is the way to life.

You skip too many of Jesus' word.

 

[glorydaz]

They are called non-believers, heretics and cult.

Unbelievers aren't Christians at all, much less "ostracized" ones.

Lots of people call themselves Christians, but that doesn't make them Christians.

 

[meshak]

Unbelievers aren't Christians at all, much less "ostracized" ones.

Lots of people call themselves Christians, but that doesn't make them Christians.

Jesus is the Judge of who are truly His people, not you nor your organization.

 

[meshak]

I've been given permission by Jesus to judge such things....like when grown men are throwing tantrums because their pride has been hurt. In fact, it's my duty to do so.

just you say so does not make it so.

 

[Danoh]

Jesus is the Judge of who are truly His people, not you nor your organization.

Regrettably, Meshak, you forever appear to remain somewhere within the following - but on the negative side of its equation - be thankful you are dealt with at all.

1 Corinthians 2:15 But he that is spiritual judgeth all things, yet he himself is judged of no man.

1 Corinthians 5:12 For what have I to do to judge them also that are without? do not ye judge them that are within?

1 Corinthians 5:13 But them that are without God judgeth. Therefore put away from among yourselves that wicked person.

1 Corinthians 6:2 Do ye not know that the saints shall judge the world? and if the world shall be judged by you, are ye unworthy to judge the smallest matters?

1 Corinthians 6:3 Know ye not that we shall judge angels? how much more things that pertain to this life?

1 Corinthians 6:4 If then ye have judgments of things pertaining to this life, set them to judge who are least esteemed in the church.

1 Corinthians 6:5 I speak to your shame. Is it so, that there is not a wise man among you? no, not one that shall be able to judge between his brethren?

1 Corinthians 11:31 For if we would judge ourselves, we should not be judged.

1 Corinthians 11:32 But when we are judged, we are chastened of the Lord, that we should not be condemned with the world.

Colossians 2:16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:

It is what it is - nevertheless, Romans 5:8-6 towards you.

2 Corinthians 5:19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation. 5:20 Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech you by us: we pray you in Christ's stead, be ye reconciled to God. 5:21 For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

 

[musterion]

Regrettably, Meshak, you forever appear to remain somewhere within the following - but on the negative side of its equation - be thankful you are dealt with at all.

1 Corinthians 2:15 But he that is spiritual judgeth all things, yet he himself is judged of no man.

1 Corinthians 5:12 For what have I to do to judge them also that are without? do not ye judge them that are within?

1 Corinthians 5:13 But them that are without God judgeth. Therefore put away from among yourselves that wicked person.

1 Corinthians 6:2 Do ye not know that the saints shall judge the world? and if the world shall be judged by you, are ye unworthy to judge the smallest matters?

1 Corinthians 6:3 Know ye not that we shall judge angels? how much more things that pertain to this life?

1 Corinthians 6:4 If then ye have judgments of things pertaining to this life, set them to judge who are least esteemed in the church.

1 Corinthians 6:5 I speak to your shame. Is it so, that there is not a wise man among you? no, not one that shall be able to judge between his brethren?

1 Corinthians 11:31 For if we would judge ourselves, we should not be judged.

1 Corinthians 11:32 But when we are judged, we are chastened of the Lord, that we should not be condemned with the world.

Colossians 2:16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:

It is what it is - nevertheless, Romans 5:8-6 towards you.

2 Corinthians 5:19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation. 5:20 Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech you by us: we pray you in Christ's stead, be ye reconciled to God. 5:21 For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

Be nice to your sister.

 

[musterion]

It doesn't take courage to listen to either. It simply takes discernment.

Meshak with vocab is back. Don't be played.

 

[meshak]

Regrettably, Meshak, you forever appear to remain somewhere within the following - but on the negative side of its equation - be thankful you are dealt with at all.

1 Corinthians 2:15 But he that is spiritual judgeth all things, yet he himself is judged of no man.

1 Corinthians 5:12 For what have I to do to judge them also that are without? do not ye judge them that are within?

1 Corinthians 5:13 But them that are without God judgeth. Therefore put away from among yourselves that wicked person.

1 Corinthians 6:2 Do ye not know that the saints shall judge the world? and if the world shall be judged by you, are ye unworthy to judge the smallest matters?

