The "Church" at Acts 2 is NOT the Body of Christ

daqq

Well-known member
Let me guess: You are taught directly by God, and that settles it.

You deceptive fraud.

About the midst of the feast of Sukkot Yeshua went up into the temple and taught. The Yhudim therefore wondered, saying, How does this one know letters, (γραμματα), not having been discipled? Yeshua therefore answered them, and said, My teaching is not my own but His that sent me: if anyone desires to do His will, the same shall know the teaching, whether it is of Elohim, or whether I speak from myself. The one speaking from himself seeks his own glory: but the one seeking the glory of Him that sent him, the same is true, and there is no unrighteousness in him. Did not Moshe give you the Torah? and yet no one of you does the Torah, (John 7:14-19b).

How is it that Yeshua knows letters, (γραμματα), without having been discipled and taught by the Rabbins and teachers of the Torah? How is it that the Yhudim understood that he should not be able to read and understand the Torah without their own discipleship from their own teachers? It is because the Torah contained the letters, (γραμματα), but they were not pointed, (στικτα), as it is today in the Masorete Hebrew text, (which is only about one thousand years old as of now). Accordingly therefore it was assumed that one could not read and understand the Torah without the teachers of the people being heavily involved in the training of the student. This means that the Rabbins, Elders, Scribes, and teachers of the Torah had already inserted themselves into the Torah by way of their own interpretations of an unfinished text. However Yeshua was able to read it without letter pointing or any instruction from the Rabbins and teachers of the Torah: and that is precisely why his doctrine was diametrically opposed to their own, for they had already by this time inserted themselves and their own interpretations into the readings of the text, that is, their own understanding as for how to read the letters of the text.

The Torah was not intended to be fully complete and understandable when it was rewritten under Ezra. It was specifically designed to be left incomplete until Messiah would come to fully expound all things. This is why Moshe set judges over the people, so as to make judgements based on their reading and understanding of the written text, and by the Spirit of the Law; for in the long term the truth would come to light, after sufficient debate and argument back and forth, as to what is the most proper understanding in any given situation. But man always has the predisposition to clarify laws so that judgment and condemnation may be carried out. Because of these things the rulers and judges of the people had cursed themselves by the time Yeshua arrived on the scene because they had inserted themselves and their own carnal interpretations into the text through discipleship into their own self-certified training programs. This is why Yeshua says elsewhere that they had left out the weightier matters of the Torah: just judgment, (justice), compassionate mercy and grace, and trusting-faithfulness-belief, (Matthew 23:23), for these things were to come not by the letter, for they are not in the letter, but by the Spirit through the judges who were set up to make such determinations. And that is why mercy and grace are not often mentioned in the Torah; for it is likewise a trial for the reader, to see what "the judge" will do with the text before him, (or her), and therefore the entire understanding depends on the heart and mindset of the reader. But the Yhudim, even in the time of Yeshua, had taken that away from the people by way of their strict enforcement of their own interpretations through their own training in their own schools. If the reader loves YHWH Elohim with all the heart, and with all the soul, and with all the mind, then the reader will not see YHWH Elohim as a vengeful and merciless Creator but rather the One who is love and loves His creation and people.

Woe unto you, Scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites; for you tithe mint, and anise, and cumin, and have left undone the weightier matters of the Torah: justice, (right judgment), and compassion, (merciful graciousness), and faithfulness-trusting-belief: these things are necessary to be done, (when you insert your spirit of understanding into the letter), and the same you leave undone! (Matthew 23:23).

You do the same as everyone else Teflon John, that is, you insert your own spirit of understanding into the text when you read it through your own eyes. And that same spirit of understanding comes forth in all of your own judgmental inflammatory words with every breath that you spew and in all the words of condemnation which you write to those you hate. One day the Father will be taking His air away from your carcass: and what then will you do? :chuckle:
 

john w

New member
Hall of Fame
About the midst of the feast of Sukkot Yeshua went up into the temple and taught. The Yhudim therefore wondered, saying, How does this one know letters, (γραμματα), not having been discipled? Yeshua therefore answered them, and said, My teaching is not my own but His that sent me: if anyone desires to do His will, the same shall know the teaching, whether it is of Elohim, or whether I speak from myself. The one speaking from himself seeks his own glory: but the one seeking the glory of Him that sent him, the same is true, and there is no unrighteousness in him. Did not Moshe give you the Torah? and yet no one of you does the Torah, (John 7:14-19b).

