turbosixx
New member
I agree Moses does parallel Jesus. That is why Paul uses something they can relate to.
1 Cor. 10:6 Now these things happened as examples for us,
ECT Water or No Water?
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I agree Moses does parallel Jesus. That is why Paul uses something they can relate to.
1 Cor. 10:6 Now these things happened as examples for us,
More important is Paul's doctrine that baptism symbolises being buried into Christ's death and being raised to newness of life.
This can only apply to water baptism.
This can only apply to water baptism.
HisServant
New member
I disagree, Holy Spirit baptism is more appropriate to that.
turbosixx
New member
I understand you don't see contact and therefore would like to claim "no water". If Paul was not trying to make the point of water, why would Paul state twice, the cloud and the sea. Couldn't he have just as easily said, they were baptized into Moses crossing on dry ground or not even mentioned the cloud and sea which are both made of water?
Is there water in this baptism?
Matt. 28:19 Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them
turbosixx
New member
If HS is how we are baptized, show me people receiving HS baptism in scripture.
HisServant
New member
John the Baptist foretold it... and the Apostles had a problem understanding it.
John's baptism was temporary... one greater than him was going to come and baptize with fire and the holy spirit... the greater one than him came.
turbosixx
New member
If it's how we are saved then we should see it as the norm.
HisServant
New member
What are you expecting to see?
turbosixx
New member
I am making some assumptions based on some things you say and what is current popular understanding, so I hope I'm not misunderstanding you.
You said, "I disagree, Holy Spirit baptism is more appropriate to that".
If HS baptism is how we die, are buried and resurrected with Christ and not water baptism, then I would think we would see that, but I see no mention of it aside from John the Baptist.
If you are seeing it, I'm curious where.
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turbosixx
New member
How do you know that is HS baptism?
Hi and in the KJV , it reads , Know ye not that so many of us as were BAPTIZO / BAPTIZED into Jesus Christ were BAPTIZO / BAPTIZED into His death !!
I see you question that LYING KJV writing !!
Must be an other GOOF by the Holy Spirit , you say ??
You Pentecostals ALL seem to not believe what God has written , don't you !!:rotfl::rotfl:
dan p
Paul says "for this is what baptism signifies" being baptized in the Holy Spirit is an event in our lives, something that happens to us, it is not a symbol for something.
Water Baptism signifies our being buried with Christ and raised to newness of life, it is for testimony. It is an ordinance of the church along with the Lord's Supper.
turbosixx
New member
I believe it just as it reads. Baptism is how we are added to Christ and die with Christ. In what way did Jesus teach the apostles to make Christians?
Matt. 28:19 Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit,
Peter seemed to think baptism is how we are added to Christ. Even after the Gentiles were baptized by the HS (one of only two in the NT), he commanded that they be water baptized.
Acts 10:47 Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we?
48 And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then prayed they him to tarry certain days.
turbosixx
New member
If it's an "ordinance" of the church, why is it that all conversions, with any detail, end in baptism?
Is this the implication? ""Now that your a Christian you must observe this church ordinance, right now."
Acts 10:47 Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we?
48 And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord.
Acts 22:16 And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.
turbosixx
New member
I would suggest to you that HS baptism only happened twice in the NT and was a special situation both times. Yes, Christians receive the HS as a seal but are not baptized with it as many would have us believe. Scripture just doesn't support that view.
In Acts 11 Peter is telling what happened with the FIRST Gentile converts.
11:15 And as I began to speak, the Holy Ghost fell on them, as on us at the beginning. 16 Then remembered I the word of the Lord, how that he said, John indeed baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost.
If Peter has been converting people since Pentecost, why would he say "as on us at the beginning"? Wouldn't he have seen this all along? If people have been "baptized with the HS" since Pentecost, why would he have to remember Jesus' words, shouldn't it be the norm for him by now?
God's Truth
New member
Water baptism is a ceremony, not much unlike a wedding ceremony. Water baptism is symbolic for what has already happened in the heart.
Water baptism is when we promise to God that we will die to sins and live like Jesus.
1 Peter 3:20 to those who were disobedient long ago when God waited patiently in the days of Noah while the ark was being built. In it only a few people, eight in all, were saved through water, 21 and this water symbolizes baptism that now saves you also—not the removal of dirt from the body but the pledge of a clear conscience toward God.
Water baptism is when we promise to God that we will die to sins and live like Jesus.
1 Peter 3:20 to those who were disobedient long ago when God waited patiently in the days of Noah while the ark was being built. In it only a few people, eight in all, were saved through water, 21 and this water symbolizes baptism that now saves you also—not the removal of dirt from the body but the pledge of a clear conscience toward God.
God's Truth
New member
Baptism mean immersed. We ARE immersed with the Holy Spirit when we are saved.
God's Truth
New member
We are added, saved, before, during, or after water baptism.
We can be given the Holy Spirit before, during, or after water baptism.
God's Truth
New member
Water baptism is a ceremony, it is symbolic of what has already happened in our heart.
Baptism represents how a believer equates his life with Christ’s death, burial, and resurrection. Our old person is to die and be buried with Jesus through baptism into death. We are buried with the water, and raised out of the water, raised to live a new life through Jesus.
Picture how baptism looks…the believer comes to make the pledge to God, to die to the sins of the world; so now standing in the water the believer falls back, as if dead; then, the believer goes under the water, buried; then, the believer rises up out of the water, raises up to live a new life.
Romans explain this perfectly.
Romans 6:4 We were therefore buried with him through baptism into death in order that, just as Christ was raised from the dead through the glory of the Father, we too may live a new life.
Baptism represents how a believer equates his life with Christ’s death, burial, and resurrection. Our old person is to die and be buried with Jesus through baptism into death. We are buried with the water, and raised out of the water, raised to live a new life through Jesus.
Picture how baptism looks…the believer comes to make the pledge to God, to die to the sins of the world; so now standing in the water the believer falls back, as if dead; then, the believer goes under the water, buried; then, the believer rises up out of the water, raises up to live a new life.
Romans explain this perfectly.
Romans 6:4 We were therefore buried with him through baptism into death in order that, just as Christ was raised from the dead through the glory of the Father, we too may live a new life.