So, what do you really hope to gain by posting on a 'Religious Forum?' Do you believe in your heart that you'll be able to change the minds and hearts of Christians to suddenly grasp Atheism?
STEPHEN HAWKING IS A BELIEVER TODAY.
- Thread starter Grosnick Marowbe
- Start date
- Status
So, what do you really hope to gain by posting on a 'Religious Forum?' Do you believe in your heart that you'll be able to change the minds and hearts of Christians to suddenly grasp Atheism?
Your opinion is of no consequence to 'Old GM.' Why you bother, is a deep mystery that could quite possibly overfill one gigantic, Metaphorical Maelstrom.
I'm not aimimg to convert anyone. Christianity is dying all by itself, and my efforts are unlikely to hasten its demise by any large percentage.
But I do care about what can reasonably be said to be true, and it is not reasonable to claim the title or contents of the OP in this thread, and hope I have demonstrated that.
Stuart
Read Camus and understand that life is indeed absurd, until you factor that in to the purpose you make for your own life. Then you can generate real meaning.
Stuart
Nothing begat everything is almost certainly true. Matter and energy are borrowed gravitational energy from the inflation of space-time at the Big Bang. As Hawking has been saying, the laws of science appear to lead automatically to what we see around us in this universe. So there is rhyme, and rhythm: the real mystery for Einstein was in why the whole universe seems to run according to rhyme and reason, expressed as the laws of physics.
Einstein's god was a metaphor for the fact that the universe can be understood, and Hawking used a similar god metaphor. That's not a real being of any kind, and it's not even a god that kicks things off. The laws of science are the god, and they arise as natural properties of space-time, and work without being directed.
New stars are forming on their own the whole time, just as many stars are disappearing all the time. New planets are forming right now around stars in other parts of our galaxy, and in other galaxies, probably too many to count. A giant star forms from hydrogen, burns its fuel quickly, dies young in a massive collapse and explosion, and that produces the shockwave that pushes more hydrogen together to make a new star, and also provides the heavy elements that go into orbit around that new star. An accretion disc of dust and gas makes solid planets near the star and gas planets further out.
Life starts as non-life, just like it says in Genesis. The first cell is unknown; we really cannot know what it was, but we know our cells today are much more complex and use different biochemistry because genes can be mutated and selected for by the test of survival and reproduction, obviously. Mutation is random but natural selection is very highly directing. Evolution by natural selection is a brilliantly effective ratchet, that increases complexity tiny step by tiny step. If there is life anywhere else in the universe, it will have also arisen by a process of natural selection, which completely explains biological complexity.
Those accounts, from different branches of science, may turn out not to be 100% right. But they won't ever turn out to be 100% wrong. There are major problems even knowing what the universe is made of. But everything from nothing is indeed it: the total energy content of the universe is zero. We live on gravitational credit. If we go into a Big Crunch then it all gets paid back again very quickly. But it looks like there will be only expansion ahead for the universe.
Stuart
Reasons for Atheists to post on a Religion Forum;
1) To disrupt?
2) Angry at their Creator?
3) Searching for truth?
4) They're just trolling?
5) They're pretending to be an Atheist?
6) They have an immature mindset?
7) They hope to sway the minds and hearts of those who are sitting on the fence?
8) They're argumentative types looking to engage in 'Verbal Fisticuffs?'
9) They're bored with their mundane lives?
10)They're hoping to appear to be the 'Intellectual Superior?'
11)They're people who were disillusioned by a church in their past?
12)They have a problem with authority figures in their life, possibly related to problems with their Father, in the past or present?
13)They don't particularly do well with rules, laws, and the like?
14)They're scared about having to face death at some point?
15)They're fearful of judgement?
Well, those are 15 possible reasons for Atheists to be drawn to a 'Religion Site?' There may be other reasons, no doubt. Any of these possible reasons ring a bell for any of you Atheists out there?
1) To disrupt?
2) Angry at their Creator?
3) Searching for truth?
4) They're just trolling?
5) They're pretending to be an Atheist?
6) They have an immature mindset?
7) They hope to sway the minds and hearts of those who are sitting on the fence?
8) They're argumentative types looking to engage in 'Verbal Fisticuffs?'
9) They're bored with their mundane lives?
10)They're hoping to appear to be the 'Intellectual Superior?'
11)They're people who were disillusioned by a church in their past?
12)They have a problem with authority figures in their life, possibly related to problems with their Father, in the past or present?
13)They don't particularly do well with rules, laws, and the like?
14)They're scared about having to face death at some point?
15)They're fearful of judgement?
Well, those are 15 possible reasons for Atheists to be drawn to a 'Religion Site?' There may be other reasons, no doubt. Any of these possible reasons ring a bell for any of you Atheists out there?
16) It is important to stand up for what can reasonably be said to be true.
Stuart
I really couldn't get past the first sentence, although, it's not your fault. I abhor lengthy posts regarding anything. However, I was able to get the jest of what you were proposing. The problem is, you and your ilk are offering up, theories, conjecture, and basic generalizations. There's absolutely no concrete evidence to back up anything you have to present? Christianity, is about a 'Spiritual Relationship' between God and ourselves. A Christian, hears the Gospel and suddenly is faced with two choices; the first choice is, to reject what they've learned. The second choice is to, embrace what they've learned and place all of their faith in the 'Ascended Lord Jesus Christ.' It's not just a thought process, mindset, or intellectual acceptance of a grouping of ideas, theories, and speculation, it's a 'Spiritual Process' that is orchestrated by the Holy Spirit. And, as a consequence the hearer of the Gospel is inspired by the Holy Spirit and is subsequently, baptized into the 'Body of Christ' by the work of the Holy Spirit. This process isn't the same as the 'Water Baptism' used in the four Gospels; Matthew through John. I first heard the 'Gospel' when I was about fourteen or fifteen-years-old. That was back in 1963-1964. I decided to place my faith in Christ shortly after hearing the Message. Now, over 50 years later, I still have that same faith in Christ.