How is it that Yeshua knows letters, (γραμματα), without having been discipled and taught by the Rabbins and teachers of the Torah? How is it that the Yhudim understood that he should not be able to read and understand the Torah without their own discipleship from their own teachers? It is because the Torah contained the letters, (γραμματα), but they were not pointed, (στικτα), as it is today in the Masorete Hebrew text, (which is only about one thousand years old as of now). Accordingly therefore it was assumed that one could not read and understand the Torah without the teachers of the people being heavily involved in the training of the student. This means that the Rabbins, Elders, Scribes, and teachers of the Torah had already inserted themselves into the Torah by way of their own interpretations of an unfinished text. However Yeshua was able to read it without letter pointing or any instruction from the Rabbins and teachers of the Torah: and that is precisely why his doctrine was diametrically opposed to their own, for they had already by this time inserted themselves and their own interpretations into the readings of the text, that is, their own understanding as for how to read the letters of the text.

The Torah was not intended to be fully complete and understandable when it was rewritten under Ezra. It was specifically designed to be left incomplete until Messiah would come to fully expound all things. This is why Moshe set judges over the people, so as to make judgements based on their reading and understanding of the written text, and by the Spirit of the Law; for in the long term the truth would come to light, after sufficient debate and argument back and forth, as to what is the most proper understanding in any given situation. But man always has the predisposition to clarify laws so that judgment and condemnation may be carried out. Because of these things the rulers and judges of the people had cursed themselves by the time Yeshua arrived on the scene because they had inserted themselves and their own carnal interpretations into the text through discipleship into their own self-certified training programs. This is why Yeshua says elsewhere that they had left out the weightier matters of the Torah: just judgment, (justice), compassionate mercy and grace, and trusting-faithfulness-belief, (Matthew 23:23), for these things were to come not by the letter, for they are not in the letter, but by the Spirit through the judges who were set up to make such determinations. And that is why mercy and grace are not often mentioned in the Torah; for it is likewise a trial for the reader, to see what "the judge" will do with the text before him, (or her), and therefore the entire understanding depends on the heart and mindset of the reader. But the Yhudim, even in the time of Yeshua, had taken that away from the people by way of their strict enforcement of their own interpretations through their own training in their own schools. If the reader loves YHWH Elohim with all the heart, and with all the soul, and with all the mind, then the reader will not see YHWH Elohim as a vengeful and merciless Creator but rather the One who is love and loves His creation and people.

Woe unto you, Scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites; for you tithe mint, and anise, and cumin, and have left undone the weightier matters of the Torah: justice, (right judgment), and compassion, (merciful graciousness), and faithfulness-trusting-belief: these things are necessary to be done, (when you insert your spirit of understanding into the letter), and the same you leave undone! (Matthew 23:23).

You do the same as everyone else Teflon John, that is, you insert your own spirit of understanding into the text when you read it through your own eyes. And that same spirit of understanding comes forth in all of your own judgmental inflammatory words with every breath that you spew and in all the words of condemnation which you write to those you hate. One day the Father will be taking His air away from your carcass: and what then will you do? :chuckle:

Did our hero address his own "argument?" Negatory.

Are you taught directly by God, not "men." and that settles it? Women? Aliens?


Identify this "Elohim's text," as we obviously do not want to be a "slave to other men's readings of our favorite texts."


Tell us, con artist-identify this "Elohim's translation," in contrast to what us dummies learn, " men and their translations."


Does it have a name? Where can we get a copy?

Chapter, verse, where a translation cannot be "is given by inspiration."

Identify this true, sound, sure,.... scripture, that God promised to preserve forever. Does it have a name? Where can we get a copy?


We will wait....for an eternity. Bible agnostics/mystics/corrector(in contrast to bible believers) never touch that question.
 

