The Saving results of the Death of Christ !

[Hoping]

1 John 1:8 KJV — If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

John was including himself in the "we". You must be greater than John was in your perfection.

The word "IF" states a condition and result.
If we walk in darkness...X
If we walk in light...Y
After verse 5, John alternates between darkness and light.
Those who cannot say they have no sin are those in darkness; sin, according to Pro 4:19.

Verse 7 says we can have all our sins washed away, so why can't those whose sins have been washed away say that?

 

[Hoping]

False.
Ephesians 1:13, 2:6

Keep believing and you will be saved...on the day of judgement when your name is found in the book of life.
Do something that invalidates your belief, like murder someone, and you won't be saved.

Confusion reigns within you.
This is not saying we are to work FOR our salvation. It means that we put effort into our walk with Christ.

I agree.

You don't put effort into something that you automatically do.

I agree, so if we do something a Christian would never automatically do, it means we don't have salvation.

What does it matter, if you're guaranteed not to sin no matter what?

What guarantee?
Belief can cease in a second.

Sorry, but that verse is NOT saying that Christians do not sin. It's not even talking about Christians.

Whoever it is talking about, is reborn of God's seed, so cannot bring forth the fruit of the devil.
Who is reborn of God's seed that is not a Christian?

You can't have your cake and eat it too.
Either it's impossible for a Christian to sin, or it's not. Which is it?

It is impossible for those reborn of God's seed to bring forth the fruit of the devil.
Manifest from whom you are born.

Yes.
Because He's perfect.

What did He have that all the other sons of God don't have?

We are not.

Don't sell yourself short.

We can try to. But because of our sin nature, because of our flesh, we will still sometimes sin. Hence why Paul tells us to PUT EFFORT into our salvation.

Did Jesus have a "sin nature"?
Why would any other son of God have a sin nature?

You don't get strong just by signing up for a gym membership. You have to actually go work out, eat properly, not eat junk food, and you have to KEEP doing that, or you will lose the progress you've made.

KEEP doing it then !

It is if it's guaranteed that nothing bad will happen to them after.

If they don't "KEEP" doing what is necessary, they have no guarantee.

There's no point in telling someone to be holy if they're already holy. No?

Why does refreshed exhortation seem needless to you?
It isn't to me, or Paul(?).
It is written..."But exhort one another daily, while it is called To day; lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin." (Heb 3:13)
Look up the word "exhort" in the biblegateway.com site for how often the word is used by Paul

Never said it did.

An "invisibility doctrine" says it does.

Christ's blood paid for our sins, past, present, and future.

There are no future sins for those who have been reborn of God's seed.
The "future sins" abominable doctrine is the most sin accommodating of false doctrine that I know of.

When God looks at our account, He sees Christ, not a dead man wallowing in his sins.

Agreed, which necessitates no sin be present, doesn't it?

Unmerited favor.
We did NOTHING to earn eternal life. But God freely offered it to us, by sending His Son to die on the cross, for him to be buried, and then rise again on the third day.

Thanks be to God for doing something we couldn't.
Now we can live like His suffering and death means something.

Every post you make where you claim to no longer sin is my evidence that you are lying, because Scripture says otherwise.

Scripture like...
“Be ye therefore perfect, even as you Father which is in heaven is perfect.” (Matt 5:48)

“I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me." (John 17:22-23)

“Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.
For he that is dead is freed from sin.” (Rom. 6:6-7)

"There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit." (Rom 8:1)

"Awake to righteousness, and sin not; for some have not the knowledge of God: I speak this to your shame." (1 Cor 15:34)

"For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him." (2 Cor 5:21)

"Finally, brethren, farewell. Be perfect, be of good comfort, be of one mind, live in peace; and the God of love and peace shall be with you." (2 Cor 13:11)

"And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins;
Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:
Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others." (Eph 2:1-3)

"Let us therefore, as many as be perfect, be thus minded: and if in anything ye be otherwise minded, God shall reveal even this unto you." (Phil 3:15)

"Whom we preach, warning every man, and teaching every man in all wisdom; that we may present every man perfect in Christ Jesus:" (Col 1:28)
"Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, let everyone that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity." (2 Tim 2:19)
"All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works." (2 Tim 3:16-17)
"But we are not of them who draw back unto perdition; but of them that believe to the saving of the soul." (Heb 10:39)

