Prove That Sunday Is The Christian Sabbath

[TrevorL]

Greetings again clefty,

Paul would have used past tense if the Law was done away with...he didn’t because it isn’t...it however still can’t do away with sin or make someone perfect...BTW but still points to the One Who can
Oh and the Sabbath is in the 10 and not the ceremonial laws...

The new covenant replaces the old Mosaic covenant. At the heart of the old covenant was the 10 commandments written in stone. When Paul wrote, the old covenant was decaying and waxing old.
Hebrews 8:6-13 (KJV): 6 But now hath he obtained a more excellent ministry, by how much also he is the mediator of a better covenant, which was established upon better promises. 7 For if that first covenant had been faultless, then should no place have been sought for the second. 8 For finding fault with them, he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah: 9 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they continued not in my covenant, and I regarded them not, saith the Lord. 10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will putc my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people: 12 And they shall not teach every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest. 12 For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more. 13 In that he saith, A new covenant, he hath made the first old. Now that which decayeth and waxeth old is ready to vanish away.

Kind regards
Trevor

 

[clefty]

Greetings again clefty,
The new covenant replaces the old Mosaic covenant. At the heart of the old covenant was the 10 commandments written in stone. When Paul wrote, the old covenant was decaying and waxing old.
Hebrews 8:6-13 (KJV): 6 But now hath he obtained a more excellent ministry, by how much also he is the mediator of a better covenant, which was established upon better promises. 7 For if that first covenant had been faultless, then should no place have been sought for the second. 8 For finding fault with them, he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah: 9 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they continued not in my covenant, and I regarded them not, saith the Lord. 10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will putc my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people: 12 And they shall not teach every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest. 12 For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more. 13 In that he saith, A new covenant, he hath made the first old. Now that which decayeth and waxeth old is ready to vanish away.

Kind regards
Trevor

Good a new covenant...but which Laws are put into the minds written on the hearts? Just 9/10ths...of course all but the Sabbath one right?

This was before Jesus so you cant say His laws (as if they are different and contrary to His Father’s)...and the Father was speaking here in Jeremiah yes?

This new covenant was christened with a toast to a room full of jews...and then signed by His blood and sealed with His death (NO CHANGING NOW OK) and guess what? His followers still kept Sabbath, festival (Pentecost the “birthday” of the church which was in the wilderness...) and kosher even...

This new covenant allows us to break the top 10 list does it?

Paul insists a sabbath keeping remains for His people...Heb 4:9 even exemplifying it by instructing gentiles to return the next Sabbath for more teaching...notice He did not have them come back the next day or meet elsewhere for Eucharist and then Ham dinner...to celebrate the resurrection...NO he told the gentiles to come back next week Sabbath...

Or did Isaiah LIE when he said in the New Heaven and New Earth from new moon to new moon and from Sabbath to Sabbath all would worship...?

 

[WatchmanOnTheWall]

Even Double posting now...ok thought we could be reasonable but you are way too ahead of me on all this and unwilling to actually read or understand what I am getting at here in this thread...

See you on your lunar sabbath thread...

Avoiding the questions shows that you don't know when the Sabbath is: "The Roman Julian (Caesar) calendar that was created by Greek mathematician Sosigenes in 45BC which was implemented on the 1 January and was a Friday, but what was the day before this date? And on what calendar?"

 

[WatchmanOnTheWall]

What calendar did Jesus use and how has it changed the weekly order of days?

Jesus used God's ancient Solar-lunar Calendar not Julia Caesar's pagan Roman calendar. There are 5 different calendars to consider in this study:

1. The Gregorian Calendar
2. The Julian Calendar
3. The Ancient Roman 8 day week calendar
4. The Hillel II modern Jewish calendar
5. God's ancient solar-lunar calendar.

There's been hundred's of different calendars throughout history, if you want to know when the Sabbath really is i have a thread about it:
http://theologyonline.com/showthread.php?127270-When-is-the-Sabbath/page7

 

[TrevorL]

Greetings again clefty,

Good a new covenant...but which Laws are put into the minds written on the hearts? Just 9/10ths...of course all but the Sabbath one right?
This was before Jesus so you cant say His laws (as if they are different and contrary to His Father’s)...and the Father was speaking here in Jeremiah yes?