1Mind1Spirit

Literal lunatic
Five Gorilla like fingers tighten and release angrily as the sound of the "My Little Pony" stress ball creeks and squeaks. [MENTION=18375]Evil.Eye.<(I)>[/MENTION] 's brow furrows as a scowl grows across his Neanderthal face. He reads [MENTION=17195]daqq[/MENTION] 's words intensely, then begins to stroke curiously at his beard.

Out of nowhere, laughter erupts from the depths of his dark soul...

He remembers a joke...

Old Man: "walking into hardware store", asks a sales boy; "I would like half of one of those large pieces of plywood over there".

Sales boy: "looking at sign that clearly states 'wood will not be sold in fractions'" replies; "right away sir".

Sales boy: "walking in managers office"; says; "some idiot asked for half a piece of our expensive plywood".

Manager: "pointing frantically behind the sales boy"

Sales boy: "Turns to see the old man standing behind him" and says; "I'm sorry for the delay sir, some idiot wants to buy the other half of your plywood and that is against our store policy".

Old man: "nods and smiles, then goes back to the plywood"

Manager: says; "boy, you are sharp!... Where did you learn that?"

Sales boy: replies; "From Schenectady New York sir. My home town where the women are ugly and the hockey team always wins."

Manager: "Scowling"; "Boy, my wife is from Schenectady.

Sales Boy: "What position did she play"?

Sounds like a shovelful of hockey for sure.;)
 

john w

New member
Hall of Fame
Are you Legion? Who is we? Do you fancy yourself speaking for the all in your imagination?

And therein lies the problem: you seek to exalt yourselves by making this an argument against me.
If only you were waiting only on Elohim Almighty you and yours would have heard and understood.

As I predicted-he won't touch those questions.


Are you taught directly by God, not "men," and that settles it? Women? Aliens?


Identify this "Elohim's text," as we obviously do not want to be a "slave to other men's readings of our favorite texts."


Tell us, con artist-identify this "Elohim's translation," in contrast to what us dummies learn, " men and their translations."


Does it have a name? Where can we get a copy?

Chapter, verse, where a translation cannot be "is given by inspiration."

Identify this true, sound, sure,.... scripture, that God promised to preserve forever. Does it have a name? Where can we get a copy?


We will wait....for an eternity. Bible agnostics/mystics/corrector(in contrast to bible believers) never touch that question.

Not a peep.

Take your seat, bible agnostic/mystic/corrector/rejector.
 

Evil.Eye.<(I)>

BANNED
Banned
I see One Church. To believe in anything else is to believe in an uncorroborated conspiracy theory that began right away, right from the get-go, and caused the truth to die stillborn.

Romans 11:25-36

No squirming in other passages! What is Paul saying? Rightly divide the scripture and note tense, mystery and the grafting verbiege. No theological shield. Hit every verse with an "open" mind and then we can go forward.

# Hint... has the "full number of Gentiles" come in yet?
 

daqq

Well-known member
As I predicted-he won't touch those questions.


Take your seat, bible agnostic/mystic/corrector/rejector.

Exactly as I said, you want others to take their seat and heed your words when I already have a seat at the feet of the Master Teacher Messiah Yeshua. Why do I need you? :chuckle:
 

daqq

Well-known member
Exactly as I said, you want others to take their seat and heed your words when I already have a seat at the feet of the Master Teacher Messiah Yeshua. Why do I need you? :chuckle:

Saint John W Messiah Teacher of the masses? I trow not . . . :rotfl:
 

Jerry Shugart

Well-known member
Why not accept the Church's own testimony on the matter, from the earliest history outside of the New Testament account? If the Church always thought that Acts 2:47 referred to her, then why doubt that it is true?

