marhig
Well-known member
I'm remembering off the top of my head, and I'm close enough. All you can do is nit pick because you don't know the love and mercy of God.
God is love, hopefully one day you'll realise this!
TERROR IS A SWORD OF JUDGEMENT.
- Thread starter Truster
- Start date
I'm remembering off the top of my head, and I'm close enough. All you can do is nit pick because you don't know the love and mercy of God.
God is love, hopefully one day you'll realise this!
What you call nitpicking is actually me pointing out how you are twisting scripture.
nikolai_42
Well-known member
I believe what Truster says is true. God's ways are past finding out and they are beyond us. When they seem cruel, it is because we don't understand them and are either in contradiction with them or just too focused on our own feelings. So I get the resistance to being sentimental - it can deflect from the urgent need to call sinners to repentance. But at the same time I realize that God sent human messengers to be fools for His word and His name. We are not Him - even the most consecrated apostle bows in fear before the Almighty. He is not a man. Even the Savior set aside much of that majesty and glory to make men see what the love of God looked like in flesh. Yet the love of God was even rejected then (John 1:11 and John 6:66 come to mind). So to think things have changed with man's heart is foolishness. We can make the message seem compassionate all we want, but in the end a man will either walk after God or walk away from Him based on the reality of who He is and if He has changed that man's heart. There is no other way and never will the unvarnished truth be acceptable to any man who knows not God. But (again), that doesn't mean we are to be aloof. Paul wished himself accursed for his people after the flesh (if it would have saved them). He had a real love for them given him by God. And if we are children of our Father in heaven, then we will bless those that curse us and pray for them that despitefully use us. Even praying for those involved in this attack in Manchester. Praying for repentance is not a presumptious thing. Terror is one of the things that God promised His people if they do not repent. Leviticus 26:15-39 details what God Himself would do to bring about repentance in them. And to those that don't think this applies today, I would be cautious about thinking that since verses 16-20 (or thereabouts) seem to be bang on when it comes to judgment on the US (terror, sickness, fear, paranoia, being ruled over by those that hate you, foreigners consuming your production...). God is the same yesterday, today and forever.
So in my mind, the lesson is that these things should not make us simply more confirmed in God's judgments but more active in seeking repentance for ourselves and others.
EDIT : The words of George Whifield ring constantly in my ear these days : You blame me for weeping, but how can I help it when you will not weep for yourselves, though your immortal souls are on the verge of destruction? That is the need of the hour. Not weeping because of tragedy (losing children etc.) but weeping over the iniquity of so many. He is also quoted thus : If you will not weep for your sins and your crimes against a Holy God, George Whitefield will weep for you
marhig
Well-known member
Nothing I have said there has twisted the scriptures. You are just being petty. As usual!
Anyway, I've got better things to do than listen to your twisted rants. I'm off be with my grandchildren, and my heart goes out to all those who have lost their families in Manchester last night. May God give them the strength to bare what they are going through.
You just love making yourself look good.
marhig
Well-known member
This world is full of evil, and the works of it. And Satan has control over the flesh. Until God comes along and Christ in his people bring the love and life of God and Christ to others. With the hope that Christ can save as many as will listen.
I believe that God has control over everything, but he is not the one behind those who murder through terrorism. Satan is in their hearts and they are doing his will, and my heart goes out to all those people who are suffering!
Ok I'm off now.
nikolai_42
Well-known member
God may (or may not) do these things as primary agent. While Satan was the one who was given free reign over Job (short of taking his life), God was the one who directed him there. God allowed it and God bears a certain responsibility as the Sovereign of the Universe. And when you read Ezekiel 9, it becomes apparent that there is that which God does which man will never like. Isaiah 45:7 says God makes peace and creates evil. Life is His to take in any way He sees fit. So for God to kill is not moral evil, but it is calamitous. And so there is nothing amiss with saying God does these things. If He doesn't have final say, then He isn't Sovereign. And we can't be certain of what the Psalmist said :
Surely the wrath of man shall praise thee: the remainder of wrath shalt thou restrain.
Psalm 76:10
But since all flesh is grass, this should be something that causes us to fear
Wherefore let him that thinketh he standeth take heed lest he fall.
I Corinthians 10:12
Isaiah 66:16
For the LORD will execute judgment by fire And by His sword on all flesh, And those slain by the LORD will be many.
Isaiah 34:5
For My sword is satiated in heaven, Behold it shall descend for judgment upon Edom And upon the people whom I have devoted to destruction.
Deuteronomy 32:41
If I sharpen My flashing sword, And My hand takes hold on justice, I will render vengeance on My adversaries, And I will repay those who hate Me.
For the LORD will execute judgment by fire And by His sword on all flesh, And those slain by the LORD will be many.
