ECT Our triune God

[Lon]

I'd like to thank you, Lon, for your concern and your steadiness under fire. Keep up the good fight...

His many blessings, thank you.

-Lon

 

[glorydaz]

Jesus said He was a man who lived by every word that proceeded out of the mouth of God. What could be more simple to understand?

Joh 5:26 For as the Father hath life in himself; so hath he given to the Son to have life in himself;

LA

Jesus had life in Him because He was God from the beginning. That's where the Life came from. All life comes from God. Jesus is Life because He is God...not just because He read Scripture.

 

[glorydaz]

1Co 15:21 For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead.

When you take a verse out of context, you are leaving yourself open for misunderstandings...as you have done here. You see the word "man" and don't take the time to read any farther....like down to verse 45 which shows He's from heaven (deity). The man (in yellow) is the one who is LIFE, a quickening spirit, having come from heaven.

Jesus is the Last Adam. Yes, he had a human nature, but it isn't his human nature that allows any of us to look forward to the resurrection of the dead. Deity gives LIFE, not humanity.

1 Cor. 15:45
And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit. Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual. The first man is of the earth, earthy; the second man is the Lord from heaven.

 

[Lazy afternoon]

When you take a verse out of context, you are leaving yourself open for misunderstandings...as you have done here. You see the word "man" and don't take the time to read any farther....like down to verse 45 which shows He's from heaven (deity). The man (in yellow) is the one who is LIFE, a quickening spirit, having come from heaven.

Jesus is the Last Adam. Yes, he had a human nature, but it isn't his human nature that allows any of us to look forward to the resurrection of the dead. Deity gives LIFE, not humanity.

1 Cor. 15:45
And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit. Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual. The first man is of the earth, earthy; the second man is the Lord from heaven.

It means Adam was a natural man and Jesus was a spiritual man.

You drop the man off whenever you can and deny Jesus Christ the man.

1Ti 2:5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;


LA

 

[glorydaz]

It means Adam was a natural man and Jesus was a spiritual man.

You drop the man off whenever you can and deny Jesus Christ the man.

1Ti 2:5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;


LA

It means Jesus came from heaven and gives life to whomever He will. Before He gives it, you must know He is God...the giver of life.

Read Moses and you'll see Jesus is the giver of Life.

John 5:39-47
Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me. And ye will not come to me, that ye might have life. I receive not honour from men. But I know you, that ye have not the love of God in you. I am come in my Father's name, and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive. How can ye believe, which receive honour one of another, and seek not the honour that cometh from God only? Do not think that I will accuse you to the Father: there is one that accuseth you, even Moses, in whom ye trust. For had ye believed Moses, ye would have believed me; for he wrote of me. But if ye believe not his writings, how shall ye believe my words?

 

[Lazy afternoon]

God can not be tempted to sin or die.

Jesus was tempted to sin and He did die.

Jesus is a man raised up by God who came and dwelt in Him after God had prepared Him for 30 years to receive Him at His baptism.

Jesus was the first man to receive God to live in him before resurrection.LA

 

[Apple7]

Broken record time once again...

Broken record time once again...

God can not be tempted to sin or die.

Jesus was tempted to sin and He did die.

Jesus is a man raised up by God who came and dwelt in Him after God had prepared Him for 30 years to receive Him at His baptism.

Jesus was the first man to receive God to live in him before resurrection.LA

How many times must we go over the same answers with you, grams?

 

[Lazy afternoon]

It means Jesus came from heaven and gives life to whomever He will. Before He gives it, you must know He is God...the giver of life.

Read Moses and you'll see Jesus is the giver of Life.

John 5:39-47
Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me. And ye will not come to me, that ye might have life. I receive not honour from men. But I know you, that ye have not the love of God in you. I am come in my Father's name, and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive. How can ye believe, which receive honour one of another, and seek not the honour that cometh from God only? Do not think that I will accuse you to the Father: there is one that accuseth you, even Moses, in whom ye trust. For had ye believed Moses, ye would have believed me; for he wrote of me. But if ye believe not his writings, how shall ye believe my words?

No,

It was the Word which came down from Heaven.

Joh 5:24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.


