ECT What gospel was Paul saved under?

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heir said:
Paul never preached Acts 2:38 KJV anymore than Peter preached that Christ died for our sins as the good news by which we are saved! Get saved and 2 Timothy 2:15 KJV!
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Act 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
Act 2:39 For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.

Act 19:2 He said unto them, Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed? And they said unto him, We have not so much as heard whether there be any Holy Ghost.
Act 19:3 And he said unto them, Unto what then were ye baptized? And they said, Unto John's baptism.
Act 19:4 Then said Paul, John verily baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people, that they should believe on him which should come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus.
Act 19:5 When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.
Act 19:6 And when Paul had laid his hands upon them, the Holy Ghost came on them; and they spake with tongues, and prophesied.

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heir said:
No, it is impossible for Paul to have been forgiven under the kingdom gospel as he was before a blasphemer (Matthew 12:31-32 KJV, 1 Timothy 1:13-16 KJV). Paul's gospel was a mystery, kept secret since the world began and he tells us why (Romans 16:25-27 KJV, 1 Corinthians 2:6-8 KJV).
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Not true.

Paul as Saul was a blasphemer who never followed Christ.

If he had then he could not be forgiven as Judas could not.

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heir said:
There was no escape clause in Matthew 12:31-32 KJV. You don't believe the Bible.
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Mat 12:31 Wherefore I say unto you, All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men.
Mat 12:32 And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come.

Paul never spoke against the Holy Ghost.

Paul spoke against the disciples of Christ, not knowing that he was speaking and acting against Jesus--

Mat 12:32 And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come.

Act 9:4 And he fell to the earth, and heard a voice saying unto him, Saul, Saul, why persecutest thou me? Act 9:5 And he said, Who art thou, Lord? And the Lord said, I am Jesus whom thou persecutest: it is hard for thee to kick against the pricks.

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heir said:
Blasphemy against the Holy Ghost was to speaketh against the Holy Ghost


Stephen was full of faith and of the Holy Ghost Acts 6:5 KJV

And there was Saul Acts 8:1 KJV Acts 9:1 KJV

Saul was before a blasphemer (1 Timothy 1:13-16 KJV) and that against the Holy Ghost!

Case closed!
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Paul did not blaspheme the Holy Ghost and he was forgiven when he repented and was baptized washing away his sin by the Holy Spirit.

You refuse to follow Paul or Christ, the one who Paul obeyed.

You never heard Christ as Paul did, neither did you obey Christ as Paul did.

1Ti 1:13 Who was before a blasphemer, and a persecutor, and injurious: but I obtained mercy, because I did it ignorantly in unbelief.

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Clete

Clete

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Grosnick Marowbe said:
I believe that while the Apostles still walked the earth there were two distinct messages being taught. Faith without works to the Gentiles and faith with works to the Jews. Today, there exists only one message: "The Grace Gospel."
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I agree with this but do you ever wonder how this worked in actual practice? I mean, put yourself in the shoes of James. You and your wife and kids all practice your Christianity according to the Kingdom Gospel but what do the grandkids do? What would James have taught his grandkids to believe? Multiply that times the thousands of families that came to Christ under the Kingdom Gospel and you'll begin to understand the magnitude of the issue. How did Kingdom Believers transition their own families over to the Gospel of Grace?

Resting in Him,
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Grosnick Marowbe

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Clete said:
I agree with this but do you ever wonder how this worked in actual practice? I mean, put yourself in the shoes of James. You and your wife and kids all practice your Christianity according to the Kingdom Gospel but what do the grandkids do? What would James have taught his grandkids to believe? Multiply that times the thousands of families that came to Christ under the Kingdom Gospel and you'll begin to understand the magnitude of the issue. How did Kingdom Believers transition their own families over to the Gospel of Grace?

Resting in Him,
Clete
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I understand where you're coming from and don't have an answer at this time. I'll have to pray and ponder this "deep" Spiritual question. It's an excellent question by the way. I just don't have an answer at this time. Good post friend.
 
