ECT Obey the Gospel

[Danoh]

bump for [MENTION=16688]Danoh[/MENTION].

I hold a Mid-Acts view.

Not exactly the one being touted on here as "MAD" by some on here, but nevertheless, a Mid-Acts view that does not view Scripture in the way you do, meshak.

And that is with a minimum two hours a day, every day, to this very day, either reading through Scripture and or listening to it, and then starting over, for many years, now.

I seriously doubt you are that familiar with Scripture that your say on it is going to sway me over to your many, ever obvious mis-interpretations.

Nothing against you for that, mind you.

You are where you are in your "understanding" until you reach a point, if ever, where you find yourself fully persuaded in your own mind, against your current "understanding."

Until then, at odds with one another, we will remain about Matthew thru John.

I, for one, am fine with that.

Your errors are on you, just as whatever mine might be, are one me.

Rom. 5:6-8.

 

[john w]

You'll have to accuse the Apostle Paul of same. For he himself repeatedly calls out your group's exact kind of fake, united front.

You made that up, as no, he did not employ the condescension you do. Why did you lie?

And my point to Meshak was to pay no mind to your insults.

No, you missed it. You, in condescension, insult, critique saved members of the boc, hissing "you and your pals,"while kissing a_ _ with the lost.

Face you-we have.

Twist away, JohnW. Its your forte and that of your ever so supposedly well-meaning pals.

Wow-how did you come up with that "twist away" stunner? And there you go, with your condescending, "pals" insult. Get lost, as your just making noise, dividing the brethren, here, on TOL, since you are bored, and not many are listening to you on the circuit, on other sites.

 

[john w]

The details of which are NOT described in 1 Cor. 15: 3, 4 - because Paul was merely reminding them he had preached the gospel of Christ to them.

Thanks for making my point...

That Paul himself reminds the Corinthians in both his epistles to them, of details just like those in Ephesians cited by you there, that he had gone into with them, back when he had preached the gospel of Christ to them.

1 Cor. 15:1-4 was merely a reminder that he had preached the gospel of Christ to them - one has to read all verses 3, 4 are actually comprised of, into them, to hold your disengenuous position that those two verses are all that is needed, when presenting the gospel of Christ to the lost.

Again, thanks for proving my very point to you "experts."

:chuckle:

Rom. 5:6-8.

No, you lied, are moving the goal posts, changing your argument, as you assert that hearing, believing 1 Cor. 15:1-4 KJV is not enough. Why are you lying?

That image of reminds me of the ever completely in the dark JW - ever going around hoping to find people who have nothing more than 1 Cor. 15: 3, 4

Ephesians 1 KJV

1 Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, to the saints which are at Ephesus, and to the faithful in Christ Jesus: 2 grace be to you, and peace, from God our Father, and from the Lord Jesus Christ.

3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ: 4 according as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love: 5 having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will, 6 to the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved. 7 in whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace; 8 wherein he hath abounded toward us in all wisdom and prudence; 9 having made known unto us the mystery of his will, according to his good pleasure which he hath purposed in himself: 10 that in the dispensation of the fulness of times he might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven, and which are on earth; even in him: 11 in whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will: 12 that we should be to the praise of his glory, who first trusted in Christ. 13 in whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise, 14 which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, unto the praise of his glory.

-The lost person hears the word of truth, the gospel of their salvation,
-That person trusts Christ, through the word of truth, the gospel of their salvation,="believed"

=that is all that is needed-simple

Paul then speaks of the sealing of the Holy Spirit,.....=eternal security=done deal=gives us hope, "confident expectation"

 

[john w]

And my point to Meshak was to pay no mind to your insults.

Vs.

They're just "mad" that I point things out to them and or call them out on their mistreatment of anyone they look down their noses at as being not MAD.

We look down our noses, at lost people, and you insult us with this alleged mistreatment accusation?

Thanks for defining the word "hypocrisy," and Paul's referencing "whited wall."

 

[john w]

...hold your disengenuous position that those two verses are all that is needed, when presenting the gospel of Christ to the lost.

There you go, from "non insulting," oh so caring Danoh-hearing, believing, 1 Cor. 15:1-4 KJV is not enough, to be saved..


You should leave.

 

[Danoh]

Vs.




We look down our noses, at lost people, and you insult us with this alleged mistreatment accusation?

Thanks for defining the word "hypocrisy," and Paul's referencing "whited wall."

I've made my point about 1 Cor. 15: 3, 4 being a reminder to the Corinthians by Paul that he had preached the gospel of Christ to them - that the passage was not meant as a treatise on all that presenting the gospel of Christ entails.

