toldailytopic: Is it a sin to drink alcoholic beverages?

[Gurucam]

Rom 14:22 The faith which you have, have as your own conviction before God.

Happy is he who does not condemn himself in what he approves.

"Happy is he who does not condemn himself in what he approves."

Does this mean that nothing is morally and spiritually wrong in any absolute manner. However if someone esteems something to be morally and spiritually wrong then that thing becomes morally and spiritually wrong for that person and for no one else. (Romans: 14 verse: 14)

 

[csuguy]

Im just trying to bring some biblical tension into the conversation Re: rom 14:16- 23

You should be careful about what you say and do with regards to the people you are around - this is true. But when on the internet discussing these things, you should expect all kinds of people to see it. Likewise, all people should expect all kinds of other people to post what they think. I don't think posting your beliefs online is going to cause anyone to stumble much - if they disagree with it they will simply ignore you.

The only time posting controversial material online would cause others to fall would be if you are established as a spiritual leader of sorts. If you are a spiritual leader and want to discuss such things, it maybe arguably best to do so under a new username or something so that people don't know who you are.

 

[csuguy]

"Happy is he who does not condemn himself in what he approves."

Does this mean that nothing is morally and spiritually wrong in any absolute manner. However if someone esteems something to be morally and spiritually wrong then that thing becomes morally and spiritually wrong for that person and for no one else. (Romans: 14 verse: 14)

I believe there is an absolute standard - but we all stand relative to that absolute standard. We are responsible for what we know and understand - not necessarily for staying true to the absolute standard. As we study and are led by the HS, however, we come closer and closer to that absolute standard.

 

[csuguy]

The recommendation in the N.T. is to drink a little wine so as to alter one's level of consciousness (i.e. to become intoxicated). So that one can see more?

There was no mention of addiction. However becoming addicted is possible and could be bad.

Was this bad advise?

Actually, they recommend a little wine because it was one of the few ways they had to purify water.

 

[Gurucam]

You should be careful about what you say and do with regards to the people you are around - this is true. But when on the internet discussing these things, you should expect all kinds of people to see it. Likewise, all people should expect all kinds of other people to post what they think. I don't think posting your beliefs online is going to cause anyone to stumble much - if they disagree with it they will simply ignore you.

The only time posting controversial material online would cause others to fall would be if you are established as a spiritual leader of sorts. If you are a spiritual leader and want to discuss such things, it maybe arguably best to do so under a new username or something so that people don't know who you are.

He who post any thing that is contrary to what he knows to be Truth within his heart is seriously undermining his intuitive actualization which is essentially his spiritual awareness and spiritual development. This is the denial of one's self. And for what?

 

[Gurucam]

Actually, they recommend a little wine because it was one of the few ways they had to purify water.

Is that how you justify drinking wine?

Wine can never substitute for water. Did they give wine in place for water, to babies and children?

Did they drink ten glasses of wine to meet the recomended ten glasses of water a day?

The church did not see it as you suggested, they continue to have wine long after purified was available and widely drank by great masses around them.

Also how is it possible to drink wine and not be intoxicated?

 

[lowerlevel]

You should be careful about what you say and do with regards to the people you are around - this is true. But when on the internet discussing these things, you should expect all kinds of people to see it. Likewise, all people should expect all kinds of other people to post what they think. I don't think posting your beliefs online is going to cause anyone to stumble much - if they disagree with it they will simply ignore you.

The only time posting controversial material online would cause others to fall would be if you are established as a spiritual leader of sorts. If you are a spiritual leader and want to discuss such things, it maybe arguably best to do so under a new username or something so that people don't know who you are.

ya, good thoughts. Web 2.0 is just an all around different experience...though it is odd to become 'a different person' when you log on to a forum. If Romans 14 (and many other verses regarding christian relationships) dont apply to online relationships... well I dont know, its just weird.

 

[Gurucam]

I believe there is an absolute standard - but we all stand relative to that absolute standard. We are responsible for what we know and understand - not necessarily for staying true to the absolute standard. As we study and are led by the HS, however, we come closer and closer to that absolute standard.