I have already given an example of the new covenant written on the heart versus the old on stone in Matthew 11:25-30. Under the first they rested from physical work for one day out of seven, and were supposed to spend that day in worship. Under Christ and the new covenant we find rest from our labours and our burdens, now and for ever. These labours and burdens that are transferred to Christ, contain the full range of problems that we encounter, including sin and death. Few Sabbath keepers under the Law obtained this rest through faith.

Paul insists a sabbath keeping remains for His people...Heb 4:9 even exemplifying it by instructing gentiles to return the next Sabbath for more teaching...notice He did not have them come back the next day or meet elsewhere for Eucharist and then Ham dinner...to celebrate the resurrection...NO he told the gentiles to come back next week Sabbath...

Yes, Hebrews 4:9 is speaking about the true Sabbath, the same as Matthew 11:25-30. Perhaps you need to consider both Hebrews 3 and 4 in more detail, as it gives the full range of the true Sabbath teaching, even comparing the true Sabbath with the rest that Israel failed to attain under Joshua. Yet when they entered the land Israel under Joshua did keep the seventh day Sabbath. Also you are referring to Acts 13, when Paul visited and preached to Jew and Gentile in the synagogue at Antioch. This was not for the weekly bread and wine remembrance of the death and resurrection of Jesus that the baptised believers kept.

Or did Isaiah LIE when he said in the New Heaven and New Earth from new moon to new moon and from Sabbath to Sabbath all would worship...?

Yes, but not in this present Gentile era. During the 1000 years the nations will have many aspects reintroduced, and these will also be centred in Jerusalem when true worship will be restored and the Temple built Isaiah 2:1-4.

Kind regards
Trevor

 

[clefty]

Avoiding the questions shows that you don't know when the Sabbath is: "The Roman Julian (Caesar) calendar that was created by Greek mathematician Sosigenes in 45BC which was implemented on the 1 January and was a Friday, but what was the day before this date? And on what calendar?"

Not avoiding just ignoring lol...I did say see you on your lunar sabbath thread which I expect you to bump and update...

This calendar was itself a revision from the Egyptian one...now how old is that?...something about an exodus? And reset?

But like I said thought we would take it one step at a time...Sunday is not Sabbath step one...

Pagans may very well have developed calanders to counterfeit the Sabbath count etc...all good stuff for your constantly updated thread I am sure...

 

[clefty]

Greetings again clefty, I have already given an example of the new covenant written on the heart versus the old on stone in Matthew 11:25-30.

careful...Yah’s Laws are written on the minds and hearts not the covenant...there is a difference

Under the first they rested from physical work for one day out of seven, and were supposed to spend that day in worship.

Under Christ and the new covenant we find rest from our labours and our burdens, now and for ever. These labours and burdens that are transferred to Christ, contain the full range of problems that we encounter, including sin and death.

so we dont have to work anymore? The curse of the ground is lifted? He became a day on the calendar? Well I have heard rumored He is bread too...literally...

Why not work all seven days then? Why choose a day at all to worship...worship everyday right?

Oh except we are to be more like Him not less...and well He kept Sabbaths...not first daze

Few Sabbath keepers under the Law obtained this rest through faith.

all obtained this rest through faith...in fact they were given mana...food and rest before the Law...see? They were faithful in following the ONE who provided rest...and then they were given the Law at Sinai which contained this day of rest for both native and foreigner alike...

Yes, Hebrews 4:9 is speaking about the true Sabbath,

sabbath KEEPING...the seventh day...not just rest every day

the same as Matthew 11:25-30. Perhaps you need to consider both Hebrews 3 and 4 in more detail, as it gives the full range of the true Sabbath teaching, even comparing the true Sabbath with the rest that Israel failed to attain under Joshua.

you mean the rest of entering the promised land...where they didnt have to work anymore?...really?

Yet when they entered the land Israel under Joshua did keep the seventh day Sabbath.

yup cuz they were still having to work...