1 Corinthians 6:3 Know ye not that we shall judge angels? how much more things that pertain to this life?

1 Corinthians 6:4 If then ye have judgments of things pertaining to this life, set them to judge who are least esteemed in the church.

1 Corinthians 6:5 I speak to your shame. Is it so, that there is not a wise man among you? no, not one that shall be able to judge between his brethren?

1 Corinthians 11:31 For if we would judge ourselves, we should not be judged.

1 Corinthians 11:32 But when we are judged, we are chastened of the Lord, that we should not be condemned with the world.

Colossians 2:16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:

It is what it is - nevertheless, Romans 5:8-6 towards you.

2 Corinthians 5:19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation. 5:20 Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech you by us: we pray you in Christ's stead, be ye reconciled to God. 5:21 For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

Fortunately, your lengthy post will not change the fact that you are not the judge nor anyone else but Jesus.

all you are doing is making excuses and misusing the scriptures to justify your dogmas..

Wrongful judgement is a grave sin, friend.

 

[Right Divider]

Jesus is the Judge of who are truly His people, not you nor your organization.

And also not you, meshak #2

 

[marhig]

Unbelievers aren't Christians at all, much less "ostracized" ones.

Lots of people call themselves Christians, but that doesn't make them Christians.

The only true Christians are those who truly follow Jesus and deny themselves, turn from sin and the world and live by the will of God. Not any certain denomination.

Just saying "I believe" isn't enough, we have to live it out, be doers of the word and God looks at the heart. None of us can condemn whole groups of people, there will be people who have good and bad hearts in all denominations, and God will judge us all on how we live before him once we know the truth.

 

[oatmeal]

I am a non-believer interested in knowing what the good news is. I ask because, in my experience, Christians do not seem to agree on the specifics. One might point to the issue of the scope of Christ's salvific provision as being particularly relevant.

If the Gospel isn't clearly defined then, surely, the non-believer may legitimately ask, 'Believe in what?'

Since the word gospel means good news, all of scripture is good news to a believer

It may not be good news to the God rejecter, but God lets them choose to not believe.

If they want to reject God and all that God made available, then they don't get God and all the God made available. Instead of life that God offers, eternal life, they lose out on eternal life. They did not want it, they do not get it. That is good news for me and bad news for them

 

[eleos]

It is true there are many different theologies within the Christian faith. However, what we Christians are called to do biblically is to compare what is being taught ... with the Word of God. It is each of our responsibility to do so. We are to each take on this personal responsibility. It takes time and study .... but one does so over time and learns little by little, but I will say, when one does so ... overtime you will discover in complete amazement the truth of Gods word. Many many many people do not do this ... many people do not even take their bibles to church ... so they are believing what they are being taught, which is not neccessarily the entire truth. So, one chooses to believe what they believe based on the information they have accumulated "so far" and therefore we have differences and we discuss these differences ... that is our human nature. Seems to be more of a "battle" over who is right .... well.... God is right.

So, I would recommend first, that you study topically, understanding Gods love. Love pertaining to God is not just something He does (loves us) it is what He IS.

1 John

16 So we have come to know and to believe the love that God has for us. "God is love", and whoever abides in love abides in God, and God abides in him

and then of course MOST importantly is:

John 3:16

16 “For God so loved the world,i that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.

Yes, my friend, perfect eternal life, with perfect eternal God our creator, in a perfect eternal world. I pray to see you there ;o)

Through getting to know Him through His word ... one forms a personal relationship with God Almighty creator of all things .... WOW ....

I encourage you to take this journey, and as you learn and become closer with Him, you will never ever regret it.

Perhaps this might help you with your journey.

How I study is topically ... I use this free online tool www.biblhub.com and run word searches (on the entire bible) ... such as love, loving, loved ... run the searches on the root word and also all "tenses" of the words. Also, run searches of words that have the same meaning. This is a good start and is easy to do with just a few clicks.

Don't expect that everything that is pulled up will be in "harmony" with each other, but many will. Bible verses also need to be kept in the "context" of what is being talked about as well. Keep in mind that the Bible does not contradict itself ... if it appears that way ... then you need to keep studying until it is revealed to you how it all fits together.

The entire bible is all about Jesus, who is God and God IS love.

Seems like a lot to it ... but no doubt, as you read you will learn many wonderful things and then start formulating "a belief" ... which as you learn will likely change as you gain more knowledge ... point is ... get the knowledge, know His love .... His love for you.

