Really? Where?
was cain and abel inside or outside the garden of eden?
- Thread starter Word based mystic
- Start date
Really? Where?
Mocking You
New member
Grand Canyon for $500, Alex.
Have you considered that the fall may have happened very soon after creation?
yes, perhaps immediately, as in, before they got "settled in" ?
JosephR
New member
yes very very very soon,, however not b4 the 7th day when God declared all was Good.
no. wal-mart. rustlers -
atrol:
Word based mystic
New member
Chapter 4 when eve has a child could just as easily have been in the Garden before the fall.
the time line very well could not have been progressive.
summary of progressive timeline by verse is not absolute in genesis
and summaries often hop back and forth
I.e. genesis 1:26 man being created day 6
then genesis 2:2 Day 7 and completion
then genesis 2:7 more detailed creation of man another out of progressive time summary
genesis 2:8 Garden of eden planted
genesis 2:9-17 description of more detail on the garden development
remember in genesis 1:26 and 27 male and female was already created.
mandates already given to subdue and multiply.
going back to genesis 2:22 shows a more detailed description of man and womans creation.
in vs 24 the multiply commission was reaffirmed in the description of them becoming one flesh.
The time length of the garden being planted is not framed in a time description.
genesis 2:15 says the GROUND IN EDEN WAS DEFINITELY to be CULTIVATED.
(Much time passed) in Genesis 2:18 Where God formed (every) beast of the field and bird of the sky so that adam could name them.
Here next is the conundrum and fluidity of genesis progressive time descriptions.
genesis 2:20 shows that man was made and helper not yet made/female
yet a progressive time definition throws genesis 1:27 (man created male and female) into a summary narrative.
It also puts into question of when the garden was created for chapter 2 infers the garden was made (after) day 7
yet chapter 1 infers day 6 was when man Both male and female was made.
After resting on day 7 God later made the Garden and after the garden was made and (inside the garden the woman was formed out of man).
Also in Chapter 2 vs 5 describes no shrubs or plants of the field had sprouted yet.
Chapter 1 vs 11 shows differently and would be contradictory if genesis was a specifically time progressive verse by verse time sequence.
Genesis 4 may very well have been a summary narrative of eves birth within the garden of eden and cain and abel time in the garden would agree with The fact that The presence of the Lord was with them and the garden soil not yet cursed responded to cain.
it would also give an understanding of cain being cast out to the east of the garden like adam and eve had.
the time line very well could not have been progressive.
summary of progressive timeline by verse is not absolute in genesis
and summaries often hop back and forth
I.e. genesis 1:26 man being created day 6
then genesis 2:2 Day 7 and completion
then genesis 2:7 more detailed creation of man another out of progressive time summary
genesis 2:8 Garden of eden planted
genesis 2:9-17 description of more detail on the garden development
remember in genesis 1:26 and 27 male and female was already created.
mandates already given to subdue and multiply.
going back to genesis 2:22 shows a more detailed description of man and womans creation.
in vs 24 the multiply commission was reaffirmed in the description of them becoming one flesh.
The time length of the garden being planted is not framed in a time description.
genesis 2:15 says the GROUND IN EDEN WAS DEFINITELY to be CULTIVATED.
(Much time passed) in Genesis 2:18 Where God formed (every) beast of the field and bird of the sky so that adam could name them.
Here next is the conundrum and fluidity of genesis progressive time descriptions.
genesis 2:20 shows that man was made and helper not yet made/female
yet a progressive time definition throws genesis 1:27 (man created male and female) into a summary narrative.
It also puts into question of when the garden was created for chapter 2 infers the garden was made (after) day 7
yet chapter 1 infers day 6 was when man Both male and female was made.
After resting on day 7 God later made the Garden and after the garden was made and (inside the garden the woman was formed out of man).
Also in Chapter 2 vs 5 describes no shrubs or plants of the field had sprouted yet.
Chapter 1 vs 11 shows differently and would be contradictory if genesis was a specifically time progressive verse by verse time sequence.
Genesis 4 may very well have been a summary narrative of eves birth within the garden of eden and cain and abel time in the garden would agree with The fact that The presence of the Lord was with them and the garden soil not yet cursed responded to cain.
it would also give an understanding of cain being cast out to the east of the garden like adam and eve had.
Cross Reference
New member
Why would it have to be? Not only that but, Adam was removed from before Cain was born.
Cross Reference
New member
That most certainly was who Adam "walked and talked" with in the cool of the day; th e same pre-incarnate Christ, Moses could not be allowed, on penalty of death, to see His face. (Ex 33:22 kJ)
Word based mystic
New member
these are speculative questions that none have yet answered so i post them here.
the whole point of the question is that much of genesis first 5 chapters do not have a
progressive verse by verse time stamp.
much summaries and narratives go back and forth and can be seen as contradictory.
unless the first 4 chapters are viewed as summaries.
and not time stamped verse by verse progression.
my last comment here is more of the meat of the subject and or question.
was cain In the presence of the Lord in the Garden Where the pre-incarnate Christ communed with and created adam.
Why did cain grieve so much for no longer being able to see/interact with the face of the ground and the face of the Lord.
was it because he would now have to be out of the garden and deal with the cursed ground?
why mention he was sent east of the garden like adam and eve had been?
the whole point of the question is that much of genesis first 5 chapters do not have a
progressive verse by verse time stamp.
much summaries and narratives go back and forth and can be seen as contradictory.
unless the first 4 chapters are viewed as summaries.
and not time stamped verse by verse progression.
my last comment here is more of the meat of the subject and or question.
was cain In the presence of the Lord in the Garden Where the pre-incarnate Christ communed with and created adam.
Why did cain grieve so much for no longer being able to see/interact with the face of the ground and the face of the Lord.
was it because he would now have to be out of the garden and deal with the cursed ground?
why mention he was sent east of the garden like adam and eve had been?
Word based mystic
New member
exactly
exactly
exactly
It is why I have a conjecture that it was in the garden
genesis 4:6 Cain went out from the face of the Lord, and dwelt as a fugitive on the earth,
face of the lord would have killed him. unless he was in the garden, a transition place.
exactly
exactly
It is why I have a conjecture that it was in the garden
genesis 4:6 Cain went out from the face of the Lord, and dwelt as a fugitive on the earth,
face of the lord would have killed him. unless he was in the garden, a transition place.
Cross Reference
New member
Was it the face of God Jacob saw? "And Jacob called the name of the place Peniel: for I have seen God face to face, and my life is preserved." Genesis 32:30 (KJV)
I would be careful with inserting what isn't necessary for our 'understanding' because it only reveals a spiritual bent away from the simplicity designed and purposed to persuade to a relationship with God.. The presence of God was not ever limited to the garden of eden.
Word based mystic
New member
yup your right presence of God is all throughout scripture and in present day meetings. phew thank You God.
This thread is basically questions I have never had answered by anyone.
Hoping to here some good glue that puts the gaps or no answers all together.