But, for what reason have you decided to dedicate your time to this Forum and this particular thread?
Well, sorry about the 'lengthy post', but I was aiming to show you that you are wrong about having no reasons but you are right about everything from nothing. Don't forget that you would advocate me reading Genesis, which in its entirety provides less detail than I provided in a few paragraphs. And yes, everything I wrote is supported by many converging lines of concrete evidence. But this isn't the place for the details. If you want those you only have to ask. I have to say that any person who is really curious about all the possibilities would already know that stuff I typed. Even if you rejected the scientific explanations for our existence, it would do well to at least know what they say first, right?
I see. Can the claims of christianity that go with all that be reasonably said to be true?
Stuart
Do you mean which reasons from those 16? Sometimes more than one.
But, do you think it is a good thing or not that atheists post here?
Stuart
There's always a 'reason' why people choose to offer-up long periods of their time. They must have some kind of goal, agenda, hope, or expected result. Otherwise, most people aren't that generous with their time. They have to be looking for some form of satisfaction.
That's a decision 'everyone' has to make on their own. I was/am totally convinced that the Gospel is more than reliable. To me, it's the ONLY truth regarding all 'Spiritual Matters.'
I don't have any problem with it. I suppose we've all been skeptical at one time or another?
In this age of the Internet, I suppose we, at times, lose ourselves in our own anonymity. We forget that the people we're posting back and forth with, are living, breathing human beings with similar frailties, shortcomings, frustrations, anger, animosity, etc. And, on the other side of the proverbial coin, they can be fragile, upset, hurt, and traumatized by what others say to them, in anger.
Ok, well not to be outdone then, I should add that I have an equivalent statement of 'spirituality' that includes part of the meaning I have made for my own life: I am a part of the universe that allows it to understand itself.
Of course there is the whole sense of the numinous, the astonishment at the crystalline logic of Bach or the elegance of a well-played cover drive (we play cricket in the former British Empire); the breathtaking inner workings of a living cell or a pile of 30 trillion of them making up a human being; the really brain-stretching idea of wave-particle duality; the brilliance of Shakespeare in summing up the human condition; or the gravitational death-throes of two black holes eating one another. There is much in 'spiritual' feeling that involves pressing different chemical buttons in the brain, but that is not to belittle human experience.
The most important thing to try and understand is the complexity and frailness of the human brain: people attribute so much to 'spooky' coincidences without really understanding probability, or strange visions and sounds, when we know that the brain has to invent most of the impression it gives us of the world, just so it can keep up with the data processing. I think to understand the brain might be an important step in understanding what makes people perceive their sense of what they call 'spiritual'. It is quite astonishing that christianity can make people literally believe that a man walked again after being executed. It's not true of course, but it is fascinating that people have been willing to die for that claim and other claims that are equally improbable or impossible.
Stuart
It's extremely easy to attack someone you don't really know. Many people who post on Forums, sometimes become more aggressive and angry than they are in their personal lives. I think most people like a good battle of the wits and a round of 'Verbal Fisticuffs.' And, forums are a place to release our built-up frustrations on posters we don't know. The fact is, we might actually get along well with people we otherwise, fight with on a Forum? It's hard to tell, for certain?
Yet, one man's reality, is another man's fantasy. There are millions of professing Christians on planet earth and, there are millions of non-Christians. Each group has invested their all, in what they have choosen to believe or not believe. Not everyone who calls themself a Christian is, in fact, a true Christian. A true Christian today is someone who has heard the Gospel that was given to the Apostle Paul on the 'Road to Damascus' and has made the choice to place ALL of their faith, in Christ and His death and subsequent, resurrection. Like I've previously mentioned, to be forgiven of all their sins and inherit eternal life one MUST be baptized into the 'Body of Christ' and indwelt by the Holy Spirit in order to be saved and spend eternity in Heaven. The whole 'PROCESS' is orchestrated by the Holy Spirit and without the Holy Spirit, no one is capable of becoming a 'Child of God' and entering eternal life.
Since I created this thread, permit me to go off of subject for a moment or two? Have you noticed or been aware of the fact about Hillary's physical problems? While she was in India, she fell a couple of times down a few steps and fell in a bathtub and broke her wrist. Those recent occurrences combined with her past coughing spells, rather odd head shaking, going limp and needing the help of others to get her body into a Van, the list goes on, make it look as if she's losing her muscle coordination along with her mental deterioration. Her never-ceasing, poor loser rants don't speak well of her.
She might just have some form of M.S. or other weakening muscle degeneration? She has difficulties navigating her body to do what her mind is directing her to do. Thus, she stumbles, falls, losses her balance, and has, what appears to be, mental agitation, angry outbursts, and uncontrollable fits of rage. She's not a well person, mentally or physically.
She might just have some form of M.S. or other weakening muscle degeneration? She has difficulties navigating her body to do what her mind is directing her to do. Thus, she stumbles, falls, losses her balance, and has, what appears to be, mental agitation, angry outbursts, and uncontrollable fits of rage. She's not a well person, mentally or physically.
God's Truth
New member
- Status