Isaiah 34:5
For My sword is satiated in heaven, Behold it shall descend for judgment upon Edom And upon the people whom I have devoted to destruction.
Deuteronomy 32:41
If I sharpen My flashing sword, And My hand takes hold on justice, I will render vengeance on My adversaries, And I will repay those who hate Me.
Deuteronomy 32:25
'Outside the sword will bereave, And inside terror-- Both young man and virgin, The nursling with the man of grey hair.
Deuteronomy 32:42
'I will make My arrows drunk with blood, And My sword will devour flesh, With the blood of the slain and the captives, From the long-haired leaders of the enemy.'
Ezekiel 21:5
"Thus all flesh will know that I, the LORD, have drawn My sword out of its sheath. It will not return to its sheath again."'
'Outside the sword will bereave, And inside terror-- Both young man and virgin, The nursling with the man of grey hair.
Deuteronomy 32:42
'I will make My arrows drunk with blood, And My sword will devour flesh, With the blood of the slain and the captives, From the long-haired leaders of the enemy.'
Ezekiel 21:5
"Thus all flesh will know that I, the LORD, have drawn My sword out of its sheath. It will not return to its sheath again."'
"All that was left of the bomber were his legs".
In the blink of an eye, he left time and entered eternity. His awareness was still intact and so he would have immediately realised that everything he’d been told and taught in life was a lie.
His heart would have dropped into despair and that feeling would only get worse as the blackness and the terror of what was happening sank in.
The pain he feels has nothing to do with bodily nerves and was far worse than anything he could have been prepared for.
The immediate loneliness is amplified by extreme guilt and equally extreme sorrow for himself as he continually weeps and is gnashing his teeth. Every sense of dread, terror, anxiety, fear and pain will be amplified to a level unimaginable and without a single glimmer of hope or respite. Nothing to look forward to, no company to confide in. Just everlasting turmoil, pain and unbelievable suffering in him and all around him. No quiet corner of the mind into which he could seek the comfort of a single thought that is not wrapped in and amplified by anguish without hope...
In the blink of an eye, he left time and entered eternity. His awareness was still intact and so he would have immediately realised that everything he’d been told and taught in life was a lie.
His heart would have dropped into despair and that feeling would only get worse as the blackness and the terror of what was happening sank in.
The pain he feels has nothing to do with bodily nerves and was far worse than anything he could have been prepared for.
The immediate loneliness is amplified by extreme guilt and equally extreme sorrow for himself as he continually weeps and is gnashing his teeth. Every sense of dread, terror, anxiety, fear and pain will be amplified to a level unimaginable and without a single glimmer of hope or respite. Nothing to look forward to, no company to confide in. Just everlasting turmoil, pain and unbelievable suffering in him and all around him. No quiet corner of the mind into which he could seek the comfort of a single thought that is not wrapped in and amplified by anguish without hope...
It might be obvious that I have given the doctrines of hell and eternity some serious thought. This gives me a heightened sense of what I’ve been saved from and increases my gratefulness. It gives me a sense of what Messiah suffered on my behalf when the Eternal Father poured out every last drop of His furious and vengeful wrath upon Messiah Yah Shua as He hanged from that tree in darkness, forsaken of the Father's fellowship and love because of my sin.
"Unto him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood, And hath made us kings and priests unto God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen."
marhig
Well-known member
Yes God did direct Satan to Job, but Job was a strong man of God and he was being tried by fire and tested. God knew the heart of Job, and he knew that he was strong. That's totally different to a terrorist blowing himself up in a crowd of children!
Do you believe that there are spiritual meanings to the Bible? God is Spirit and Jesus said, the words I speak they are Spirit and they are life! Many of the things Jesus spoke of were in parables or in analogies etc. He wasn't of this world. For instance the Bible says that the sword is the spirit, the word of God. And some things are explained, but many aren't.
You have to remember that God is love, and one of his commandments of thou shalt not kill! God doesn't change! So those who kill are doing the works of the devil, not God! There are different ways to kill and destroy, God uses the Holy Spirit for this purpose, to put to death and destroy evil.
God made this world beautiful, and everything that he has created speaks of him, everything! Like the moon coming out in the darkness, is like a man of God who reflects the light of God to those who walk in the darkness, but that light isn't like walking in the day, where we see everything clearly and not partially like we do at night.
God speaks to us through everything he has created, and Satan through the flesh of man destroys. That's all he has a hold of, the flesh, thats why we are to be put to death in our flesh once we are born of God. God wants our flesh gone and for us not to live by the works of the flesh and world, but to come out of the world and walk in the Spirit, living by the will of God and denying ourselves, baring our cross worshipping God in Spirit and in truth, following Jesus!
