What is holding us back?

[glorydaz]

So are you saying that not one thing Jesus said in his earthly ministry has no weight, no relation, no bearing on Christianity what so ever?

That whatever he said does not matter to us at all?

No, I'm not saying any of that.

You might want to answer my previous questions to you and musterion instead of trying to sidestep them

Since you both agree and musterion fled when I asked questions he refuses to answer, maybe you have more honesty and courage and will answer them for him?

My memory of your questions is short, Oats. You'll have to repeat them, and try and keep them precise.

Last supper or not, he spoke them.

Yep, He did speak them. He spoke them to the Disciples who were gathered around him that night.

Sounds like you reject all that Jesus said as not having any bearing or validity on the present times?

On the contrary, everything He spoke has validity. The words He spoke must be correctly understood, before they can be considered valid.

John 14:6 Who is your way to the Father if it is not Jesus Christ? Or are you yet lost in your sins?

Belief in our LORD Jesus Christ's death burial and resurrection means I am not lost in my sins. Look carefully. Do you see His name in that sentence?

 

[glorydaz]

You are great at trying to put words into my mouth..

Why do you reject the words of Jesus Christ who you say is God?

Where I have referred to Jesus being

You are a false accuser of the brethren to say that.

For me he is the way the truth and the life and no man (or woman) can come to the Father except by him

As the second Adam he corrected what the first Adam erred in.

That takes a man who is the lamb of God to do, not some mere man as you claim

If you are going to contribute to this thread, the least you could do is provide honest evidence instead lying

It doesn't do you a bit of good to try to turn the tables on me. It's clear for anyone who reads this thread what's going on. You can clear this up right now. Do you believe that Jesus Christ is God? opcorn:

 

[glorydaz]

I do not know your heart at all except what you write.

Since your posts indicate that you do not believe on Jesus Christ as Jesus spoke of in John 14:12, what am I to believe but that you do not believe on him?

Either you believe on him or you don't.

Interesting to see that Oats thinks he can raise the dead. :think:

Healed the blind, have you, Oats? I sure hope you got it on video.

 

[Guyver]

Jesus Christ said what he meant and he meant what he said.

John 14:12 is truth.

God word is truth and Jesus spoke the truth.

It is up to us to believe

That post was too big.

You can believe whatever you wish to believe and I have no doubt that makes it true for you in one sense. People believe all kinds of things.

But when you start speaking of truth, that’s another thing altogether. If something is going to be true, then it has be real or it’s make believe. Make believing doesn’t make anything true.

There’s no question that there’s no Christians clearing out the children’s hospital because they have no power to do it. And since they don’t, there’s no good reason to believe they ever did from a truth perspective.

 

[glorydaz]

That post was too big.

You can believe whatever you wish to believe and I have no doubt that makes it true for you in one sense. People believe all kinds of things.

But when you start speaking of truth, that’s another thing altogether. If something is going to be true, then it has be real or it’s make believe. Make believing doesn’t make anything true.

There’s no question that there’s no Christians clearing out the children’s hospital because they have no power to do it. And since they don’t, there’s no good reason to believe they ever did from a truth perspective.

Amen.

Unfortunately some today don't want to believe that God's marching orders change, depending on the dispensation. This is not the age of signs and wonders, no matter how badly man wants to perform such things.

Acts 5:12 And by the hands of the apostles were many signs and wonders wrought among the people; (and they were all with one accord in Solomon's porch.​

 

[Aimiel]

Don't lose focus, Aimiel.

I won't; I promise.

NEITHER I NOR PAUL said "ALL knowledge" will be done away with.

We don't see any qualifiers. Are there certain stipulations mentioned in YOUR Bible?

But Paul wasn't saying that mysteries would pass away in chapter 13. He's saying that sign gifts will pass away when "that which is perfect has come."

We haven't reached perfection, in any realm; yet.

"That which is perfect" ("that which is complete") refers to the ENTIRETY of Paul's gospel...

I don't see where it says that, which is why it must mean perfect in knowledge and understanding of all things.

I don't believe you. Prove it with scripture.

Forasmuch as ye are manifestly declared to be the epistle of Christ ministered by us, written not with ink, but with the Spirit of the living God; not in tables of stone, but in fleshy tables of the heart.

Love never fails. But whether there are prophecies, they will fail; whether there are tongues, they will cease; whether there is knowledge, it will vanish away.For we know in part and we prophesy in part.But when that which is perfect has come, then that which is in part will be done away. - 1 Corinthians 13:8-10 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=1Corinthians13:8-10&version=NKJV

Paul is saying that (at the time), they had gifts of knowledge, directly from God, "special knowledge," if you will, along with the gift of tongues and the gift of prophecy. But, Paul said, "when that which is perfect (complete) has come, then that which is in part (the sign gifts, including the gift of knowledge) will be done away."

Knowledge of God is not what Paul is talking about in 1 Corinthians 13.

Again, Paul is talking about the sign gifts, not prophecy, tongues, and knowledge, in general.

He's not made that distinction. It makes much more sense to realize that we have NOTHING perfect, yet, and so: we still need knowledge, prophecy and tongues. When we have perfection, these things won't be needed.

Prophecy in the Bible simply means a prediction, or communicating and enforcing revealed truth.

Prophecy can mean that, but It also includes revealing what God's Word means and even new revelations, never before revealed.

God doesn't know the future, nor will we be able to.

Actually: He does. I cannot picture a God Who doesn't. He is The Only One Who can speak in future perfect tense, knowing the end from the beginning.

 

[Aimiel]

The Scripture nowhere makes a distinction between the sign gifts and the other gifts. If the sign gifts as tongues were to soon cease, why did the Apostle Paul write to the Corinthians: "Do not forbid to speak with tongues" (1 Corinthians 14:39)? Therefore, the New Testament does not give evidence that the sign gifts have ceased. -- SOURCE ARTICLE

 

[Sherman]

​Shutting this thread down, Oatsy, you are turning to personal attacks--accusations of not listening to Jesus-- and that is not acceptable.