ECT "PISTEUO", the secret of the universe....

[Faither]

Lol, you're not giving me credit. My short labor failed your short accounts system.

Short posts or long, apparantly no one cN trump neither your Vine, nor your Strong.

Have at it, F'r; I think I'll stick to the Word rightly divided this side of Romans 3:21, 2 Tim.2:15.

So let me make sure I'm understanding you? Your using the word of God to explain why you reject the Word of God?

WOW! now that's a new one.

 

[Danoh]

So let me make sure I'm understanding you? Your using the word of God to explain why you reject the Word of God?

WOW! now that's a new one.

Lol, you remind me of Jerry Shugart, may he be well.

He too would post the same thing over, and over, and over...repeatedly coming back to wonder why no one was playing ball.

Lol, whenever he did get a nibble, he would lay into that person for not having agreed with him in his exact words, repeated back to him.

Only he tended to be a bit nasty with one and all. You appear to know how to hide your legalism behind seemingly less acidic wording.

And no, I do not disagree with the Scripture, only with your insistence on one Greek word.

But we know that is not going to go anywhere, so don't bother to try to draw me out on that. When I'm bored, I'll be back to challenge you once more, rest assured, lol

 

[Faither]

Lol, you remind me of Jerry Shugart, may he be well.

He too would post the same thing over, and over, and over...repeatedly coming back to wonder why no one was playing ball.

Lol, whenever he did get a nibble, he would lay into that person for not having agreed with him in his exact words, repeated back to him.

Only he tended to be a bit nasty with one and all. You appear to know how to hide your legalism behind seemingly less acidic wording.

And no, I do not disagree with the Scripture, only with your insistence on one Greek word.

But we know that is not going to go anywhere, so don't bother to try to draw me out on that. When I'm bored, I'll be back to challenge you once more, rest assured, lol

Out of your own mouth comes the truth. You say that only out of boredom would you come back to seek the truth. Unfortunately that's not what the drawing of the Father feels like. Were done.

 

[Faither]

Since this understanding of "Pisteuo" is new to a lot of people, I would like to give a little background on how I came to know about this mistranslation of "pisteuo" into our English Bibles.

In 1987 I came across a Bible teacher that would prove to be one of the greatest Biblical minds since Martin Luther. His Father was a preacher, so the last thing he wanted to be was a preacher also. But at an early age, he went to a Bible college and found himself being asked to leave. They recommended he went to a regular university and so he did. This started a journey for him that would make him a teachers teacher as many would describe him. Many, many more people disliked him than liked him, but everyone had a respect for his knowledge of the word of God.
He would go onto earn his degrees at Stanford university, amass the largest collection of Biblical manuscripts in private hands, behind the Vatican. He tirelessly mined through Gods word for 50 years, with all the ancient texts at his disposal. I first came across his teaching in 1987, the foundation of his teaching is the understanding of "Faith". Without this basic understanding, it was impossible to learn Gods Word correctly.

He would be the one, who First taught me that the Greek word "pisteuo" was mistranslated into English. The reason for this mistranslation is the Greek word "pisteuo", and to make that situation even worse, they used the word "believe" as a replacement word for "pisteuo". Pisteuo is the verb form of the noun "Faith" pistis in the Greek. The English language has no word for the verb form of "Faith". The words the English language should have had are faither, faithing, and to faithe. But those aren't in the English dictionary.

He would go on to teach that this Greek word "pisteuo" is an act, based upon a belief, sustained by confidence. In the vines, "pisteuo is defined as a "personal surrender to Him, and a life sustained by such surrender. The strongs is "commit unto", "be committed to", commit to ones trust," and specifically says that pisteuo "means not just to Believe."

So as I have said before, a great conversation can be started, but only for those who will accept the true definition of "pisteuo", used in the NT 248 times.

I gave some background on how I came to this information of the English language not having a word for the verb form of Faith. This gifted teacher also had a very specific action associated with Pisteuo.

Being fair to him, I want to share his understanding of what saving faith is, and what is the specific action involved in Pisteuo.

Pisteuo is an act, based upon a belief, sustained by confidence. The specific act i'm going to share with you is the best understanding you will ever hear. And I will go onto share my concerns about that understanding.