Let us look at this passage which speaks of an ekklesia, perhaps the most favorite passage of your church:

"And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church (ekklesia); and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven"
(Mt.16:18-19).​

Here the Lord Jesus refers to the "keys of the kingdom of heaven," the same kingdom referred to here by Him:

"From that time Jesus began to preach, and to say, Repent: for the kingdom of heaven is at hand"
(Mt.4:17).​

Since the nation of Israel failed to recognize the Lord Jesus as their promised Messiah the setting up of the earthly kingdom has been postponed until the return of the Lord Jesus to earth:

"And then shall they see the Son of man coming in a cloud with power and great glory. And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh. And he spake to them a parable; Behold the fig tree, and all the trees; When they now shoot forth, ye see and know of your own selves that summer is now nigh at hand. So likewise ye, when ye see these things come to pass, know ye that the kingdom of God is nigh at hand"
(Lk.21:27-31).​

It will not be until the kingdom is brought to earth when the Apostles will "bind on earth" what "shall be bound in heaven." That will not happen until the Apostles will sit upon twelve tribes judging the twelve tribes of Israel in the kingdom:

"That ye may eat and drink at my table in my kingdom, and sit on thrones judging the twelve tribes of Israel" (Lk.22:30).​

This speaks of the millennial reign of the Lord Jesus, the time when Israel will be restored to her previous position of being a special people unto the Lord. Therefore the "keys of the kingdom of heaven" have nothing to do with what is happening now within the Body of Christ.
 

john w

New member
Hall of Fame
Saint John W Messiah Teacher of the masses? I trow not . . . :rotfl:

That is saint John W, the Rifleman, to you, child of the devil bible mystic/agnostic/corrector.


Please give us another "rotfl," Justin B, Jr. Please, teenie bob?

Your page:

This page has had 466 visits

Vs.

The great teacher, saint John W:

This page has had 16,513 visits


Contrasts.
 

john w

New member
Hall of Fame
Exactly as I said, you want others to take their seat and heed your words when I already have a seat at the feet of the Master Teacher Messiah Yeshua. Why do I need you? :chuckle:

As I predicted-he won't touch those questions.


Are you taught directly by God, not "men," and that settles it? Women? Aliens?


Identify this "Elohim's text," as we obviously do not want to be a "slave to other men's readings of our favorite texts."


Tell us, con artist-identify this "Elohim's translation," in contrast to what us dummies learn, " men and their translations."


Does it have a name? Where can we get a copy?

Chapter, verse, where a translation cannot be "is given by inspiration."

Identify this true, sound, sure,.... scripture, that God promised to preserve forever. Does it have a name? Where can we get a copy?


We will wait....for an eternity. Bible agnostics/mystics/corrector(in contrast to bible believers) never touch that question.

Not a peep.

Take your seat, bible agnostic/mystic/corrector/rejector.
 

daqq

Well-known member
Five Gorilla like fingers tighten and release angrily as the sound of the "My Little Pony" stress ball creeks and squeaks. @Evil.Eye.<(I)> 's brow furrows as a scowl grows across his Neanderthal face. He reads @daqq 's words intensely, then begins to stroke curiously at his beard.

Out of nowhere, laughter erupts from the depths of his dark soul...

He remembers a joke...

Old Man: "walking into hardware store", asks a sales boy; "I would like half of one of those large pieces of plywood over there".

Sales boy: "looking at sign that clearly states 'wood will not be sold in fractions'" replies; "right away sir".

Sales boy: "walking in managers office"; says; "some idiot asked for half a piece of our expensive plywood".

Manager: "pointing frantically behind the sales boy"

Sales boy: "Turns to see the old man standing behind him" and says; "I'm sorry for the delay sir, some idiot wants to buy the other half of your plywood and that is against our store policy".

Old man: "nods and smiles, then goes back to the plywood"

Manager: says; "boy, you are sharp!... Where did you learn that?"

Sales boy: replies; "From Schenectady New York sir. My home town where the women are ugly and the hockey team always wins."

Manager: "Scowling"; "Boy, my wife is from Schenectady.

Sales Boy: "What position did she play"?

Who I know buys the whole sheet and cuts it into twelve puzzle pieces with the finger of Elohim.
At the consummation of your age the messengers come and collect the scraps for the bonfire.

:Nineveh:
 

daqq

Well-known member
quote_icon.png
Originally Posted by john w

Take your seat

No body needs your permission.

It does not realize that whosoever puts himself in the midst of the great congregation makes himself an anti-Messiah, (that is, standing in the holy place, in the place of Messiah).
 
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