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Grosnick Marowbe

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Just right off the top of my head, I'd say, there had to be some sort of "Spiritual" transition that must have taken place, although, I can't provide any Scripture to back up my opinion. And, I admit it may be a bit flimsy at this point.
 
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Clete said:
I agree with this but do you ever wonder how this worked in actual practice? I mean, put yourself in the shoes of James. You and your wife and kids all practice your Christianity according to the Kingdom Gospel but what do the grandkids do? What would James have taught his grandkids to believe? Multiply that times the thousands of families that came to Christ under the Kingdom Gospel and you'll begin to understand the magnitude of the issue. How did Kingdom Believers transition their own families over to the Gospel of Grace?

Resting in Him,
Clete
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The descriptions are complete confusion. There is no gospel without works to the Gentiles if you mean that works need not follow. OTOH, 'behold the Lamb of God' means that the sacrificial lamb of God is the work needed. Plus nothing. And had arrived.

If those in Israel's last generation (that of Christ) don't believe he is the sacrificial messiah, then there is a great risk to their land. The picture is so dismal in Daniel 9 that the land would be ruined. Caiaphas thought he could circumvent this. Big mistake.

The old covenant does slowly recede, if that's what you mean, but there are not two gospels out there. No matter how incisive the words of Jesus are about how a person should live, it is never as though his own sacrificial messianic gospel is missing or out of the picture at any time. Inconcievable to those in Judaism, even to his disciples? Yes. But never out of the plan. He would be called Joshua because he would save his people from their sins. He talked to Moses and Elijah in the Transfiguration about "his exodus."

Otherwise, you have a person that should have accepted the offer to be king of Israel in Jn 6 and led the zealot revolution, instead of the paradoxical 'king of the Jews' of the cross, whose kingdom is not the usual world-type.
 
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SaulToPaul said:
There was certainly some overlap when the disciples were scattered, but we can know this:

Romans 15:20 (KJV)

We don't need to know the answer to how the two programs co-existed, but just that it was a transition period and the LORD could handle it. :)
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There is a transition period as the function of the old covenant recedes and disappears, but not of two gospels. There never was such a thing. Judaism thought the law itself was a 'gospel.' And that it changed who and how a person was 'in Israel' (Gal 3:17) but it was never was the truth.

In another example of poor grammar understanding, some movement or person in MAD has taken 'Gospel of the kingdom' to be about the kingdom, when it only means that it is associated with it, or powers it. Go learn about Greek cases. Likewise the mistakes in Gal 2 about the 'gospel of the circ and uncirc.' It is not different content for each. The grammar was about the task. The same gospel was taken to each. 'Gospel of the circ' does not mean it is about circumcision, or different for them; the sentence is about the 'task of preaching' to them.
 
SaulToPaul 2

SaulToPaul 2

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Interplanner said:
There is a transition period as the function of the old covenant recedes and disappears, but not of two gospels. There never was such a thing. Judaism thought the law itself was a 'gospel.' And that it changed who and how a person was 'in Israel' (Gal 3:17) but it was never was the truth.

In another example of poor grammar understanding, some movement or person in MAD has taken 'Gospel of the kingdom' to be about the kingdom, when it only means that it is associated with it, or powers it. Go learn about Greek cases. Likewise the mistakes in Gal 2 about the 'gospel of the circ and uncirc.' It is not different content for each. The grammar was about the task. The same gospel was taken to each. 'Gospel of the circ' does not mean it is about circumcision, or different for them; the sentence is about the 'task of preaching' to them.
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:chuckle:
 
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Grosnick Marowbe

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We do know that Christ's ministry was to the House of Israel. Matthew 15:24 "But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel."
Both Peter and Christ preached the Kingdom message. Only Paul preached the Grace message, he received from the Ascended Lord Jesus Christ. So, there were two separate messages being simultaneously preached during that time.
 
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