Also you are referring to Acts 13, when Paul visited and preached to Jew and Gentile in the synagogue at Antioch.

yup...as was his custom

This was not for the weekly bread and wine remembrance of the death and resurrection of Jesus that the baptised believers kept.

breaking bread yes...Lord’s supper yes...but the weekly eucharist? Still not invented at this time...built by the tradition later

Yes, but not in this present Gentile era.

no? 300 years later and Constantine still had to assert sunday worship over the pesky notion of believers keeping what was being taught as “jewish and abolished”

During the 1000 years the nations will have many aspects reintroduced, and these will also be centred in Jerusalem when true worship will be restored and the Temple built Isaiah 2:1-4.

True worship reintroduced and restored?...you mean the Sabbath again? Well best practice now I advise...

 

[WatchmanOnTheWall]

Not avoiding just ignoring lol...I did say see you on your lunar sabbath thread which I expect you to bump and update...

Here it is if you wish to learn when the Sabbath is.http://theologyonline.com/showthread.php?127270-When-is-the-Sabbath&highlight=

This calendar was itself a revision from the Egyptian one...now how old is that?...something about an exodus? And reset?

Totally wrong. The Hebrews had there own calendar before going to Egypt and never adopted the Egyptian calendar. Historical documented fact!

But like I said thought we would take it one step at a time...Sunday is not Sabbath step one...

Niether is Saturday

Pagans may very well have developed calanders to counterfeit the Sabbath count etc...all good stuff for your constantly updated thread I am sure...

That's almost right, pagans did use a pagan calendar to counterfeit the Sabbath; it's called the Julian calendar.

 

[TrevorL]

Greetings again clefty,

careful...Yah’s Laws are written on the minds and hearts not the covenant...there is a difference

Fair enough, but the Law that was under the old covenant was to find rest or Sabbath by keeping one day in seven, while Jesus teaches us to find rest by allowing him to share our burdens, and by labouring by sharing his yoke and learning from him, as he guides us in ploughing a steady and straight path towards his kingdom.

so we dont have to work anymore? The curse of the ground is lifted? He became a day on the calendar? Well I have heard rumored He is bread too...literally...
Why not work all seven days then? Why choose a day at all to worship...worship everyday right?

I actually worked a 9 day fortnight, but as far as worship is concerned I seek to set aside part of each day.

Oh except we are to be more like Him not less...and well He kept Sabbaths...not first daze

He was fully dedicated to God every day. He also preached in the synagogues and read the Scriptures on the Sabbath and healed the sick on the Sabbath.

all obtained this rest through faith...in fact they were given mana...food and rest before the Law...see? They were faithful in following the ONE who provided rest...and then they were given the Law at Sinai which contained this day of rest for both native and foreigner alike... sabbath KEEPING...the seventh day...not just rest every day you mean the rest of entering the promised land...where they didnt have to work anymore?...really? yup cuz they were still having to work...

I suggest that you have a closer look at Hebrews 3 and 4 again. Paul links the concept of rest with the wilderness generation and with the generation that entered the land under Joshua.
Hebrews 4:7-10 (KJV): 7 Again, he limiteth a certain day, saying in David, To day, after so long a time; as it is said, To day if ye will hear his voice, harden not your hearts. 8 For if Jesus (Joshua) had given them rest, then would he not afterward have spoken of another day. 9 There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God. 10 For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his.
Thus v9 is not speaking about the keeping one day in seven as you claim. Also v10 is not speaking of one day in seven, but our initial repentance and continuing cessation from the works of sin.

yup...as was his custom
breaking bread yes...Lord’s supper yes...but the weekly eucharist? Still not invented at this time...built by the tradition later

If I was asked to preach in the SDA church I would go on Sunday, the JWs Sunday afternoon or Tuesday night, the Baptists Sunday morning or Wednesday night, the Catholics Saturday night, the CE 9-10AM Sunday. I am not questioning or endorsing their preferred time to worship, but only the SDAs claim that they are keeping the fifth commandment. I am surprised that you seem to be claiming that the bread and wine of the new covenant was not practiced from the time the 3000 were converted at Pentecost or even when the disciples were gathered together in Acts 1.

no? 300 years later and Constantine still had to assert sunday worship over the pesky notion of believers keeping what was being taught as “jewish and abolished”

Constantine did not affect the gathering of the true believers of his time when they quietly gathered for a short time to remember their Lord in the bread and the wine and fellowship. Many were slaves and were given only a short time to themselves.