God said to Satan when he deceived Eve, on your belly you shall go, and dust shall be your food all the days of your life! What is the dust? Our flesh! We go back to the dust when we die, but our Spirit goes to God. So when God said to the devil that dust shall be the food of his days, he meant that satan will go on his belly (the lower parts touching the dust) and he will live off our flesh, only Satan's days are full of darkness. God is light and he lifts is our of the dust and brings us to life with his breath of life which is the Holy Spirit, and brings us out of darkness into his glorious light though our Lord Jesus Christ. We are brought from death to life, risen with Christ and we are then born of God and walk in the Spirit. We should then love one another, forgive those that hate us bless those that curse us and pray for those who dispitefuly use us, if Christ is in us by the power of the Spirit, then his love and life should be seen in and through us and as the Spirit puts us to death, then the life of Christ should be seen more and more in us as we die, so we must decease and he must increase in and through us. And we will then care for everyone, everyone we meet is our neighbour and we are to bring the love of God and the life of Christ to them. And none of this is possible without God and Christ, because without the grace of God, and without the love that our Lord Jesus Christ has for us, we would be still dead to God, living in our flesh and putting ourselves and this world before him but through faith by the grace of God, through our Lord Jesus Christ we can be saved if we truly believe and have true faith!
Those who are truly born of God, and truly love him, live by his will and obey his word. And they are those who walk in the Spirit and worship God in Spirit and in truth and they truly follow our Lord Jesus Christ and bare witness to the truth.
God is love and light, and there is no darkness in him at all, no evil and no wickedness. That all belongs to Satan and this world, and he is the Prince of it. That's why Jesus said that Prince of this world comes and he has nothing in me, and Jesus also said that he was not of this world, and neither are those who are truly born of God and belong to Christ. This world means nothing to them. We live by the will of God.
We can't serve God and mammon!
Many people might think that the bomber gets what he deserved because of the wicked act he committed.
Those that were destroyed were also wicked and so the same judgement awaited them. "That be far from thee to do after this manner, to slay the righteous with the wicked: and that the righteous should be as the wicked, that be far from thee: Shall not the Judge of all the earth do right?" Genesis 18:25
We know that the just are not destroyed with the wicked in judgement.
Approximately 1.8 people die every second of the day. That means they leave time and enter eternity. Based on the words spoken by Messiah concerning the strait gate we know that few find it but many enter in at the wide gate that leads to destruction.
Those that were destroyed were also wicked and so the same judgement awaited them. "That be far from thee to do after this manner, to slay the righteous with the wicked: and that the righteous should be as the wicked, that be far from thee: Shall not the Judge of all the earth do right?" Genesis 18:25
We know that the just are not destroyed with the wicked in judgement.
Approximately 1.8 people die every second of the day. That means they leave time and enter eternity. Based on the words spoken by Messiah concerning the strait gate we know that few find it but many enter in at the wide gate that leads to destruction.
nikolai_42
Well-known member
Who killed Ananias and Sapphira? What are we told about Jesus being killed?
Him, being delivered by the determinate counsel and foreknowledge of God, ye have taken, and by wicked hands have crucified and slain:
Acts 2:23
What did Job say about what we know was "done" by Satan?
...Naked came I out of my mother's womb, and naked shall I return thither: the Lord gave, and the Lord hath taken away; blessed be the name of the Lord.
In all this Job sinned not, nor charged God foolishly.
Job 1:21-22
What does God say to Israel?
See now that I, even I, am he, and there is no god with me: I kill, and I make alive; I wound, and I heal: neither is there any that can deliver out of my hand.
For I lift up my hand to heaven, and say, I live for ever.
If I whet my glittering sword, and mine hand take hold on judgment; I will render vengeance to mine enemies, and will reward them that hate me.
I will make mine arrows drunk with blood, and my sword shall devour flesh; and that with the blood of the slain and of the captives, from the beginning of revenges upon the enemy.
Deuteronomy 32:39-42
You seem to be saying that the way someone dies determines whether it was done by Satan or not (or who?). I say it is all in the Lord's hands (ultimately).
No one takes the keys from Christ.
You've never heard of metaphor.
The friends of one "victim" are saying that he was in the wrong place at the wrong time. Actually, he was in the right place at the right time and so was everyone else.
The media is very quiet about the children who were trampled in the self centered rush to get out. ME FIRST is the attitude that calls on judgement to fall.
The media is very quiet about the children who were trampled in the self centered rush to get out. ME FIRST is the attitude that calls on judgement to fall.
marhig
Well-known member
Who killed Ananias and Sapphira? God did, and God has every right to take life, because he gave it! But we aren't!
God said thou shalt not kill, so we have a choice, we can either kill or not. If we kill, then the blood of that person is on our hands and we are judged on that. Because we have taken a life. Just like it was for Cain. God gave a place to go in the old testament for anyone who killed by accident, but, if we kill wifully, then we are judged on that because we have listened to Satan and taken a life!
