Paul did not write Hebrews; we do not know who did

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I agree with this quote from your article:

The Prophetic Rise of Israel

The scripture is very specific to address the issue of Israel’s return. For in the same statement that we are told of Israel’s fall, we are told of their future return.
Then why have you been having such a hard time with what I've been telling you?
It is clear that at some future time, God will restore Israel and fulfill the prophecies concerning their rise and earthly dominion under God. But it will not occur until this age of grace, wherein there is no national distinction before God, is complete.
What is "this age of grace"?
When did "this age of grace" begin?
 

marke

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Then why have you been having such a hard time with what I've been telling you?

What is "this age of grace"?
When did "this age of grace" begin?
I agree that God has in a real sense "set aside" the nation of Israel until the "fullness of the Gentiles" is completed.
 

marke

Well-known member
No, you didn't.

You mentioned "the age of grace". I asked what it is and when it started.

I would also mention that the Bible doesn't contain a reference to such a thing.
I think what the author meant by the term "the age of grace" is the dispensation of the age of the Christian church we are now living in. Like you, I do not subscribe to the term "age of grace." I believe God chose the Jews in the OT to be His special people through which He dealt with the entire human race for 2500 years from Abraham to Pentecost. The Christian Church can trace its origin on earth to Pentecost and Christian Churches are now God's ministers to the rest of the world during this time period Jesus referred to as the times of the Gentiles.

Luke 21:24
And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.
 

Right Divider

Body part
I think what the author meant by the term "the age of grace" is the dispensation of the age of the Christian church we are now living in.
What author? You posted it.
Like you, I do not subscribe to the term "age of grace."
Why did you use the term then?
I believe God chose the Jews in the OT to be His special people through which He dealt with the entire human race for 2500 years from Abraham to Pentecost.
God did not stop with His people at Pentecost. Pentecost was lawfully required Jewish feast day.
The Christian Church can trace its origin on earth to Pentecost
That is completely false. The "church which is His body" did NOT begin on that lawfully required Jewish feast day.
and Christian Churches are now God's ministers to the rest of the world during this time period Jesus referred to as the times of the Gentiles.
We are NOT in the "times of the gentiles". We are in the time of the dispensation of the grace of God.
Luke 21:24
And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.
When Luke wrote this, God has NOT YET revealed the dispensation of His grace. That came in Acts 9.
 

JudgeRightly

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When Luke wrote this, God has NOT YET revealed the dispensation of His grace. That came in Acts 9.

You sure? Pretty sure most of the New Testament was written long after Paul's conversion, with Galatians being the first book written in the New Testament...

Do you mean, "when Jesus said this", instead?
 

marke

Well-known member
What author? You posted it.
No, I simply quoted from the source you posted. He was not my guy but yours.
Why did you use the term then?

God did not stop with His people at Pentecost. Pentecost was lawfully required Jewish feast day.

That is completely false. The "church which is His body" did NOT begin on that lawfully required Jewish feast day.

We are NOT in the "times of the gentiles". We are in the time of the dispensation of the grace of God.

When Luke wrote this, God has NOT YET revealed the dispensation of His grace. That came in Acts 9.
You criticize me for using the term "age of grace," a term I picked out of your article, and then you yourself refer to the "dispensation of His grace." I think we are close, but not entirely agreed.
 

Right Divider

Body part
No, I simply quoted from the source you posted. He was not my guy but yours.
OK, I see that he did. I'm not a fan of the term as I believe that it creates some confusion.
You criticize me for using the term "age of grace," a term I picked out of your article, and then you yourself refer to the "dispensation of His grace."
The Bible clearly shows the dispensation of His grace.

Eph 3:2 (AKJV/PCE)
(3:2) If ye have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God which is given me to you-ward:

I think we are close, but not entirely agreed.
The problem that I have with you is that you cannot tell the difference between BEFORE this dispensation and DURING.

This dispensation (of the grace of God) did not BEGIN until God gave it to Paul (which is well AFTER the lawfully required Jewish feast day).
 

Nick M

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Demon possessed perverts say he is to discredit the other things Paul said which are in direct contention with the gospel of grace. The devil appears as an angel of light.

First is the author of Hebrews, who likely learned from the 12. Perhaps he was from the sect that believed in Acts 15. It's only a guess by us.

2 For if the word spoken through angels proved steadfast, and every transgression and disobedience received a just reward, 3 how shall we escape if we neglect so great a salvation, which at the first began to be spoken by the Lord, and was confirmed to us by those who heard Him

And then what Paul says about his gospel.

11 But I make known to you, brethren, that the gospel which was preached by me is not according to man. 12 For I neither received it from man, nor was I taught it, but it came through the revelation of Jesus Christ.
 
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