True worship reintroduced and restored?...you mean the Sabbath again? Well best practice now I advise...

Zechariah 14:16 tells us that the nations during the 1000 years will keep the feast of tabernacles, but I doubt that you keep this today.

Kind regards
Trevor

 

[clefty]

Here it is if you wish to learn when the Sabbath is.http://theologyonline.com/showthread.php?127270-When-is-the-Sabbath&highlight=

Yes I am well aware of it and even encouraged you to update and bump etc...there remains much to sort out

Totally wrong. The Hebrews had there own calendar before going to Egypt and never adopted the Egyptian calendar. Historical documented fact!

was talking about the roman one....

Niether is Saturday

yes step two...after step one...Sunday is false sabbath keeping remains...

That's almost right, pagans did use a pagan calendar to counterfeit the Sabbath; it's called the Julian calendar.

Yes...the new year the festivals the beginning of days all counterfeited...we have much to post

 

[daqq]

Yes...the new year the festivals the beginning of days all counterfeited...we have much to post

What is the meaning of "at the end of the yamim" in Genesis 4:3?
In six yamim Elohim made the heavens, and the earth, and the yam, and all that is in them.
That is six yamim of spoken Word creation, (Genesis 1:1-31, which are not 24-hour days).

 

[clefty]

Greetings again clefty, Fair enough, but the Law that was under the old covenant was to find rest or Sabbath by keeping one day in seven, while Jesus teaches us to find rest by allowing him to share our burdens, and by labouring by sharing his yoke and learning from him, as he guides us in ploughing a steady and straight path towards his kingdom.

you went from Sabbath being a literal day of rest to a spiritual symbolic one...In Him I still need rest from my physical labor...wearing His yoke and learning of Him is His Sabbath keeping...

Please tell me you are not implying that people in the new covenant need no physical rest are you? I work with many christian coworkers who are adamant they are in Christ yet are still TGIF tired...ready to party etc Friday night and really busy on sundaze too...rest doesnt really come up...nor does that everyday rest thingy either...

I actually worked a 9 day fortnight, but as far as worship is concerned I seek to set aside part of each day.

is that more like Him? The example and standard He set for us? Are you fellowshipping with like minded in corporate worship?

He was fully dedicated to God every day. He also preached in the synagogues and read the Scriptures on the Sabbath and healed the sick on the Sabbath. I suggest that you have a closer look at Hebrews 3 and 4 again. Paul links the concept of rest with the wilderness generation and with the generation that entered the land under Joshua.
Hebrews 4:7-10 (KJV): 7 Again, he limiteth a certain day, saying in David, To day, after so long a time; as it is said, To day if ye will hear his voice, harden not your hearts. 8 For if Jesus (Joshua) had given them rest, then would he not afterward have spoken of another day. 9 There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God. 10 For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his.
Thus v9 is not speaking about the keeping one day in seven as you claim. Also v10 is not speaking of one day in seven, but our initial repentance and continuing cessation from the works of sin.

oh yeah? The word used is sabbatismos...a made up greek word derived from hebrew to specifically signify not rest which has its own word in greek but a seventh day rest every greek jew reading this letter to the hebrews would immediately recognize...”Hey look Moishe! Saul still says here a sabbath keeping remains for His people! Mazel tov!!”

Is exactly why James the brother of Yahushua and head of the Jerusalem Church concluded Acts 15 with expecting and intending that the crowding gentiles would hear Moses taught every Sabbath...

If I was asked to preach in the SDA church I would go on Sunday, the JWs Sunday afternoon or Tuesday night, the Baptists Sunday morning or Wednesday night, the Catholics Saturday night, the CE 9-10AM Sunday. I am not questioning or endorsing their preferred time to worship, but only the SDAs claim that they are keeping the fifth commandment.

preach in the SDA church on Sunday? The fifth commandment? You mean fourth? You are getting sloppy...