His understanding was that saving faith or pisteuo from the very start, is grabbing hold of a promise in Gods Word, and hang your body, everything on that promise. No matter what things looked like, how bad the circumstances around you seemed, you still hold on to that promise. Even till death if need be waking up on the other side still holding on. When that promise becomes fact, start the whole process over again on another promise. When a promise becomes fact it's not faith anymore, so another promise is needed to hang your body on. If this process stops, everything stops, pisteuo stops, eternal life stops. Faithing or pisteuo is continuous.

Now that is the best definition you will ever hear. And further along in our Salvation journey, I understand this to be completely true.

What I have a problem with, is that if we are outside of Gods Word at the start of our journey, how can we grab hold of something that's not ours yet. Rom. 8:9 is one of those foundational Scriptures that cuts across all boundaries. It says, that if we don't have the Spirit of Christ in us, we are none of His. And if He is not ours, His word is not ours either. So I present the question, How do we start the journey, how is Gods Word made ours to grab hold of to start the relationship?

That's where the definition of "pisteuo" becomes so valuable, and why I consider it to be "the secret of the universe."

The definition of "pisteuo is "A personal surrender to Him, and a life inspired by such surrender." We don't have to have the Spirit of Christ in us to surrender our lives to Him. And if that surrender is genuine, will start the Salvation process. My gifted teacher was not one of those who understood that the Spirit of Christ was emediately at the start sealed into us, and neither am i. But by his understanding we would have to have the Spirit of Christ in us to start the process the way he understood it. As I said before, once we start the Pisteuo or surrendering of our lives to Him, and as result He and His word become ours, then his understanding makes more sense. But surrendering our lives to Him is the essential action, based upon a belief, sustained by confidence we must practice to grow in Christ.

It's my hope that some of those who know what i'm talking about here, would reply and discuss this. Or, that someone who is drawn to know more about pisteuo will do the same.

 

[Nihilo]

This gifted teacher

Name them. Without naming your authority this whole thread is an informal logical fallacy known as the appeal to an unnamed authority. So do yourself and your cause a favor and name this gifted teacher.

His understanding was that saving faith or pisteuo from the very start, is grabbing hold of a promise in Gods Word, and hang your body, everything on that promise. No matter what things looked like, how bad the circumstances around you seemed, you still hold on to that promise. Even till death if need be waking up on the other side still holding on. When that promise becomes fact, start the whole process over again on another promise. When a promise becomes fact it's not faith anymore, so another promise is needed to hang your body on. If this process stops, everything stops, pisteuo stops, eternal life stops. Faithing or pisteuo is continuous.

That's what I mean when I say "believe."

 

[Faither]

Name them. Without naming your authority this whole thread is an informal logical fallacy known as the appeal to an unnamed authority. So do yourself and your cause a favor and name this gifted teacher.
That's what I mean when I say "believe."

If when you say "believe", you are sincerely surrendering your life to Christ, that would be great! but keep in mind, the surrender isn't half of your life. It isn't a partnership between us and Christ. He is now leading our lives, and He knows, and we know if we have really committed everything to Him. I don't mean like some kind of perfection trip. It just has to be genuine! If we surrender our life to Him, yet we have that secret deliverance hidden in our back pockets just in case He fails us, that's not surrender.

The teacher I shared with you kept his message strong, yet still desirable to any who have been called. His teaching went out world wide for 20 years. Can you imagine how many people would be sitting in front of you to learn about a relationship with God , if the first thing you told them walking through the door is, "Surrender your life to Jesus!" "If you don't, nothing you hear in this place will apply to you!"

It would most likely be empty.

Once in Christ, we will always be yearning for a better surrender, or Faithing. So if you are yearning to know Him better, your one of the lucky ones. And that knowledge comes through a better surrendering of our lives to Him, all the way through the Salvation journey.

 

[Faither]

Name them. Without naming your authority this whole thread is an informal logical fallacy known as the appeal to an unnamed authority. So do yourself and your cause a favor and name this gifted teacher.

That's not going to happen. Not until I talk with someone who I feel needs that information.

 

[Nihilo]

Well done.

 

[Danoh]

Out of your own mouth comes the truth. You say that only out of boredom would you come back to seek the truth. Unfortunately that's not what the drawing of the Father feels like. Were done.

No, out of boredom I'll drop by here and there to waste my time attempting to show yours is not the truth.

I do hold you have a right to your view. I just don't see said view as Scripture's Own, this side of Rom. 3:21 and Rom. 4:4.

 

[Faither]

Rom. 4:3

English mistranslation : "For what does the Scripture say? Abraham "believed" (mistranslation) God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness."