God has control of everything, and I believe that he protects his people, but this world is full of sin, and if we disobey God and kill when he's told us not to, then we are listening to the devil, just as the suicide bomber was in Manchester and God will be his judge. If he was meant to kill those people because of Gods will, then he won't be punished. And it is then right to commit terrorist acts because it is Gods will. Those who believe this, then support terrorism. Because they say they are doing it for God! No they're not. They are listening to their father the devil when they do such things!
Jesus said he does not belong to this world, thus this world is not a good place. If the Prince of darkness is here, then hell is also here too. Hell is in the hearts of those that murder and cause distruction, and heaven is in the hearts of those who love God, follow Jesus, and bring love, peace, forgiveness and mercy to others!
If it was the will of God for us to kill one another, then he wouldn't have given the commandment against it, would he?
Jesus said this just before he was crucified
Luke 22
Then Jesus said unto the chief priests, and captains of the temple, and the elders, which were come to him, Be ye come out, as against a thief, with swords and staves?When I was daily with you in the temple, ye stretched forth no hands against me: but this is your hour, and the power of darkness.
It was their hour, and what they were doing was by the power of darkness, they had no light. They tried to put the light out at the cross and failed! They killed the Prince of life the Holy son of the living God, through the power of darkness! There is no darkness in God whatsoever! He is light!
It even says in what you have posted, that God foreknew what they would do, but Jesus was willing for it, and it also said that they were wicked, and by wicked hands they killed him, not by God's hand, wicked ones, God is not wicked, there is no wickedness in him! Jesus said, you are doing the works of your father the devil when he referred to them trying to kill him, and he said, Moses has a law, and you do not keep it, why are you trying to kill me? (John 7 and John 8)
John 7
Did not Moses give you the law, and yet none of you keepeth the law? Why go ye about to kill me?
John 8
I know that ye are Abraham's seed; but ye seek to kill me, because my word hath no place in you.*I speak that which I have seen with my Father: and ye do that which ye have seen with your father
And further down
Jesus said unto them, If God were your Father, ye would love me: for I proceeded forth and came from God; neither came I of myself, but he sent me. Why do ye not understand my speech?even because ye cannot hear my word. Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it. And because I tell you the truth, ye believe me not. Which of you convinceth me of sin? And if I say the truth, why do ye not believe me? He that is of God heareth God's words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God.
God knew all about Jesus being killed at the hands of wicked men, and Jesus was willing to bare it, he came into this world to bare witness to the truth, and he was willing to take whatever Satan did to him, including crucifying him, and he didn't fight back. He bore his cross and overcame evil with goodness, love, mercy and forgiveness and he overcame Satan. But first he had to finished the work that his father gave him to do. And he did. And then it was the hour of the wicked, the hour of the power of darkness, when they murdered Christ Jesus our saviour!
But Satan couldn't kill him, only his flesh was put to death, he is now exalted to the highest in heaven and he overcame the world and he can strengthen us to do so to.
Paul said this
2 Thessalonians 2
Who both killed the Lord Jesus, and their own prophets, and have persecuted us; and they please not God, and are contrary to all men:
They pleased not God in killing the prophets and the Lord Jesus, so why would it be God's will to do so? If it doesn't please him to kill them?
He also said this
1 Corinthians 2
But we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, even the hidden wisdom, which God ordained before the world unto our glory: Which none of the princes of this world knew: for had they known it, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.
Peter said this
Acts 3
But ye denied the Holy One and the Just, and desired a murderer to be granted unto you; And killed the Prince of life, whom God hath raised from the dead; whereof we are witnesses.
And when Stephen was being stoned, he said this
Acts 6
Ye stiffnecked and uncircumcised in heart and ears, ye do always resist the Holy Ghost: as your fathers did, so do ye. Which of the prophets have not your fathers persecuted? and they have slain them which shewed before of the coming of the Just One; OF WHOM YE HAVE BEEN NOW THE BETRAYERS AND MURDERERS: Who have received the law by the disposition of angels, AND HAVE NOT KEPT IT!
Everything is under God's control, but this world is full of darkness, and those who kill are full of darkness too and they go against God. We have freewill, we can either listen to God and obey him and not kill, or listen to Satan and take a life! it is wrong to take the life of another and when we do so, we listen to Satan! To kill is wrong before God, God has a hedge about those who belong to him, and they can't be touched until it is their time to be either tried out put to death, but Satan is over the hearts of those in the flesh, and he is in those that commit murder, and those that murder and take a life do not please God! It is wrong to kill, and those do so are listening to Satan and they are under the power of darkness. God is light and love and those who belong to him will be full of love and compassion! He said thou shalt not kill. And we are to obey that and do his will!