"Unto the pure all things are pure: but unto them that are defiled and unbelieving is nothing pure; but even their mind and conscience is defiled.
They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate." (Titus 1:15-16)

"But let patience have her perfect work, that ye may be perfect and entire, wanting nothing." (James 1:4)

"If any man offend not in word, the same is a perfect man, and able also to bridle the whole body." (James 3:2)

"But as he which hath called you is holy, so be ye holy in all manner of conversation;
Because it is written, Be ye holy; for I am holy." (1 Peter 1:15-16)
“For even hereunto were ye called: because Christ also suffered for us, leaving us an example, that ye should follow his steps
Who did no sin, neither was guile found in his mouth:” (1 Peter 2:21-22)

"Forasmuch then as Christ hath suffered for us in the flesh, arm yourselves likewise with the same mind: for he that hath suffered in the flesh hath ceased from sin;" (1 Peter 4:1)

"According as his divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue:
Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust." (2 Peter 1:3-4)

“Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall:" (2 Peter 1:10)

"Wherefore, beloved, seeing that ye look for such things, be diligent that ye may be found of him in peace, without spot, and blameless." (2 Peter 3:14)

“But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.” (1 John 1:7)

“Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.
And ye know that he was manifested to take away our sins; and in him is no sin.
Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him.
Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.
He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.
Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.” (1 John 3:4-9)

“We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.” (1 John 5:18)
?

Show me just one scripture that says we can not walk in the light, or free from sin.
I'll bet on my twenty-one against your one.

 

[Derf]

The word "IF" states a condition and result.
If we walk in darkness...X
If we walk in light...Y
After verse 5, John alternates between darkness and light.
Those who cannot say they have no sin are those in darkness; sin, according to Pro 4:19.

Verse 7 says we can have all our sins washed away, so why can't those whose sins have been washed away say that?

We can, but then we have to admit when we sin the next time, else we lie.
1 John 1:8 KJV — If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

If we lie by saying we no longer sin, then He can't forgive us our sins and cleanse us from all unrighteousness--we're still participating in that sin of lying.
1 John 1:9 KJV — If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

 

[Hoping]

We can,

Then any argument that we cannot say "we have no sin" is over.

but then we have to admit when we sin the next time, else we lie.
1 John 1:8 KJV — If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

More sin manifests one is walking in darkness.
If one is walking in God, there is no reason to go back into darkness.

If we lie by saying we no longer sin, then He can't forgive us our sins and cleanse us from all righteousness--we're still participating in that sin of lying.
1 John 1:9 KJV — If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

If one is still sinning, they were never in God who is the light.
The lie occurs when sinners say they don't commit sin.
Thank God for allowing us to be non-sinners, since the resurrection of Jesus Christ.

 

[Derf]

Then any argument that we cannot say "we have no sin" is over.

More sin manifests one is walking in darkness.
If one is walking in God, there is no reason to go back into darkness.

If one is still sinning, they were never in God who is the light.
The lie occurs when sinners say they don't commit sin.
Thank God for allowing us to be non-sinners, since the resurrection of Jesus Christ.

Non-sinners in spirit, and being sanctified as we fight the flesh.

 

[Hoping]

Non-sinners in spirit, and being sanctified as we fight the flesh.

Who controls your actions?
Your hands?
Your fingers?
Your skin?
Your mind.
As a sanctified, new creature, born of God, I have no need to fight the temple of the Holy Spirit.

 

[Derf]

Who controls your actions?
Your hands?
Your fingers?
Your skin?
Your mind.
As a sanctified, new creature, born of God, I have no need to fight the temple of the Holy Spirit.

Paul did. You must be newer, better than Paul.

 

[Hoping]

Paul did. You must be newer, better than Paul.

Show where Paul sinned or repented of sins done as a supposed Christian.
Paul wrote..."Awake to righteousness, and sin not; for some have not the knowledge of God: I speak this to your shame." (1 Cor 15:34)
And these..."Whom we preach, warning every man, and teaching every man in all wisdom; that we may present every man perfect in Christ Jesus:" (Col 1:28)
"Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, let everyone that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity." (2 Tim 2:19)
"All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works." (2 Tim 3:16-17)
Hardly the words of a sinner.