Jesus wants you to know Him personally and have a loving personal relationship with you. Amazing .... absolutely amazing.

God Bless you, may you open the door to your heart and let Him in. Amen

 

[meshak]

may you open the door to your heart and let Him in. Amen

How about you? Are you open to simple truth?

 

[daqq]

Since the word gospel means good news, all of scripture is good news to a believer

It may not be good news to the God rejecter, but God lets them choose to not believe.

If they want to reject God and all that God made available, then they don't get God and all the God made available. Instead of life that God offers, eternal life, they lose out on eternal life. They did not want it, they do not get it. That is good news for me and bad news for them

Well, not entirely true, but then what you follow up with in your comments agrees, for Moses says, "Consider, (see, pay attention), I have set before you this day life and good, and death and evil", (Dt 30:15). And again in the same passage, "I call heaven and earth to record this day against you, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing: therefore choose life, that both you and your seed may live", (Dt 30:19). And Paul quotes from this passage in Rom 10:6-8, (Dt 30:11-14), and this is what Paul says in that same passage after quoting from Dt 30:11-14, "This is the Rhema-Word of the faith which we preach", (Rom 10:8). Thus Paul explains that Messiah is the Rhema-Word from the (LXX) Deuteronomy passage in the Torah from which he quotes: moreover, from that same passage, Moses says that he sets before them, (and those who will receive it), either LIFE and GOOD, or DEATH and EVIL, and then again he says simply, LIFE and DEATH, ("therefore choose life"). Paul preaches the LIFE and the GOOD from the Torah, just as the Master himself does in the Gospel accounts. The Good News "Gospel" is therefore the GOOD without the evil or bad because Messiah destroyed the curse at Golgotha, (by taking it upon himself and the destruction of the body, the flesh, the physical). Therefore, as Paul says, "Wherefore, from now on, we know no one according to the flesh: even if we have known Messiah according to the flesh, contrariwise, now, no more do we know him so", that is to say, no more do we know Messiah according to the flesh, (2Cor 5:16). If therefore one chooses to understand the Torah according to the physical and the flesh, then the same chooses death: for all flesh dies, (and no flesh is justified before Elohim). Therefore we are admonished to choose the life and the good: for the Torah is supernal and spiritual, (even according to Paul, Rom 7:12,14, etc.), and it is the Word of the Holy and Living Elohim Almighty who is non-corporeal Spirit, and thus His Word is spiritual, Spirit, and Life.

 

[Danoh]

The only true Christians are those who truly follow Jesus and deny themselves, turn from sin and the world and live by the will of God. Not any certain denomination.

Just saying "I believe" isn't enough, we have to live it out, be doers of the word and God looks at the heart. None of us can condemn whole groups of people, there will be people who have good and bad hearts in all denominations, and God will judge us all on how we live before him once we know the truth.

Nope.

Not "according to the Scriptures."

The balance of my long post is in the following...

Spoiler

According to the Scriptures" the only true Christian is that person who has "believed in...the gospel of our salvation."

Case in point, one of the best examples in Scripture of your "true Christians" false positive - the Corinthians.

You have obviously confused the difference between standing and state, but the Apostle who wrote the following about them and to them had obviously known the difference between the two...

1 Corinthians 1:1 Paul, called to be an apostle of Jesus Christ through the will of God, and Sosthenes our brother, 1:2 Unto the church of God which is at Corinth, to them that are sanctified in Christ Jesus, called to be saints, with all that in every place call upon the name of Jesus Christ our Lord, both theirs and ours: 1:3 Grace be unto you, and peace, from God our Father, and from the Lord Jesus Christ. 1:4 I thank my God always on your behalf, for the grace of God which is given you by Jesus Christ; 1:5 That in every thing ye are enriched by him, in all utterance, and in all knowledge; 1:6 Even as the testimony of Christ was confirmed in you: 1:7 So that ye come behind in no gift; waiting for the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ: 1:8 Who shall also confirm you unto the end, that ye may be blameless in the day of our Lord Jesus Christ. 1:9 God is faithful, by whom ye were called unto the fellowship of his Son Jesus Christ our Lord. 1:10 Now I beseech you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye all speak the same thing, and that there be no divisions among you; but that ye be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment. 1:11 For it hath been declared unto me of you, my brethren, by them which are of the house of Chloe, that there are contentions among you.

