ECT They can't be the same

[Cross Reference]

The point:

Those that cursed the seed of Abraham could not get blessed.
The mystery of the gospel is that now they can be blessed.

I dumbed it down even further for you.

You only screwed it up in an attempt to make fit your dogma.

In this, where is "Those who cursed Abraham's seed" that it should considered as part of any of it. It ain't there, bunky.

 

[Nick M]

Indeed,

Mystery of Christ- that Christ died for men's sins.

Mystery of the Gospel- that Christ died for all, even Gentiles excluded from the promises to Abraham.

I think it is dishonesty and not stupidity that they claim Genesis 12 means something other than what it says.

 

[heir]

There are Gentiles excluded in Gen 12:1-3 (KJV). The cursed.
The mystery of the gospel is that these have hope too, now.

Yep! And as much as people want to keep applying verses of people from the OT who had a hope, the Gentiles like the Ephesians to whom Paul wrote the letter in time past had no hope! And that they "but now" did was mystery/ in other ages not made known unto the sons of men/unsearchable/ hid in God! I'm not sure why so many fight this truth. It's written right there in Ephesians!

 

[Danoh]

Who is the olive tree?

Who are the branches broken off?

Who are the wild branches grafted in?

I'll give it a shot.

Keep in mind that I hold to a Mid-Acts Dispensationalism that differs in some respects to that of others on here. Just as you, and, say, our brother in the Lord, Interplanner; though you both basically hold to the same school of thought on many of these issues, more or less, at the same time, you differ in your respective understanding of some things.

Christianity itself as a school of thought is one in which many who hold to some understandings in the same way; nevertheless hold to other aspects in ways greatly differing form one another.

Likewise within Mid-Acts or any other school of thought, for that matter.

Your questions are off-base. As a result of your understanding being off-base.

The Olive Tree is not a who; it is a what. It is the spiritual blessing that flows from the root. The root is Abraham.

And he both received the blessing and became the root through which it’s fatness flowed “when he was in… Uncircumcision” Rom. 4:10.

The branches represent who is in a place of access to the spiritually rich, or fattening blessing that flows from Abraham.

At one time, Israel - as a nation - was given that access.

But access is to possession - it is not possession.

The Wild Olive Tree represents those outside of access to the spiritual blessing, and thus, without hope of possessing the blessing.

The issue is access. Said access is by faith - the access is offered but is appropriated by faith.

Israel as a nation above all others was given access to the blessing but fell from said access.

“Wherefore? Because they sought it” - the blessing – “not by faith” Rom. 9:32.

The access is now being offered to all without distinction, Rom. 11:32.

But said access is by faith - one has to step up and appropriate it. By faith. By believing it is real.

Romans is not only edification doctrine for Believers in their “mutual faith,” Rom. 1: 11, 12, it is also Gospel teaching to the lost, Rom. 1:13-16. Paul relates his intent as to its dual role in his writing Romans in chapter one - that it serve his not having been able to get to Rome up to that point to do perform these two actions in person, Rom. 1:13.

Anyway, in Romans 11, the Gentiles are being warned that this direct access to the blessing will be cut off one day, just as had been the case with Israel, Rom. 11:19-25.

Not members of the Body, but Gentiles in general, Rom. 11:13.

They are being warned that just as Israel became high minded - concluded they had the blessing because they were Abraham's seed and as a result refused to believe and rejected Christ - the Gentiles are to take hold of the access being offered them by believing it while it is still being offered, for GOD will one day cut it off.

John's warning to the Scribes and the Pharisees in Matthew 3 and the Lord's warning to Jews in John 5 and 8 touch on this high-mindedness of Israel's.

While, in between Rom. 11:15 and Rom. 11:26 is 2 Thess. 2 and is the issue of the access to the blessing being cut off one day.

2 Thess. 2 takes up the Rom. 11 issue that 2 Thess. 2 refers to as those "who loved not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness" 2 Thess. 2:12.

Thus, Paul's warning to Gentiles in general, in Romans 11 to "Be not high minded but fear" Rom. 11: 20. It’s the same warning Paul would make in person, see Acts 17: 30, 31.

You wanted an answer from “a MADist;” you got one, Tet. Disagree with it how you will; nevertheless, perhaps someone else will hear it out.

The best to you in this...