No other denomination of Christian I have met rest the whole day...usually its power hour then home for ham dinners and football or shopping or whatever...

I am surprised that you seem to be claiming that the bread and wine of the new covenant was not practiced from the time the 3000 were converted at Pentecost or even when the disciples were gathered together in Acts 1.

The Lord’s supper was celebrated to be sure even called Lord’s supper but not what it is today in form and function...not in Acts 20:7 either BTW...breaking bread is one thing and Lord’s supper is specified...

Constantine did not affect the gathering of the true believers of his time when they quietly gathered for a short time to remember their Lord in the bread and the wine and fellowship. Many were slaves and were given only a short time to themselves.

perhaps not but making Sunday the official day reveals a seventh day Sabbath keeping indeed remained for His people...

Zechariah 14:16 tells us that the nations during the 1000 years will keep the feast of tabernacles, but I doubt that you keep this today.

from new moon to new moon sabbath to sabbath His festivals His calendar is what I seek...I dont keep it it keeps me...

 

[TrevorL]

Greetings again clefty,

you went from Sabbath being a literal day of rest to a spiritual symbolic one...In Him I still need rest from my physical labor...wearing His yoke and learning of Him is His Sabbath keeping...
Please tell me you are not implying that people in the new covenant need no physical rest are you? I work with many christian coworkers who are adamant they are in Christ yet are still TGIF tired...ready to party etc Friday night and really busy on sundaze too...rest doesnt really come up...nor does that everyday rest thingy either...
is that more like Him? The example and standard He set for us? Are you fellowshipping with like minded in corporate worship?

Yes I meet with others in fellowship and to remember our Lord’s death and resurrection by sharing the bread and wine. Our speaker commented on Matthew 23, the reading, and some aspects of the surrounding chapters, and then focused on the memorials. I certainly have every opportunity to rest from physical labour, and I prefer a slow pace of life. Is the other part of the 4th commandment that we should actually work 6 days, and possibly 12 hours a day, a 72 hour week? I assume the SDAs that I worked with only worked our 35 hour week.

oh yeah? The word used is sabbatismos...a made up greek word derived from hebrew to specifically signify not rest which has its own word in greek but a seventh day rest every greek jew reading this letter to the hebrews would immediately recognize...”Hey look Moishe! Saul still says here a sabbath keeping remains for His people! Mazel tov!!”

I suggest that Paul links the two, otherwise it is a remarkable coincidence. Exodus 20:8-11 links the Sabbath with the creation, but the reiteration of the Sabbath in Deuteronomy 5:12-15 links the Sabbath with their deliverance from Egypt. These two are linked together here in Hebrews 3 and 4.

Is exactly why James the brother of Yahushua and head of the Jerusalem Church concluded Acts 15 with expecting and intending that the crowding gentiles would hear Moses taught every Sabbath...

Yes, these were the Gentile proselytes to Judaism, not the Gentile Christians. As time went on the Jewish and Gentile Christians separated from the synagogue and formed Ekklesias, as is evident from the letters that Paul wrote. This may have happened very quickly where the main Jewish element resisted the teaching concerning Jesus.

preach in the SDA church on Sunday? The fifth commandment? You mean fourth? You are getting sloppy...

Yes, I meant to write Saturday (Friday night 6pm also?), and I guessed incorrectly the commandment number. You would hear this mentioned more often.

No other denomination of Christian I have met rest the whole day...usually its power hour then home for ham dinners and football or shopping or whatever...

I visited Coorangbong on a Saturday recently, a major NSW SDA centre where they have preserved EGW's cottage, and it reminded me what my suburb was like on a Sunday in my youth. I certainly prefer the quietness and rest, and this is one reason that I like my part rural environment.

The Lord’s supper was celebrated to be sure even called Lord’s supper but not what it is today in form and function...not in Acts 20:7 either BTW...breaking bread is one thing and Lord’s supper is specified...

