musterion
Well-known member
But how do you know you HAVE salvation? How did you get it?
ECT Obey the Gospel
- Thread starter turbosixx
- Start date
But how do you know you HAVE salvation? How did you get it?
Rosenritter
New member
Whatever it is, it is certainly doing something.
Luke 13:2-5 KJV
(2) And Jesus answering said unto them, Suppose ye that these Galilaeans were sinners above all the Galilaeans, because they suffered such things?
(3) I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish.
(4) Or those eighteen, upon whom the tower in Siloam fell, and slew them, think ye that they were sinners above all men that dwelt in Jerusalem?
(5) I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish.
I would suggest that "look" is used in the metaphorical sense, and has some connection to the word "repent."
musterion
Well-known member
With repent meaning what?
Rosenritter
New member
We have salvation when we see Him, for salvation is not the beginning of our faith or even the trial of our faith, but rather the end of our faith, and eternal life in Jesus Christ, and his appearance and his coming.
1 Peter 1:7-9 KJV
(7) That the trial of your faith, being much more precious than of gold that perisheth, though it be tried with fire, might be found unto praise and honour and glory at the appearing of Jesus Christ:
(8) Whom having not seen, ye love; in whom, though now ye see him not, yet believing, ye rejoice with joy unspeakable and full of glory:
(9) Receiving the end of your faith, even the salvation of your souls.
As for how we know we have salvation, that is called faith, for faith is the evidence of things not seen.
musterion
Well-known member
So what must a lost person do to know he's saved? You haven't given specifics yet.
Rosenritter
New member
It means to turn away from the former sin. See Ezekiel below for an example of the word in context.
Ezekiel 14:6 KJV
(6) Therefore say unto the house of Israel, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Repent, and turn yourselves from your idols; and turn away your faces from all your abominations.
Ezekiel 18:30-32 KJV
(30) Therefore I will judge you, O house of Israel, every one according to his ways, saith the Lord GOD. Repent, and turn yourselves from all your transgressions; so iniquity shall not be your ruin.
(31) Cast away from you all your transgressions, whereby ye have transgressed; and make you a new heart and a new spirit: for why will ye die, O house of Israel?
(32) For I have no pleasure in the death of him that dieth, saith the Lord GOD: wherefore turn yourselves, and live ye.
Even more specifically from turning away from the former sin, it must replace the former heart with a new heart and a new spirit. True repentance is a genuine change of the heart.
musterion
Well-known member
You mean you'd tell your friend to repent as in "stop sinning" to be saved?
What else?
turbosixx
New member
He's quoting scripture.
Romans 7:6 But now we are released from the law, having died to that which held us captive, so that we serve in the new way of the Spirit and not in the old way of the written code.
I know this wasn't written directly to me, but it says somewhere to believe on the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and you shall be saved. Ephesians 2:8-9 says for by grace you have been saved through faith and this not of yourself it is the gift of God not as a result of works lest any man should boast. It says somewhere that faith comes by hearing and hearing by the word of Christ. I believe the word of God or the word of Christ. I have faith in God and in Jesus. The fact that I do cannot be explained by myself I just do and I believe that it is a result of God's word, that God's word has made it to me and that I have received the word implanted which is able to save my soul. It is not by works for then I would be able to boast that I am better than someone else or that my believing even or having faith is self-generated and results in my salvation on the basis of my own effort. But that would be false. Another place, Titus 3:5, says He saved us not on the basis of deeds which we have done in righteousness but according to His mercy by the washing of regeneration and renewing or renewal of the Holy Spirit. So it is not based on what I have done or on anything that I have done but on God's mercy. That is how the Holy Spirit has been able to do a work in my life of transformation. I can't save anyone by law keeping. I can't make myself perfect. Then the question is why do I obey or observe the law. My answer or the answer is that I want to. But I feel or think that this is not based on my own understanding, but that God wants me to obey Him even as He has saved me from sin. And sin is transgression of the law. So, being saved, I am not under the law but under grace. And at the same time I want to obey God's commands because they are good for me to obey or observe. Because the law involves God's commandments God does not forbid me to observe the law, His law.
Question: I have been sanctified. What is sanctification? After a person becomes a believer, saved by the blood of Jesus, ought He to obey or observe God's commands, His commandments? Because obedience to His Word requires obeying something. We are to obey the gospel, which at minimum is belief or right belief based on God's Written Revealed Word. But I also know that a person can leave their life of sin after becoming a believer. It is not necessarily something that happens automatically. To stay in the same state or let that which is not of God die in you, makes sense. But living a godly life seems to result in not living a life of sin as a believer which we might think is possible. The one who is born of God does not sin. Jesus didn't sin. But I don't want to sin either, whether it is that I could possibly sin (I believe it is possible) but I don't want to. So then do I live without sin based on choice or based on God's will? Either way it is what I want, not impossible, and yet impossible. I don't strive of my own to keep or maintain salvation having been saved, but I live in such a way that my life reflects the fact that I have and even that I know it that I have. So then have I received circumcision in observing Passover and wearing tzitzit and observing the Sabbath such that Christ's death is to me nothing? That is the price of choosing to obey or observe the Law after understanding that works do not and never will and never have saved anyone. So do good works because God wants you to not because they merit you any reward unto salvation apart from Christ or of yourself.
Rosenritter
New member
What must a lost person do to have faith in salvation? As salvation is a thing promised but yet unseen, and the knowledge of that unseen promise is called faith, this this is a question of how one must bring forth the faith that Christ commands? "With faith, all things are possible?"
The answer is the opposite of what you're demonstrating here. Attempting to boil down a specific requirement or a bare minimum is the work of a faithless heart. A faithful heart commits himself wholly without regard for the cost. If one of faith is asked to submit to his feet being cleansed, his heart is such that it is willing for his whole head and body to be cleansed in the River Jordan if need be. Faith is not halfway, faith is not burying your talent in a napkin. Faith is not wavering or bickering into legalism as "but who is my neighbor?"
James 1:6 KJV
(6) But let him ask in faith, nothing wavering. For he that wavereth is like a wave of the sea driven with the wind and tossed.
Hebrews 11:6 KJV
(6) But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.
Faith diligently seeks him.
turbosixx
New member
You calling the dogs to help with the kill? Nice.
musterion
Well-known member
If a lost person knows nothing else about Christ than He died for the lost person sins, was buried, and rose again from the dead the third day, can that person be forgiven all sins knowing nothing about Him but that?
musterion
Well-known member
If a lost person knows nothing else about Christ than He died for the lost person sins, was buried, and rose again from the dead the third day, can that person be forgiven all sins knowing nothing about Him but that?
Yes. But there are other facts pertaining to the gospel that the person can know as well. Such as that He appeared to many and ascended to the right hand of the Father.
musterion
Well-known member
Can such a person's forgiveness and justification ever be lost, sending them to Hell?
All Jesus word is the gospel, not just a few verses or facts.
musterion
Well-known member
No. Neither. Neither of these. They cannot.
Rosenritter
New member
I would add in the second half of the post, right below where you terminated your quote.