Paul showed us how to get rid of, destroy, the old man, (Rom 6:6), with its vile affections and lusts. (Gal 5:24)

 

[Derf]

Show where Paul sinned or repented of sins done as a supposed Christian.
Paul wrote..."Awake to righteousness, and sin not; for some have not the knowledge of God: I speak this to your shame." (1 Cor 15:34)
And these..."Whom we preach, warning every man, and teaching every man in all wisdom; that we may present every man perfect in Christ Jesus:" (Col 1:28)
"Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, let everyone that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity." (2 Tim 2:19)
"All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works." (2 Tim 3:16-17)
Hardly the words of a sinner.

Paul showed us how to get rid of, destroy, the old man, (Rom 6:6), with its vile affections and lusts. (Gal 5:24)

Paul said this:
Romans 7:14 KJV — For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.
"I am" is present tense first person singular. Paul is talking specifically about himself, not in the past, but currently (when he was writing the letter to the Roman church).

He goes on to explain:
Romans 7:15 KJV — For that which I do I allow not: for what I would, that do I not; but what I hate, that do I.

He is wanting one thing, but doing another, which thing he hates. So he hates what he does. If Paul was only doing righteousness, and wanting to do righteousness, why would he hate it? He must, therefore, be talking about one part of him doing what another part of him hates, revealing conflict.

He decided it must be another force acting within him:
Romans 7:17 KJV — Now then it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.

Now, if he is righteous, but sin is acting within him, then he can count himself righteous, not through the lack of sin, but through the blood of Jesus, recognizing the old man, while considered dead, is still alive in his body:
Romans 7:25 KJV — I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.

Yet Paul also told his readers to immitate himself, so he was righteous in his deeds, for the most part--a sign of continuing sanctification.
1 Corinthians 11:1 NKJV — Imitate me, just as I also imitate Christ.

 

[Right Divider]

Paul frequently admonished believers to behave properly. That makes no sense whatsoever if believers became sinless upon believing.

 

[Hoping]

Paul said this:
Romans 7:14 KJV — For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.
"I am" is present tense first person singular. Paul is talking specifically about himself, not in the past, but currently (when he was writing the letter to the Roman church).

It is in the past-narrative tense, as he is presenting a past point of his life as if he were still there in the flesh he said was also in the past in Rom 7:5..."For when we were in the flesh,..."

He goes on to explain:
Romans 7:15 KJV — For that which I do I allow not: for what I would, that do I not; but what I hate, that do I.

From his past in the flesh.

He is wanting one thing, but doing another, which thing he hates. So he hates what he does. If Paul was only doing righteousness, and wanting to do righteousness, why would he hate it? He must, therefore, be talking about one part of him doing what another part of him hates, revealing conflict.

That was the norm, before men could destroy the old man, (Rom 6:6), and start to walk in the Spirit. (Rom 8:4,9)

He decided it must be another force acting within him:
Romans 7:17 KJV — Now then it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.

Still from his past.

Now, if he is righteous, but sin is acting within him, then he can count himself righteous, not through the lack of sin, but through the blood of Jesus, recognizing the old man, while considered dead, is still alive in his body:

Such was the case for all OT men who tried unsuccessfully to be righteous by adhering to the Law of Moses.

Romans 7:25 KJV — I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.

See?
He wraps up his OT quandary by asserting his new life walked in the Spirit instead of in the flesh.
The new mind is now driving the "car".
Let's go back to Rom 7:23..."But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members."
Paul answers the "law of sin which is in his members" with Rom 8:2..."For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death."
Paul was already free from that which he wrote of in Ro 7, showing again that it was from his distant past.

Let's examine Rom 7:24 too..."O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?"
Paul has already supplied the answer in Rom 6:6..."Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin."
Showing again the past-present sense of Rom 7.
Rom 7's laments were answered in Rom 6 and 8.
If Rom 7's plaints were present tense, how could they have been answered in other chapters?

Yet Paul also told his readers to immitate himself, so he was righteous in his deeds, for the most part--a sign of continuing sanctification.
1 Corinthians 11:1 NKJV — Imitate me, just as I also imitate Christ.

So appropriate for one walking in the Spirit.
BTW, sanctification happens at water baptism in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins when His atoning, justifying, cleansing, sanctifying, blood is applied to our bodies.
It is not a process or gradual.