I am not sure what occurs at a SDA Church, but we hold a memorial each week, with no specific day required, as in some countries they have different weekend holidays. The latest combined study week had their memorial on the Friday evening. 1 Corinthians 11 shows both aspects, the Lord's supper and the memorials.

from new moon to new moon sabbath to sabbath His festivals His calendar is what I seek...I dont keep it it keeps me...

I am not sure exactly what you are saying here. I enjoy watching the new moon. I was hoping you would answer both Zechariah 14 from a SDA perspective as it does not fit in with burning the earth, and whether you now keep the Feast of Tabernacles each year. The Jews in the land of Israel keep some aspects of the Feast of Tabernacles today, by having some form of booth and sleeping in this booth for a few days. Do any SDAs have some semblance of this?

Kind regards
Trevor

 

[WatchmanOnTheWall]

Greetings TheThirdAngel144 This is a very strong declaration of the need to keep the Sabbath, as is the video, but we are not under the Sabbath Law. The Sabbath was a shadow of things to come. Christ is the true Sabbath Matthew 11:25-30.

Kind regards
Trevor

Yes He is our Sabbath rest but most Christians do not recognise that the Sabbath actually points to His Millennial reign: http://theologyonline.com/showthread.php?127731-God-s-7000-year-plan&highlight=

 

[clefty]

Greetings again clefty, Yes I meet with others in fellowship and to remember our Lord’s death and resurrection by sharing the bread and wine. Our speaker commented on Matthew 23, the reading, and some aspects of the surrounding chapters, and then focused on the memorials.

well see that is just it there is no instruction or example in scripture of them celebrating His resurrection...on the festival of first fruits day...a festival every first day of the week after the passover Sabbath...the bread and the wine are a remembrance of His death NOT resurrection...that it is celebrated every sunday has no precedent in the scripture...it itself was a SUPPER just prior to passover which is ONCE A YEAR...Sunday is claimed the celebration of His resurrection not the the bread and wine

I certainly have every opportunity to rest from physical labour, and I prefer a slow pace of life.

yes IN CHRIST still means we need physical rest...we are still under the curse to labor by the sweat of our brow...and rest in a pattern subscribed by our creator who cursed us...seventh day after six...ALL DAY

Is the other part of the 4th commandment that we should actually work 6 days, and possibly 12 hours a day, a 72 hour week? I assume the SDAs that I worked with only worked our 35 hour week.

yes we are to work six days and for our gain and profit including chores etc six days...the SDAs I met worked a typical 40 hour work week...

I suggest that Paul links the two, otherwise it is a remarkable coincidence. Exodus 20:8-11 links the Sabbath with the creation, but the reiteration of the Sabbath in Deuteronomy 5:12-15 links the Sabbath with their deliverance from Egypt. These two are linked together here in Hebrews 3 and 4.

COINCIDENCE? lol...Yah could have saved His people anytime of the year...there is a plan and reason and intention and symbol in ALL He does to reach us...

Yes, these were the Gentile proselytes to Judaism,

not at all they were crowding synagogues to hear preached One risen, the One who defeated death...of course they had to hear Moses and the prophets as James intended every Sabbath to set the context as to why He had to die...How He was to be risen...what it meant etc...they were not joining jews...

not the Gentile Christians. As time went on the Jewish and Gentile Christians separated from the synagogue and formed Ekklesias, as is evident from the letters that Paul wrote. This may have happened very quickly where the main Jewish element resisted the teaching concerning Jesus.

yes...but the sect was still considered jewish and persecuted by ROME as such...again Paul kept festivals Peter even kosher and BOTH insisted the new churches continue in the traditions taught by them...AND NOT the false teachers and wolves in sheep’s clothing already infiltration to counterfeit and lead astray...

Yes, I meant to write Saturday (Friday night 6pm also?),

no sundown ALAS as biblical days begin in the morning...

and I guessed incorrectly the commandment number. You would hear this mentioned more often.

LOL...yes we typically do things MORE similar and BELIEVE things MORE similar to our friends...how can two walk together unless they be agreed?

Being placed in Him is a lifetime joy of being rebuilt a new creation in His image...not of the world...a continuance of the works He began in us...to do His Father’s will...a most easy yoke and light burden

I visited Coorangbong on a Saturday recently, a major NSW SDA centre where they have preserved EGW's cottage, and it reminded me what my suburb was like on a Sunday in my youth.

austrailia? Nice...