It fell on death ears in you and your pals and your need to rationalise your nonsense when called on it.

So be it.

I leave you and your pals to your hypocrisy and its ever endless living for conflict with anyone who does not agree with your views, sound or unsound, perfect or still in need of much refinement.

I'll continue to point a thing out where I find it necessary, and to acknowledge some point made by any of you I agree with, and that's about it.

Well aware you hypocrites find it impossible to do as much where you allow your personal animosity towards someone to determine your so called sense of truth.

No way you'd be able to carry on as you do when disagreed with, in an actual Mid-Acts Based assembly.

Grace Frauds is what you are.

Rom. 5:6-8, in each our stead - no matter how you and your pals spit on it.

 

[Idolater]

The details of which are NOT described in 1 Cor. 15: 3, 4 - because Paul was merely reminding them he had preached the gospel of Christ to them.

. . .

That Paul himself reminds the Corinthians in both his epistles to them, of details just like those in Ephesians cited by you there, that he had gone into with them, back when he had preached the gospel of Christ to them.

1 Cor. 15:1-4 was merely a reminder that he had preached the gospel of Christ to them . . . .

What if Luke, is that Gospel? Is 1st Corinthians 15:3-4 KJV in Luke? The idea appears a very long time ago, among believers who studied the scriptures like we do now. Some of them thought that Luke was what Paul was talking about when he talked about the Gospel he preached, his Gospel, the Gospel to the uncircumcision. Luke was written to Gentiles /Heathens /Pagans.

 

[musterion]

It fell on death ears in you and your pals and your need to rationalise your nonsense when called on it.

So be it.

"So be it."

Them Grand Rapids folk sure are a mite imperious.

View attachment 26682

 

[meshak]

I hold a Mid-Acts view.

Not exactly the one being touted on here as "MAD" by some on here, but nevertheless, a Mid-Acts view that does not view Scripture in the way you do, meshak.

And that is with a minimum two hours a day, every day, to this very day, either reading through Scripture and or listening to it, and then starting over, for many years, now.

I seriously doubt you are that familiar with Scripture that your say on it is going to sway me over to your many, ever obvious mis-interpretations.

Nothing against you for that, mind you.

You are where you are in your "understanding" until you reach a point, if ever, where you find yourself fully persuaded in your own mind, against your current "understanding."

Until then, at odds with one another, we will remain about Matthew thru John.

I, for one, am fine with that.

Your errors are on you, just as whatever mine might be, are one me.

Rom. 5:6-8.

Aren't Christians supposed to be Jesus' followers? Isn't that why we are called "Christians"?

 

[musterion]

I hold a Mid-Acts view.

Not exactly the one being touted on here as "MAD" by some on here, but nevertheless, a Mid-Acts view that does not view Scripture in the way you do, meshak.

And that is with a minimum two hours a day, every day, to this very day, either reading through Scripture and or listening to it, and then starting over, for many years, now.

I seriously doubt you are that familiar with Scripture that your say on it is going to sway me over to your many, ever obvious mis-interpretations.

Nothing against you for that, mind you.

You are where you are in your "understanding" until you reach a point, if ever, where you find yourself fully persuaded in your own mind, against your current "understanding."

Until then, at odds with one another, we will remain about Matthew thru John.

I, for one, am fine with that.

Your errors are on you, just as whatever mine might be, are one me.

Rom. 5:6-8.

Wow.

WOW.

See that? Did you see that?

Nope, you didn't. It wasn't there.

"What you talkin' bout, Musty?"

He has spent weeks rebuking us over good news we do not preach, and yet will not tell us in very simple terms what it is we're not preaching. SAYS he did, but didn't.

Okay. Whatever.

But along comes one of the Meshaks asking for an audience with the only MAD the Meshaks apparently do not ignore.

He deigns to grant the audience.

Now THIS was a golden opportunity all the way around, both to instruct MADs and simultaneously reach a JW. To teach by example what we aren't preaching by preaching it to Meshak, leading by example (as he's already our leader, donchaknow) AND possibly saving a soul.

Q. Do you see in his reply the complete good news that no MAD but Danoh preaches?

A. No you dont. Just another condescending, faux humble dissertation about how wrong Meshak is...but no saving good news from the only MAD on TOL who can share it competently.

Now why do you think that is? Where was knowing nothing with the utterly lost but Christ and Him crucified? Not in that post. Pharaoh Danoh I had more pressing matters to address.

Unbelievable.

Well it would be unbelievable, if I believed Danoh is genuine.

 

[turbosixx]

To serve because it is commanded is a work of the flesh.

