CoCrucified,
So you believe we are automatically baptized with the HS upon believing the word of God?
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Yes, upon accepting the work of Jesus Christ on the cross.
Ok, then why weren't the Samaritans in Acts 8:5-16 automatically Spririt baptized upon beleiving the word of God?:
5) And Philip went down to the city of Samaria and proclaimed Christ to them.
6) And the people with one accord gave heed to those things which Philip spoke, hearing and seeing the many miracles which he did.
7) For out of those having unclean spirits, many came out, crying with loud voice. And many who had been paralyzed and lame were healed.
8) And there was great joy in that city.
9) But a certain man called Simon had long been conjuring in the city, and amazing the nation of Samaria, claiming himself to be some great one.
10) All gave heed to him, from the least to the greatest, saying, This one is the great power of God.
11) And they were paying attention to him, because for a long time he had amazed them with conjuring.
12) But when they believed Philip preaching the gospel, the things concerning the kingdom of God and the name of Jesus Christ, they were baptized, both men and women.
13) Then Simon himself believed also, and being baptized, he continued with Philip. And seeing miracles and mighty works happening, he was amazed.
14) And the apostles in Jerusalem hearing that Samaria had received the Word of God, they sent Peter and John to them;
15) who when they had come down, prayed for them that they might receive the Holy Spirit.
16) For as yet He had not fallen on any of them, they were baptized only in the name of the Lord Jesus.
Common theory, but where does the Bible support it?
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"The key to understanding the baptism by the Spirit is that it is a positional truth. It is not an experience; it has nothing to do with feelings. The baptism is an instantaneous work comprised of many simultaneous acts of the sovereign God. The following comments deal with but five of these acts which concern us here."
"Observing what transpired at Pentecost we see that the first act was regeneration, or new birth, by the Spirit (Titus 3:5; John 3:6)."
Well well well.... thank you ---> "Observing what transpired at Pentecost we see that the first act was regeneration, or new birth, by the Spirit."
You do realize that the baptism perfomed at Pentecost was baptism in the name of Jesus Christ (Acts 2:38), which is done with water. Acts 10:47:48 clearly shows that this is done with water:
47) Can anyone forbid water, that these should not be baptized who have received the Holy Spirit just as we have?"
48) And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then they asked him to stay a few days.
This is not to say that the Holy Spirit was not involved in this event. He was certainly responsible for conversion of those sinners. Peter spoke words inspired by the Holy Spirit, and it was those words, by the Holy Spirit, that those sinners came to obey the gospel and be water baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, just as commanded by Peter, who was commanded to do so in Matt 28:19-20. So by one Spirit through the word of God being preached by Peter they obeyed the gospel, being baptized into Christ. Without the Holy Spirit, this wouldn't have been possible, for He is Who revealed the word. That's why Paul said in 1 Cor. 12:13 that we baptized into Christ by one Spirit... because without the teachings of the Holy Spirit, revealing the gospel to the sinners of the world, they wouldn't be led by the Spirit into baptism in the name of Christ for the forgiveness of sins!
"Upon believing, each was sealed with the indwelling Spirit. This has a threefold significance: a finished transaction; a mark of ownership; a guarantee of safe delivery [security]. "In whom, having also believed, ye were sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise, which is an earnest [down payment] of our inheritance, unto the [final] redemption of God's own possession" (Ephesians 1:13, 14, ASV)."
Well yes, because those who believe going to hear the same gospel preached to the Jews - Jesus Christ and Him crucified, being raised on the 3rd day whom God made both Lord and Christ. I can assure you that Paul doesn't simply mean a belief that is dead upon itself, but rather a belief that produces obedience to the gospel, which most certainly includes being baptized for the remission of sins. Would somebody be sealed who has not had their sins forgiven? No. Paul himself had people baptized in the name of the Lord (Acts 19:5), which, again, is done with water (Acts 10:47-48). Paul, who says that there is only ONE baptism, practiced water baptism in the name of the Lord.
"Hence each believer from Pentecost to this day has been, by the Holy Spirit, regenerated, indwelt, baptized into Christ, sealed and anointed--
Yup... again, if it wasn't for the Holy Spirit inspiring the words of Peter to those Jews, who preached the saving gospel of Christ, they never would have been water baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of their sins. They wouldn't have been reborn, having their sins forgiven, putting the old man of sin away, and arising dead to sin and alive to God (Romans 6:1-11).