There you have it - true Christians - who were obviously simply NOT walking in God's view of them in His Son, but were instead walking in their own.

True, they were being hypocrites in their pac or "better than you" fleshly minded "club" mentality - and within their own assembly.

Did Paul assert they were therefore not this "true Christians" of yours? Nope.

1 Corinthians 12:2 Ye know that ye were Gentiles, carried away unto these dumb idols, even as ye were led.

So there is that reality - who they once were.

He then calls them out again.

(A TWO-fold practice of Paul's that the person actually ignorant of this practice of Paul's; and or the person who is actually hypocrite, immediately seizes on to attempt to prove the person both praising one thing while calling out another is the actual hypocrite.)

But he calls them out...

12:3 Wherefore I give you to understand, that no man speaking by the Spirit of God calleth Jesus accursed: and that no man can say that Jesus is the Lord, but by the Holy Ghost.

He then returns to who they ALL actually ARE...

12:13 For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

And then brings together both who they are being in the flesh with who they really are in Christ.

12:25 That there should be no schism in the body; but that the members should have the same care one for another.

He then builds on the latter of the two.

12:26 And whether one member suffer, all the members suffer with it; or one member be honoured, all the members rejoice with it. 12:27 Now ye are the body of Christ, and members in particular.

And there is an issue here, Marhig, that YOUR study APPROACH has clearly failed your being able to properly...grasp.

In Matt. thru John, the Lord had been addressing UNREGENERATED men UNDER THE LAW.

Hebrews 9:17 For a testament is of force after men are dead: otherwise it is of no strength at all while the testator liveth.[/b]

Case in point that this was true in Matt. thru John...

Matthew 5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil. 5:18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled. 5:19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven. 5:20 For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.

Example:

Matthew 8:1 When he was come down from the mountain, great multitudes followed him. 8:2 And, behold, there came a leper and worshipped him, saying, Lord, if thou wilt, thou canst make me clean. 8:3 And Jesus put forth his hand, and touched him, saying, I will; be thou clean. And immediately his leprosy was cleansed. 8:4 And Jesus saith unto him, See thou tell no man; but go thy way, shew thyself to the priest, and offer the gift that Moses commanded, for a testimony unto them.

That "gift" there is animal sacrifices...plus a water baptism of sorts within Israel's various, or "divers washings" under THEIR God-Given Law to THEM through Moses...

Leviticus 14:2 This shall be the law of the leper in the day of his cleansing: He shall be brought unto the priest: 14:3 And the priest shall go forth out of the camp; and the priest shall look, and, behold, if the plague of leprosy be healed in the leper; 14:4 Then shall the priest command to take for him that is to be cleansed two birds alive and clean, and cedar wood, and scarlet, and hyssop: 14:5 And the priest shall command that one of the birds be killed in an earthen vessel over running water: 14:6 As for the living bird, he shall take it, and the cedar wood, and the scarlet, and the hyssop, and shall dip them and the living bird in the blood of the bird that was killed over the running water: 14:7 And he shall sprinkle upon him that is to be cleansed from the leprosy seven times, and shall pronounce him clean, and shall let the living bird loose into the open field. 14:8 And he that is to be cleansed shall wash his clothes, and shave off all his hair, and wash himself in water, that he may be clean: and after that he shall come into the camp, and shall tarry abroad out of his tent seven days.

Hebrews 9:10 Which stood only in meats and drinks, and divers washings, and carnal ordinances, imposed on them until the time of reformation.

In contrast, Paul is not writing to Christians who are Christians based on their conduct meeting your mis-fire of a misunderstanding in your obvious failure to have laid out aright "that which is noted in the Scripture of truth" Dan. 10:21, on "the way of God more perfectly" Acts 18:26, THIS SIDE OF the following...

Romans 3:19 Now we know that what things soever the law saith, it saith to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God. 3:20 Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin. 3:21 But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets; 3:22 Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference: 3:23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God; 3:24 Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus: 3:25 Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God; 3:26 To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus. 3:27 Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works? Nay: but by the law of faith. 3:28 Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law.

In other words, Marhig, the Apostle Paul would have strongly disagreed with you.

The Corinthians were "true Christians..."

Titus 3:5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost; 3:6 Which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour; 3:7 That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.

THAT was why Paul could both praise their good, and yet call out their bad.

In contrast, the Lord could not have done that.

Because His audience had been under the Law.