Are you saying that there is an absolute standard but it is not enforced absolutely by God? Seems that cannot be an absolute standard. It is a flexible standard.

Then you are suggesting that God is flexible with the ten Commandments and the Love Commandments? A little adultery is permitted?

Are you saying that there is an absolute standard but we are not necessarily responsible for 'staying true to same'. A little coveting is O.K. or at least permitted or forgivable.

From your logic, it is quite possible that you do not yet know and understand that there is no absolute standard? Is that at all possible? It is possible that you do not yet know Truth? Is that at all possible?

Do you think that Paul when he caption his revelation in Romans:14 verse: 14 with 'I know and I am persuaded by the Lord Jesus Christ', he intended this revelation to be very special. One that is meant to stand alone. A precise and deliberate stand alone Christian tenant.

Is it possible that you do not yet 'know and understand' the above but Paul knows and understand and is delivering precisely and literally what he wants to deliver?

 

[lowerlevel]

Is that how you justify drinking wine?

Wine can never substitute for water. Did they give wine in place for water, to babies and children?

Did they drink ten glasses of wine to meet the recomended ten glasses of water a day?

The church did not see it as you suggested, they continue to have wine long after purified was available and widely drank by great masses around them.

Also how is it possible to drink wine and not be intoxicated?

what are some possible reasons that Timothy was "drinking only water" ?

 

[csuguy]

Are you saying that there is an absolute standard but it is not enforced absolutely by God?

Are you saying that there is an absolute standard but we are not necessarily responsible for 'staying true to same'.

Supposed it is that you do not yet know and understand that there is no absolute standard? Is that at all possible?

I am saying that there is an absolute standard, but we are judged relative to our knowledge and understanding of that standard.

 

[csuguy]

Is that how you justify drinking wine?

There is no need to justify it - its not sinful.

Wine can never substitute for water.

Did they give wine in place for water, to babies and children?

Did they drink ten glasses of wine to meet the recomended ten glasses of water a day?

Never said it was a substitute for water.

The church did not see it as you suggested, they continue to have wine long after purified was available and widely drank by great masses around them.

Drinking wine is not a sin - so so what if they continued to drink it?

Also how is it possible to drink wine and not be intoxicated?

Have you ever drank alcohol? I can drink 10 shots in a night (or more depending upon how long I'm out) and not be drunk.

 

[csuguy]

He who post any thing that is contrary to what he knows to be Truth within his heart is seriously undermining his intuitive actualization which is essentially his spiritual awareness and spiritual development. This is the denial of one's self. And for what?

I'm not saying you should post contrary to what you know to be true - merely that you need to be aware that the truth can be a stumbling block to people, the truth must be wielded with care.

 

[Lighthouse]

No. In fact I could use some right now. I've got some congestion and the alcohol could help kill the infection.

Also, I've posted to TOL after having imbibed. As recently as Halloween night.

 

[Persephone66]

I would advise against drinking to excess.

I would also advise against preaching the gospel while intoxicated.

 

[Nick M]

merely that you need to be aware that the truth can be a stumbling block to people, the truth must be wielded with care.

It is very true that the truth is a stumbling block. Jesus declared it of himself. But he also said put the truth in their face, and to turn your back on them if they reject it.

 

[kmoney]

Also, I've posted to TOL after having imbibed.

Drinking isn't a sin, but I think being pretentious might be. :think:

 

[csuguy]

It is very true that the truth is a stumbling block. Jesus declared it of himself. But he also said put the truth in their face, and to turn your back on them if they reject it.

Not all truths are equal - sometimes it is better to keep your mouth shut on an issue than to cause someone to stumble. Don't lie of course, just don't bring it up.

 

[TomO]

No. In fact I could use some right now. I've got some congestion and the alcohol could help kill the infection.
Also, I've posted to TOL after having imbibed. As recently as Halloween night.

Yer kiddin' right? :squint:

 

[kmoney]

Yer kiddin' right? :squint:

Alcohol will cure what ails ya. :cheers:

 

[elohiym]

I would also advise against preaching the gospel while intoxicated.

So like baptism by beer bong is out?