Joh 5:30 I can of mine own self do nothing: as I hear, I judge: and my judgment is just; because I seek not mine own will, but the will of the Father which hath sent me.


Joh 5:36 But I have greater witness than that of John: for the works which the Father hath given me to finish, the same works that I do, bear witness of me, that the Father hath sent me.
Joh 5:37 And the Father himself, which hath sent me, hath borne witness of me. Ye have neither heard his voice at any time, nor seen his shape. Joh 5:38 And ye have not his word abiding in you: for whom he hath sent, him ye believe not.

Mat 16:15 He saith unto them, But whom say ye that I am?
Mat 16:16 And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God. Mat 16:17 And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.

You preach the word of the Roman Catholic church.

LA

 

[Bright Raven]

No,

It was the Word which came down from Heaven.

Joh 5:24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.


Joh 5:30 I can of mine own self do nothing: as I hear, I judge: and my judgment is just; because I seek not mine own will, but the will of the Father which hath sent me.


Joh 5:36 But I have greater witness than that of John: for the works which the Father hath given me to finish, the same works that I do, bear witness of me, that the Father hath sent me.
Joh 5:37 And the Father himself, which hath sent me, hath borne witness of me. Ye have neither heard his voice at any time, nor seen his shape. Joh 5:38 And ye have not his word abiding in you: for whom he hath sent, him ye believe not.

Mat 16:15 He saith unto them, But whom say ye that I am?
Mat 16:16 And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God. Mat 16:17 And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.

You preach the word of the Roman Catholic church.

LA

John 3:13
No one has ascended to heaven but He who came down from heaven, that is, the Son of Man who is in heaven.

 

[Lazy afternoon]

John 3:13
No one has ascended to heaven but He who came down from heaven, that is, the Son of Man who is in heaven.

The son of man could hardly come down from Heaven when He was born through Mary.

Do you now believe the son of man was of man before He was born?

The son of man is in Heaven when Jesus spoke these words because Jesus was in the Kingdom of God on earth.

If it was Jesus who had come down from Heaven then He would have ascended into Heaven also previously, and there is no record of it in scripture.

LA

 

[Wile E. Coyote]

I'd like to thank you, Lon, for your concern and your steadiness under fire. Keep up the good fight...

:up: Lon's the main man!

 

[Wile E. Coyote]

The son of man could hardly come down from Heaven when He was born through Mary.

Do you now believe the son of man was of man before He was born?


LA

Son of Man is just the title of His office. He held the office BEFORE He came into the world, John 6:62.

 

[Apple7]

When you take a verse out of context, you are leaving yourself open for misunderstandings...as you have done here. You see the word "man" and don't take the time to read any farther....like down to verse 45 which shows He's from heaven (deity). The man (in yellow) is the one who is LIFE, a quickening spirit, having come from heaven.

Jesus is the Last Adam. Yes, he had a human nature, but it isn't his human nature that allows any of us to look forward to the resurrection of the dead. Deity gives LIFE, not humanity.

1 Cor. 15:45
And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit. Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual. The first man is of the earth, earthy; the second man is the Lord from heaven.

Great point.

 

[Ask Mr. Religion]

Good news:
5) There are a good number of believers who know thier triune position! :up:
6) There is a wonderful support system on the front-lines
7) Though I have found God triune in scripture, I have been blessed to see other's share some passages in a new light, adding to our view of our Great God and Savior.
8) Demonstrated strength. Our triune God stands. He is worthy of praise, glory, honor, and devotion.

Happy Anniversary to all you who have made this thread your own in celebration of our Triune God.

Kudos to you, brother, for trying to maintain a discussion on a vital and essential element of our faith.


AMR

 

[Totton Linnet]

Kudos to you, brother, for trying to maintain a discussion on a vital and essential element of our faith.


AMR

*
Yes we will follow the apostolic tradition and worship our Lord Jesus as Lord and God.

Oh the wonder of Immanual "God with us" oh that God would come to be a fellow among us.

Having followed and participated in the debate I see so clearly that all the study and even bible study without the PERSONAL revelation from the Father study is vain. The Pharibums studied the scriptures but when the God of the scriptures appeared among them they took up stones to stone Him.