And as He Himself later had Paul re-assert THIS SIDE OF HIS FINISHED WORK...

Galatians 3:1 O foolish Galatians, who hath bewitched you, that ye should not obey the truth, before whose eyes Jesus Christ hath been evidently set forth, crucified among you? 3:2 This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith? 3:3 Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?

3:6 Even as Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.

3:10 For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them. 3:11 But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith. 3:12 And the law is not of faith: but, The man that doeth them shall live in them. 3:13 Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree: 3:14 That the blessing of Abraham might come on the Gentiles through Jesus Christ; that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith.

Marhig, get clear on that FIRST.

THEN worry about both calling out AND praising.

Heck, even most on here who assert they alone have these things right appear to remain clueless on this TWO-fold practice of Paul's.

Your unawareness of these "things that are more excellent" Romans 2:18 THIS SIDE OF...

Titus 2:11 For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men, 2:12 Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world; 2:13 Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ; 2:14 Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.

Can only put you ahead of such, when affirming and or defending what you post.

But only when you yourself actually begin to properly...

2 Timothy 2:15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.

Here, a great video study towards the beginnings of just how that is done.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qiD7C6KYCd4&app=desktop

Romans 14:5 towards you, in memory of Romans 5:6-8 - in both our stead.

 

[meshak]

Nope.

Not "according the the Scriptures."

The balance of my long post is in the following...

Spoiler

According to the Scriptures" the only true Christian is that person who has "believed in...the gospel of our salvation."

Case in point, one of the best examples in Scripture of your "true Christians" false positive - the Corinthians.

You have obviously confused the difference between standing and state, but the Apostle who wrote the following about them and to them had obviously known the difference between the two...

1 Corinthians 1:1 Paul, called to be an apostle of Jesus Christ through the will of God, and Sosthenes our brother, 1:2 Unto the church of God which is at Corinth, to them that are sanctified in Christ Jesus, called to be saints, with all that in every place call upon the name of Jesus Christ our Lord, both theirs and ours: 1:3 Grace be unto you, and peace, from God our Father, and from the Lord Jesus Christ. 1:4 I thank my God always on your behalf, for the grace of God which is given you by Jesus Christ; 1:5 That in every thing ye are enriched by him, in all utterance, and in all knowledge; 1:6 Even as the testimony of Christ was confirmed in you: 1:7 So that ye come behind in no gift; waiting for the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ: 1:8 Who shall also confirm you unto the end, that ye may be blameless in the day of our Lord Jesus Christ. 1:9 God is faithful, by whom ye were called unto the fellowship of his Son Jesus Christ our Lord. 1:10 Now I beseech you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye all speak the same thing, and that there be no divisions among you; but that ye be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment. 1:11 For it hath been declared unto me of you, my brethren, by them which are of the house of Chloe, that there are contentions among you.

There you have it - true Christians - who were obviously simply NOT walking in God's view of them in His Son, but were instead walking in their own.

True, they were being hypocrites in their pac or "better than you" fleshly minded "club" mentality - and within their own assembly.

Did Paul assert they were therefore not this "true Christians" of yours? Nope.

1 Corinthians 12:2 Ye know that ye were Gentiles, carried away unto these dumb idols, even as ye were led.

So there is that reality - who they once were.

He then calls them out again.

(A TWO-fold practice of Paul's that the person actually ignorant of this practice of Paul's; and or the person who is actually hypocrite, immediately seizes on to attempt to prove the person both praising one thing while calling out another is the actual hypocrite.)

But he calls them out...

12:3 Wherefore I give you to understand, that no man speaking by the Spirit of God calleth Jesus accursed: and that no man can say that Jesus is the Lord, but by the Holy Ghost.

He then returns to who they ALL actually ARE...

12:13 For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

And then brings together both who they are being in the flesh with who they really are in Christ.

12:25 That there should be no schism in the body; but that the members should have the same care one for another.

He then builds on the latter of the two.

12:26 And whether one member suffer, all the members suffer with it; or one member be honoured, all the members rejoice with it. 12:27 Now ye are the body of Christ, and members in particular.

And there is an issue here, Marhig, that YOUR study APPROACH has clearly failed your being able to properly...grasp.

In Matt. thru John, the Lord had been addressing UNREGENERATED men UNDER THE LAW.