English correct translation : "For what does the Scripture say? Abraham " Faithed" God, (committed himself unto Him) and it was accounted to him for righteousness.

"pisteuo" defined in the Vines : "A personal surrender to Him." "A life inspired by such surrender."

"pisteuo" defined in the Strongs : " pisteuo means NOT JUST TO BELIEVE." "reliance upon", "not mere credence", "Commit unto", "Commit to ones trust", "be committed unto", "

 

[Danoh]

Rom. 4:3

English mistranslation : "For what does the Scripture say? Abraham "believed" (mistranslation) God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness."

English correct translation : "For what does the Scripture say? Abraham " Faithed" God, (committed himself unto Him) and it was accounted to him for righteousness.

"pisteuo" defined in the Vines : "A personal surrender to Him." "A life inspired by such surrender."

"pisteuo" defined in the Strongs : " pisteuo means NOT JUST TO BELIEVE." "reliance upon", "not mere credence", "Commit unto", "Commit to ones trust", "be committed unto", "

Now you have really put the cart before the horse.

Paul is referring to way back when God first made a promise to Abraham and he believed that what God had promised would come true.

Abraham was fine up to that point.

But then, he must have read your posts and taken it upon himself to show just what a good absolute surrender-ist he was that he ended up attempting to do for himself what God MUST'VE meant.

The result of Abraham's version of your "pisteuo"?

Ishmael, with all the bloodshed that "pisteuo" has continued to result in to this day...

More like "PEST-ay- yo here's some bondage..."

You would do well to read and - believe - Galatians 4...

 

[Faither]

Galatians 3:22
English mistranslation of "pisteuo" : But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith in Jesus Christ might be given to them that "believe." (mistranslation)

Galatians 3:22
English correct translation of "pisteuo" : But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith in Jesus Christ might be given to them that "surrender their lives to Him".(pisteuo)

"pisteuo" defined in the Vines : "A personal surrender to Him." "A life inspired by such surrender."

"pisteuo" defined in the Strongs : " pisteuo means NOT JUST TO BELIEVE." "reliance upon", "not mere credence", "Commit unto", "Commit to ones trust", "be committed unto",

 

[Danoh]

Galatians 3:22
English mistranslation of "pisteuo" : But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that "believe." (mistranslation)

Galatians 3:22
English correct translation of "pisteuo" : But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that "surrender their lives to Him".(pisteuo)

"pisteuo" defined in the Vines : "A personal surrender to Him." "A life inspired by such surrender."

"pisteuo" defined in the Strongs : " pisteuo means NOT JUST TO BELIEVE." "reliance upon", "not mere credence", "Commit unto", "Commit to ones trust", "be committed unto",

What is your understanding of the phrase "the faith OF Jesus Christ"?

 

[Interplanner]

Good question, Danoh. It is a fairly unique statement as the NT goes.

 

[Faither]

What is your understanding of the phrase "the faith OF Jesus Christ"?

You reject the Nt definition of faith or "faithing" , and you want to discuss the Faith of Christ?

What part of "we can't discuss anything don't you get?" You start out wrong in the relationship with Christ, the whole thing is wrong! I know you have an understanding that makes perfect sense to you, so lean on it and learn. That's what were all doing I hope.

 

[Danoh]

Faither, I wasn't aware that Vine and Strong took part in the writing of the "New Testament."

Interplanner has many, many years in your precious Greek and even he concluded mine was a good question.

Lol, I can only conclude you know the answer to my question will expose the flaw in your argument.

 

[Faither]

Faither, I wasn't aware that Vine and Strong took part in the writing of the "New Testament."

Interplanner has many, many years in your precious Greek and even he concluded mine was a good question.

Lol, I can only conclude you know the answer to my question will expose the flaw in your argument.

Well than why can't he discuss "pisteuo"?

 

[Faither]

What is your understanding of the phrase "the faith OF Jesus Christ"?

When you surrender your life to Christ, then and only then will you have the honor of discussing the different translations of "in Christ" or "of Christ" .

 

[Danoh]

When you surrender your life to Christ, then and only then will you have the honor of discussing the different translations of "in Christ" or "of Christ" .

Liar, liar, pants on fire, you just had no answer - yours; a funeral pyre.

 

[Faither]

Liar, liar, pants on fire, you just had no answer - yours; a funeral pyre.

This is a theology discussion site?