The baptism in Acts 2:38 clearly states that it's for the forgiveness of sins. Paul speaks of baptism in Romans 6, coming to the SAME conclusion, that it frees the believer from sins (verses 6-7). Paul performed baptism in the name of the Lord (Acts 19:5), the same as the baptism in the name of the Lord spoken of in Acts 2:38, which is done with water (Acts 10: 47-48). Paul would not speak of one baptism and practice another one. No... Paul proclaimed that there is ONE baptism (Eph. 4:5), he wrote about it in Romans 6 and had it observed in Acts 19:5 - water baptism in the name of the Lord.
So.... I'm still waiting to see a verse from the Bible that supports your theory that the baptism with water pictures what has already happened to the believer upon conversion.
I simply cannot reconcile how a work done by us could save us.
It the Grace of God that saves us through faith in His Son (Eph. 2:8). Our works do not save us... we cannot earn what we do not deserve in the first place. We get water baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins not because we are trying to earn our way into Heaven, but because of the gospel produces faith (Rom. 10:17), and faith, true faith, produces obedience. How can we say we have faith in Christ if we don't do what He commands for the remission of sins? Is such "faith" recognized by God? No way! The Bible clearly states
HOW we know whether or not we know Christ:
1 John 2:3-6
3) Now by this we know that we know Him, if we keep His commandments.
4) He who says, "I know Him," and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.
5) But whoever keeps His word, truly the love of God is perfected in him. By this we know that we are in Him.
6) He who says he abides in Him ought himself also to walk just as He walked.
True faith in God produces
obedience. Christ is the author of eternal savation to those who
"obey" Him (Heb. 5:9). There are many examples in Acts of people being baptized after Christ was preached to them, why? To "earn" salvation? No, because if they have faith that Christ is the Son of God, then they are going to obey His commandment to be baptized, because they have faith in Him
and what HE SAYS TO FOR SALVATION, otherwise, how can they say they have faith in Him? If Christ says to be baptized for the remission of sins, then it should be done, not because you "should" or because you are "earning" anything, but because you have faith in your Lord and love Him (those who love Him keeps His commandments - John 14:15), knowing that you can't possibly make it into heaven without having your sins forgiven (which is what baptism is FOR), being reborn into Christ!
Please forgive me if I've missed an earlier posting of yours, but can you please tell me why you do not consider water baptism to be "works?"
Baptism is a work, but so is belief (John 6: 28-29). So is repentance. Technically, a work is anything that man must do. Man must believe. A work. Man must repent. A work. And yes, man must be baptized for the remission of sins. A work. We don't do those things to "earn" anything, no, we do it because true faith produces obedience, and that is the faith that saves! James chapter 2 spells that out. Works work together to perfect faith. Just as the body without the soul is dead, so is faith without works (James 2: 26). Faith without obedience is a dead faith, pure and simple.
Let me ask you this... do you think the baptism that Paul spoke of in Romans 6 is the same baptism that Christ commanded in Matt. 28:19-20?
Matthew 28:19,20
19) "Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit,
20) teaching them to observe all things that I have commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the age." Amen.
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No, because the baptism of the Spirit is a work of the Holy Spirit, thus the Holy Spirit can only perform it. The baptism performed by the Apostles was a physical act of immersing believers as an act of identification with the baptism of the Holy Spirit, and a witness to others.
Show me in the Bible where water baptism is an identification with Spirit baptism and it's a whitness to others.
Who was the Etheopian eunuch witnessing to when he was baptized in Acts 8:38? Where was the crowd?
I believe Romans 6 is referring to the baptism of the Holy Spirit.
I've already shown you that baptism in the name of the Lord is for the forgiveness of sins (Acts 2:38) and that it is done with water (Acts 10:47-48). Paul speaks of baptism in Romans 6 as freeing the person of sins (verses 6,7). Coincidental paralell? I think not. And again, Paul, who wrote Romans 6 had people baptized in the name of the Lord (Acts 19:5), which I have shown is done with water. Paul practiced the "ONE" baptism that he preached - water baptism in the name of the Lord as commanded by Christ.
I believe Matt. 28:19-20 is commanding the Apostles to perform water baptism.
Agreed. Don't you find it a bit odd that we can find where we are commanded to be water baptized, yet we find NO commandment for Spirit baptism...
Acts 8: 5-16 proves my point. Those people, after being preached Christ, were NOT automatically Spirit baptized upon believing the gospel (see verses 12 and 16), which is what you claim happens. Notice, however, that they WERE baptized in the name of the Lord (again verses 12 and 16), just as Christ commanded. ONE baptism, not two.