What would someone do in service to Christ that isn't commanded? If it's not commanded, who are they doing it for?

 

[turbosixx]

I agree that when we obey the gospel we begin and continue to think differently. The gospel teaches us how to live.
Titus 2:11 For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men,
12 Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world;

so the thoughts, words and deeds follow suit in the regenerate.

This sounds like living in obedience.

Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.

 

[Danoh]

Aren't Christians supposed to be Jesus' followers? Isn't that why we are called "Christian"?

Meshak, I suspect you know well enough by now to ignore the gospel of grace-less frauds on here now attempting to turn my prior post to you, into what it is not.

As for your question - I sort of figured that was what you were after, a wanting to know on your part if I agree with you on your take on Matthew thru John.

Thing is, I do not.

For though it would appear on its surface that because Christians are called Christians because they follow Christ, nevertheless, it is repeatedly evident throughout Matthew thru John that His instructions throughout those four books, were to an Israel still under the Law.

One simple example of this, of many those four books contain...

Matthew 8:1 When he was come down from the mountain, great multitudes followed him. 8:2 And, behold, there came a leper and worshipped him, saying, Lord, if thou wilt, thou canst make me clean. 8:3 And Jesus put forth his hand, and touched him, saying, I will; be thou clean. And immediately his leprosy was cleansed. 8:4 And Jesus saith unto him, See thou tell no man; but go thy way, shew thyself to the priest, and offer the gift that Moses commanded, for a testimony unto them.

He has just instructed that man to obey the Law of Moses not only by going and presenting himself to a Priest, but towards the express purpose of offering animal sacrifices, as a testimony to all his fellow Israelites.

How do I know? Read the following by Moses, to Israel, regarding what an Israelite was to do upon finding he'd contracted a leperous disease...

Leviticus 14:1 And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying, 14:2 This shall be the law of the leper in the day of his cleansing: He shall be brought unto the priest: 14:3 And the priest shall go forth out of the camp; and the priest shall look, and, behold, if the plague of leprosy be healed in the leper; 14:4 Then shall the priest command to take for him that is to be cleansed two birds alive and clean, and cedar wood, and scarlet, and hyssop: 14:5 And the priest shall command that one of the birds be killed in an earthen vessel over running water: 14:6 As for the living bird, he shall take it, and the cedar wood, and the scarlet, and the hyssop, and shall dip them and the living bird in the blood of the bird that was killed over the running water: 14:7 And he shall sprinkle upon him that is to be cleansed from the leprosy seven times, and shall pronounce him clean, and shall let the living bird loose into the open field. 14:8 And he that is to be cleansed shall wash his clothes, and shave off all his hair, and wash himself in water, that he may be clean: and after that he shall come into the camp, and shall tarry abroad out of his tent seven days. 14:9 But it shall be on the seventh day, that he shall shave all his hair off his head and his beard and his eyebrows, even all his hair he shall shave off: and he shall wash his clothes, also he shall wash his flesh in water, and he shall be clean. 14:10 And on the eighth day he shall take two he lambs without blemish, and one ewe lamb of the first year without blemish, and three tenth deals of fine flour for a meat offering, mingled with oil, and one log of oil. 14:11 And the priest that maketh him clean shall present the man that is to be made clean, and those things, before the LORD, at the door of the tabernacle of the congregation: 14:12 And the priest shall take one he lamb, and offer him for a trespass offering, and the log of oil, and wave them for a wave offering before the LORD: 14:13 And he shall slay the lamb in the place where he shall kill the sin offering and the burnt offering, in the holy place: for as the sin offering is the priest's, so is the trespass offering: it is most holy: 14:14 And the priest shall take some of the blood of the trespass offering, and the priest shall put it upon the tip of the right ear of him that is to be cleansed, and upon the thumb of his right hand, and upon the great toe of his right foot: 14:15 And the priest shall take some of the log of oil, and pour it into the palm of his own left hand: 14:16 And the priest shall dip his right finger in the oil that is in his left hand, and shall sprinkle of the oil with his finger seven times before the LORD: 14:17 And of the rest of the oil that is in his hand shall the priest put upon the tip of the right ear of him that is to be cleansed, and upon the thumb of his right hand, and upon the great toe of his right foot, upon the blood of the trespass offering: 14:18 And the remnant of the oil that is in the priest's hand he shall pour upon the head of him that is to be cleansed: and the priest shall make an atonement for him before the LORD. 14:19 And the priest shall offer the sin offering, and make an atonement for him that is to be cleansed from his uncleanness; and afterward he shall kill the burnt offering: 14:20 And the priest shall offer the burnt offering and the meat offering upon the altar: and the priest shall make an atonement for him, and he shall be clean. 14:21 And if he be poor, and cannot get so much; then he shall take one lamb for a trespass offering to be waved, to make an atonement for him, and one tenth deal of fine flour mingled with oil for a meat offering, and a log of oil; 14:22 And two turtledoves, or two young pigeons, such as he is able to get; and the one shall be a sin offering, and the other a burnt offering. 14:23 And he shall bring them on the eighth day for his cleansing unto the priest, unto the door of the tabernacle of the congregation, before the LORD. 14:24 And the priest shall take the lamb of the trespass offering, and the log of oil, and the priest shall wave them for a wave offering before the LORD: 14:25 And he shall kill the lamb of the trespass offering, and the priest shall take some of the blood of the trespass offering, and put it upon the tip of the right ear of him that is to be cleansed, and upon the thumb of his right hand, and upon the great toe of his right foot: 14:26 And the priest shall pour of the oil into the palm of his own left hand: 14:27 And the priest shall sprinkle with his right finger some of the oil that is in his left hand seven times before the LORD: 14:28 And the priest shall put of the oil that is in his hand upon the tip of the right ear of him that is to be cleansed, and upon the thumb of his right hand, and upon the great toe of his right foot, upon the place of the blood of the trespass offering: 14:29 And the rest of the oil that is in the priest's hand he shall put upon the head of him that is to be cleansed, to make an atonement for him before the LORD. 14:30 And he shall offer the one of the turtledoves, or of the young pigeons, such as he can get; 14:31 Even such as he is able to get, the one for a sin offering, and the other for a burnt offering, with the meat offering: and the priest shall make an atonement for him that is to be cleansed before the LORD. 14:32 This is the law of him in whom is the plague of leprosy, whose hand is not able to get that which pertaineth to his cleansing.