 

[glorydaz]

*
Yes we will follow the apostolic tradition and worship our Lord Jesus as Lord and God.

Oh the wonder of Immanual "God with us" oh that God would come to be a fellow among us.

Having followed and participated in the debate I see so clearly that all the study and even bible study without the PERSONAL revelation from the Father study is vain. The Pharibums studied the scriptures but when the God of the scriptures appeared among them they took up stones to stone Him.

And after God dwelt among them...bringing them out of Egypt, leading them by pillar of cloud and fire, feeding them manna in the wilderness, and having them drink from the rock. When He showed up as a servant instead of a "KING", He was rejected.

And, He's still being rejected to this day. God walked among us in the form of a man, and some only see the man. It's sure true that man looks at the outside, but it takes the Spirit of God for us to see it was God inside the flesh.

 

[Wile E. Coyote]

And after God dwelt among them...bringing them out of Egypt, leading them by pillar of cloud and fire, feeding them manna in the wilderness, and having them drink from the rock. When He showed up as a servant instead of a "KING", He was rejected.

And, He's still being rejected to this day. God walked among us in the form of a man, and some only see the man. It's sure true that man looks at the outside, but it takes the Spirit of God for us to see it was God inside the flesh.

That they only see the man is why they empahsize the Father being IN the Son to the exclusion of the Son being IN the Father. Or they will admit that the Son is IN the Father but will redact it in its meaning.

 

[glorydaz]

That they only see the man is why they empahsize the Father being IN the Son to the exclusion of the Son being IN the Father. Or they will admit that the Son is IN the Father but will redact it in its meaning.

Yeah, I see that.

John 1:18
No man hath seen God at any time, the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him.

And give them a verse like this and they can't even begin to address it.

John 3:13
And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.


All their murmurings remind me of the Jews who also refused to see.

John 6:41-43
The Jews then murmured at him, because he said, I am the bread which came down from heaven. And they said, Is not this Jesus, the son of Joseph, whose father and mother we know? how is it then that he saith, I came down from heaven? Jesus therefore answered and said unto them, Murmur not among yourselves.

 

[Ask Mr. Religion]

WCF, Chapter 2, Section 3

In the unity of the Godhead there be three persons, of one substance, power and eternity: God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Ghost. Father is of none, neither begotten nor proceeding; the Son is eternally begotten of the Father; the Holy Ghost eternally proceeding from the Father and the Son.

Spoiler

The two sections of the Confession preceding this one have given us a definition of the essence of God. This section describes the manner in which God exists. Thus we learn
(1) that this one God (as defined) exists in three distinct persons,
(2) that each of these three persons is fully God (not parts of God), and
(3) that these three equal persons have personal distinctions one from the other.

The doctrine of the Trinity is the great stumbling block to the Jew and Muslim. They accuse Christians of worshiping new and different gods from that of Old Testament monotheistic teaching. The question therefore naturally arises, "Is the doctrine of the Trinity revealed in the Old Testament, or is it revealed merely in the New Testament?" Strange as it may seem, it is not exactly correct to say that it is revealed in either. As B. B. Warfield once said, "We cannot speak of the doctrine of the Trinity . . . if we study exactness of speech, as revealed in the New Testament, any more than we can speak of it as revealed in the Old Testament. The Old Testament was written before its revelation; the New Testament after it. The revelation itself was made not in word but in deed. It was made in the incarnation of God the Son, and the outpouring of God the Holy Spirit. The relation of the two Testaments to this revelation is in the one case that of preparation for it, and in the other that of product of it."

God revealed himself by supernatural deeds, along with which he gradually gave more and more verbal interpretation. Only as God's plan of redemption was fully worked out, was God himself fully made known. God could have announced at the very beginning that there were within the unity of his being three distinct persons. But who could have understood? But when, in the fullness of time, each of the three persons actually wrought before the eyes of amen those mighty deeds of redemption which each person of the Godhead was to do in the plan of salvation, who could not understand? Thus in Scripture we have the record of that which God has done, and what he said by way of interpretation. And the proof of the doctrine of the Trinity is supplied in the recorded fact that the Father manifestly is God, that Jesus just as clearly is God, and so also the Holy Spirit.