Hebrews 9:17 For a testament is of force after men are dead: otherwise it is of no strength at all while the testator liveth.[/b]

You are skipping too many of Jesus' word.

Case in point that this was true in Matt. thru John...

Matthew 5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil. 5:18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled. 5:19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven. 5:20 For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.

Example:

Matthew 8:1 When he was come down from the mountain, great multitudes followed him. 8:2 And, behold, there came a leper and worshipped him, saying, Lord, if thou wilt, thou canst make me clean. 8:3 And Jesus put forth his hand, and touched him, saying, I will; be thou clean. And immediately his leprosy was cleansed. 8:4 And Jesus saith unto him, See thou tell no man; but go thy way, shew thyself to the priest, and offer the gift that Moses commanded, for a testimony unto them.

That "gift" there is animal sacrifices...plus a water baptism of sorts within Israel's various, or "divers washings" under THEIR God-Given Law to THEM through Moses...

Leviticus 14:2 This shall be the law of the leper in the day of his cleansing: He shall be brought unto the priest: 14:3 And the priest shall go forth out of the camp; and the priest shall look, and, behold, if the plague of leprosy be healed in the leper; 14:4 Then shall the priest command to take for him that is to be cleansed two birds alive and clean, and cedar wood, and scarlet, and hyssop: 14:5 And the priest shall command that one of the birds be killed in an earthen vessel over running water: 14:6 As for the living bird, he shall take it, and the cedar wood, and the scarlet, and the hyssop, and shall dip them and the living bird in the blood of the bird that was killed over the running water: 14:7 And he shall sprinkle upon him that is to be cleansed from the leprosy seven times, and shall pronounce him clean, and shall let the living bird loose into the open field. 14:8 And he that is to be cleansed shall wash his clothes, and shave off all his hair, and wash himself in water, that he may be clean: and after that he shall come into the camp, and shall tarry abroad out of his tent seven days.

Hebrews 9:10 Which stood only in meats and drinks, and divers washings, and carnal ordinances, imposed on them until the time of reformation.

In contrast, Paul is not writing to Christians who are Christians based on their conduct meeting your mis-fire of a misunderstanding in your obvious failure to have laid out aright "that which is noted in the Scripture of truth" Dan. 10:21, on "the way of God more perfectly" Acts 18:26, THIS SIDE OF the following...

Romans 3:19 Now we know that what things soever the law saith, it saith to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God. 3:20 Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin. 3:21 But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets; 3:22 Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference: 3:23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God; 3:24 Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus: 3:25 Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God; 3:26 To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus. 3:27 Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works? Nay: but by the law of faith. 3:28 Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law.

In other words, Marhig, the Apostle Paul would have strongly disagreed with you.

The Corinthians were "true Christians..."

Titus 3:5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost; 3:6 Which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour; 3:7 That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.

THAT was why Paul could both praise their good, and yet call out their bad.

In contrast, the Lord could not have done that.

Because His audience had been under the Law.

And as He Himself later had Paul re-assert THIS SIDE OF HIS FINISHED WORK...

Galatians 3:1 O foolish Galatians, who hath bewitched you, that ye should not obey the truth, before whose eyes Jesus Christ hath been evidently set forth, crucified among you? 3:2 This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith? 3:3 Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?

3:6 Even as Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.

3:10 For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them. 3:11 But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith. 3:12 And the law is not of faith: but, The man that doeth them shall live in them. 3:13 Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree: 3:14 That the blessing of Abraham might come on the Gentiles through Jesus Christ; that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith.

Marhig, get clear on that FIRST.

THEN worry about both calling out AND praising.

Heck, even most on here who assert they alone have these things right appear to remain clueless on this TWO-fold practice of Paul's.

Your unawareness of these "things that are more excellent" Romans 2:18 THIS SIDE OF...

Titus 2:11 For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men, 2:12 Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world; 2:13 Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ; 2:14 Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.

Can only put you ahead of such, when affirming and or defending what you post.

But only when you yourself actually begin to properly...

2 Timothy 2:15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.

Here, a great video study towards the beginnings of just how that is done.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qiD7C6KYCd4&app=desktop

Romans 14:5 towards you, in memory of Romans 5:6-8 - in both our stead.

very lengthy yet skipping inconvenient Jesus' word.

 

[Danoh]

very lengthy yet skipping inconvenient Jesus' word.

More like you skip one of his inconvenient Apostles.

Rom. 5:6-8.