I certainly prefer the quietness and rest, and this is one reason that I like my part rural environment.

also nice

I am not sure what occurs at a SDA Church, but we hold a memorial each week, with no specific day required, as in some countries they have different weekend holidays.

The God I worship has His Sabbath as binding as the other 9

The latest combined study week had their memorial on the Friday evening. 1 Corinthians 11 shows both aspects, the Lord's supper and the memorials. I am not sure exactly what you are saying here. I enjoy watching the new moon. I was hoping you would answer both Zechariah 14 from a SDA perspective as it does not fit in with burning the earth, and whether you now keep the Feast of Tabernacles each year. The Jews in the land of Israel keep some aspects of the Feast of Tabernacles today, by having some form of booth and sleeping in this booth for a few days. Do any SDAs have some semblance of this?

Kind regards
Trevor

No from what I know it is not official teaching that SDA’s keep festivals (although there are churches and movements within to do so)...sadly they also reject the more accurate names...and retain Friday nights as beginning the Sabbath day...

 

[TrevorL]

Greetings again clefty,

well see that is just it there is no instruction or example in scripture of them celebrating His resurrection...on the festival of first fruits day...a festival every first day of the week after the passover Sabbath...the bread and the wine are a remembrance of His death NOT resurrection...that it is celebrated every sunday has no precedent in the scripture...it itself was a SUPPER just prior to passover which is ONCE A YEAR...Sunday is claimed the celebration of His resurrection not the bread and wine

I appreciate the response and I will only respond to part. I am not sure of what you are saying here. The fact that he was crucified and died necessitated his resurrection. By partaking of the bread and wine is in remembrance of Jesus, as he states, and he taught that he would return and share this again with them, indicating his resurrection. It would be a rather morbid celebration if it was only teaching his death. Also he says that the blood is the blood of the new covenant, and this results in life.
Luke 22:19-20 (KJV: 19 And he took bread, and gave thanks, and brake it, and gave unto them, saying, This is my body which is given for you: this do in remembrance of me. 20 Likewise also the cup after supper, saying, This cup is the new testament (or covenant) in my blood, which is shed for you.

COINCIDENCE? lol...Yah could have saved His people anytime of the year...there is a plan and reason and intention and symbol in ALL He does to reach us...

What I was trying to suggest is that Hebrews 3 and 4 is a thorough discussion of the subject of Rest, and the Sabbath is only one aspect of this overall subject. Paul is showing that the Sabbath was only pointing forward to the true rest.

not at all they were crowding synagogues to hear preached One risen, the One who defeated death...of course they had to hear Moses and the prophets as James intended every Sabbath to set the context as to why He had to die...How He was to be risen...what it meant etc...they were not joining jews...

I disagree. It is talking about a normal synagogue with Jews and Gentile proselytes.

and retain Friday nights as beginning the Sabbath day...

I have always thought the Sabbath commenced on Friday evening.

Kind regards
Trevor

 

[clefty]

Greetings again clefty, I appreciate the response and I will only respond to part. I am not sure of what you are saying here. The fact that he was crucified and died necessitated his resurrection. By partaking of the bread and wine is in remembrance of Jesus, as he states, and he taught that he would return and share this again with them, indicating his resurrection. It would be a rather morbid celebration if it was only teaching his death.

at the time of the institution of this sacrement NO ONE KNEW HE WAS GOING TO DIE LET ALONE BE RESURRECTED...is Passover morbid? Could be but they were passed over by His Wrath...He offered His body...they ate as they understood it at the time...His Spirit the Words He spoke...not one interpreting it as morbid flesh sacrifice...instead arguing who is the greatest wondering what judas was leaving to buy for the passover and leaving for the garden singing...

Long afterwards they remembered indeed...and rejoiced...He died as the passover lamb did...for them...no morbidity...the CHURCH its tradition placed this meal at the center of its custom to celebrate on sundays his resurrection but with eating his flesh and blood literally under a cross with body still hanging on it...

that is morbid

Also he says that the blood is the blood of the new covenant, and this results in life.

indeed...and after signing this new covenant with His blood and sealing it with His blood IT CAN NOT BE CHANGED...the first day in the new covenant aga remained a Sabbath He kept as did His followers...