This is not to say, however, that the God revealed in the Old Testament is other than the Triune God. The God revealed in the Old Testament is fully God (and triune), though not fully revealed in the Old Testament. This being the case, it is inevitable that many things in the Old Testament can be understood only in the light of the (now fully revealed) doctrine of the Trinity. For example, in Genesis 1: 1-3 we discern distinct references to God, God the Spirit, and God the Word. In Genesis 1:26 God takes counsel with himself, and speaks with himself of fashioning man "in Our image." How could this be if God be not three as well as one? In Genesis 11:5, 7 we read that the Lord came down to see the city and tower of Babel, and yet speaking of this says, "Let Us go down."

Again, we discover that a certain "Angel of Jehovah" frequently appeared to the people of God in the Old Testament. He had the appearance of a man (Gen. 32:24) and yet is recognized as being God (Gen. 32:30). This Angel, recognized as being God, is, however, also described as being sent by God (Ex. 23:211-24, 25). The true believer was therefore to acknowledge that this Angel sent by God was God. He had power to "pardon ... transgressions," for God said, "My name is in him" (Ex. 23:21).

Yet, while
(1) the Old Testament believer was to know that the true God was one,
(2) that yet the Angel of God (sent by God) was God also,
(3) there was also a clearly recognized presence of God the Holy Spirit (Ps. 51:11; cf. 1 Sam. 16:13-14) distinct from either "God" or "the Angel."

Thus while the Old Testament believer did not yet see so full a manifestation of the three persons as we have seen (in Christ's becoming incarnate, and the Holy Spirit's being poured out at Pentecost), yet undeniably the God who was being revealed in Old Testament history (little by little) is this God and no other. Because we now know him to be such, these Old Testament accounts make perfectly good sense, which otherwise they would not. There are also, in prophecy, statements which, though perhaps not fully understood at the time (1 Peter 1:10-11), are such as to require the doctrine of the Trinity for their fulfillment. Thus Isaiah tells Israel that the Lord God will give a virgin-born son who will be Immanuel (which means "God with us") (Isa. 7:14). He is also called "the mighty God" (9:6). How could God send God, if there is not a plurality of persons in the divine essence? These are but examples of the fact that while the doctrine of the Trinity is not (fully) revealed in the Old Testament, yet the God who is revealed there (in a partial and preparatory way) is none other than the Triune God.

The New Testament was written after the Trinitarian nature of God had been completely manifested. The apostles became very conscious of the fact that while God remained invisible in the heavens, yet at the same time he stood incarnate before them in the flesh. They saw God (in the flesh) pray to God in heaven. Then when they saw him ascend into heaven, they witnessed the coming of the Holy Spirit. In such passages as Luke 3:22 we even see all three persons simultaneously manifested to the apostles' very senses. Who can speak from heaven but God? Who can command the wind and the waves, change water to wine, and raise the dead, but God? And who can come as a rushing mighty wind to enable weak and sinful amen to speak the wondrous things of God?

So it was that the apostles quite simply had no choice but to recognize that the one living and true God exists in three persons. They were simultaneously confronted with three who were God, and yet with overwhelming conviction they acknowledged these three to he one God. Thus Matthew 28:19, speaking of this one God, says that we are to be baptized "in the name (not names) of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit." Matthew would be guilty of faulty expression if either of two things were true: (1) if the Father, Son, and Holy Ghost did not possess an identical being (tor otherwise he would have said "names"), and (2) if that one being named is not existent in three persons (for otherwise he would not have implied that "the name" is shared by each of the three). If there are not three persons who are God, and if there is more than one God, Matthew speaks incorrectly. But this is impossible to one inspired as he was. As the ancient text reminds us (1 John 5:7), "There are three ... the Father, the Word, and the Holy Spirit; and these three are one." The formulation of our Confession (and similar orthodox creeds) is simply a key which fits all the facts as no other doctrine does or can.

Source: G. I. Williamson. Westminster Confession of Faith: For Study Classes

AMR

 

[jerzy]

God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Ghost.

Three Gods.

:thumb:

Three theism.

Hmmmm!!!!

Unless you show it written it is a blasphemy against the Father the only one true God.