Luke 22:19-20 (KJV: 19 And he took bread, and gave thanks, and brake it, and gave unto them, saying, This is my body which is given for you: this do in remembrance of me. 20 Likewise also the cup after supper, saying, This cup is the new testament (or covenant) in my blood, which is shed for you.

Yes this christening of the new covenant was with a toast to a room full of jews...which continued to keep OT ways...Sabbaths festivals kosher...”this do” was now part of the annual passover celebration which was a remembrance to Him...a shadow indeed pointing to Him...His death...

They celebrated His resurrection by preaching it teaching it...not a ritual...in fact that resurrection day had them actually disbelieving and hiding from Jews...some celebration...but Christians still hide from Jews...LOL man and his traditions...

What I was trying to suggest is that Hebrews 3 and 4 is a thorough discussion of the subject of Rest, and the Sabbath is only one aspect of this overall subject. Paul is showing that the Sabbath was only pointing forward to the true rest.

Yes yes and yes...the seventh day Sabbath still IS a shadow and does point to better things to come...is why a sabbath keeping still remains...a sabbatismos verse 9...a hebrew greek hybrid word signifying to the greek reading jews exactly that...weekly sabbaths remain for HIS people...

The greek langauage has its own word for rest and the seventh day...but this letter to Hebrews wished to be clear...and specific as Yah is not an author of confusion...

Not receiving rest in Egypt they groaned and He heard them...saved them gave them rest before Sinai actually and finally they entered the rest of a promised land...and yet had to work...and rest...we are to enter the rest as He did that creation week...after six days of creative work...one day of rest...

We will enter a rest in heaven and the new earth and yet even as in Eden Sabbath is more about marking time and events...His time His events...than the need for rest...

I disagree. It is talking about a normal synagogue with Jews and Gentile proselytes.

Jews don’t proselytize...the gentiles came running when they heard of One who defeated death...why else would a roman join a persecuted minority? Lol

But now with the GOOD NEWS GOSPEL and SPIRIT FUELED REVIVAL it created problems that councils had to be called as to what to do with these crowding gentiles every Sabbath...

I have always thought the Sabbath commenced on Friday evening.

understandable...jews and christians teach it...scripture shows otherswise...

Maybe of interest:

http://theologyonline.com/showthrea...in&highlight=When+does+the+biblical+day+begin


The conspiracy found in Judah remains...choose ye this day...

 

[TheThirdAngel144]

Greetings TheThirdAngel144 This is a very strong declaration of the need to keep the Sabbath, as is the video, but we are not under the Sabbath Law. The Sabbath was a shadow of things to come. Christ is the true Sabbath Matthew 11:25-30.

Kind regards
Trevor

Thank you Trevor.

The problem I have with this stance, is that every other precept of the 10 Commandments is valid, and generally Christians find a need for a day of (1) Rest from worldly pursuits, and sometimes physical rest (2) Spiritual practices worshipping God (3) Fellowship with like-minded believers. All these principle are embodied in the Sabbath, and there is even a "mock Sabbath", or a Sabbath look-a-like. Do you disagree with these assertions, and could you please tell me why?

 

[TheThirdAngel144]

The argument is that the church through its sacred traditions and given authority by the keys of peter transferred the solemnity of the sabbath to Sunday the day He was risen...He was risen that first day of the week and was risen the second and today He is risen still...He rose however on the day before that first day of the week...the Sabbath...it heals He rested and was refreshed

What moral authority does mankind have to change God's Law?

 

[TheThirdAngel144]

A fixed Roman calendar you say and obviously you are referring to the Roman Julian (Caesar) calendar that was created by Greek mathematician Sosigenes in 45BC which was implemented on the 1 January and was a Friday, but what was the day before this date? And on what calendar?

We have no evidence in the Bible of "eighth day", or non-days in the Scriptures. A 7 day weekly cycle is all we are ever given.