THAT was one heck of a ritual!

And that is just one example of others that could be cited from within Matthew thru John.

My point being that you one can't ignore such things because there they are, still very much in operation during the Lord's ministry "to the lost sheep of the house of ISRAEL" Matthew 15:24.

Those books depict how Israel was to follow Christ prior to His death, burial, and resurrection...

Acts 13:23 Of this man's seed hath God according to his promise raised unto Israel a Saviour, Jesus: 13:24 When John had first preached before his coming the baptism of repentance to all the people of Israel. 13:25 And as John fulfilled his course, he said, Whom think ye that I am? I am not he. But, behold, there cometh one after me, whose shoes of his feet I am not worthy to loose. 13:26 Men and brethren, children of the stock of Abraham, and whosoever among you feareth God, to you is the word of this salvation sent. 13:27 For they that dwell at Jerusalem, and their rulers, because they knew him not, nor yet the voices of the prophets which are read every sabbath day, they have fulfilled them in condemning him. 13:28 And though they found no cause of death in him, yet desired they Pilate that he should be slain. 13:29 And when they had fulfilled all that was written of him, they took him down from the tree, and laid him in a sepulchre. 13:30 But God raised him from the dead: 13:31 And he was seen many days of them which came up with him from Galilee to Jerusalem, who are his witnesses unto the people. 13:32 And we declare unto you glad tidings, how that the promise which was made unto the fathers, 13:33 God hath fulfilled the same unto us their children, in that he hath raised up Jesus again; as it is also written in the second psalm, Thou art my Son, this day have I begotten thee. 13:34 And as concerning that he raised him up from the dead, now no more to return to corruption, he said on this wise, I will give you the sure mercies of David. 13:35 Wherefore he saith also in another psalm, Thou shalt not suffer thine Holy One to see corruption. 13:36 For David, after he had served his own generation by the will of God, fell on sleep, and was laid unto his fathers, and saw corruption: 13:37 But he, whom God raised again, saw no corruption. 13:38 Be it known unto you therefore, men and brethren, that through this man is preached unto you the forgiveness of sins: 13:39 And by him all that believe are justified from all things, from which ye could not be justified by the law of Moses.

THAT is how a Christian is to follow Christ on this side of His death, burial and resurrection.

The Lord is repeatedly clear on this, through those words he gave the Apostle Paul on it...

Romans 1:1 Paul, a servant of Jesus Christ, called to be an apostle, separated unto the gospel of God, 1:2 (Which he had promised afore by his prophets in the holy scriptures,) 1:3 Concerning his Son Jesus Christ our Lord, which was made of the seed of David according to the flesh; 1:4 And declared to be the Son of God with power, according to the spirit of holiness, by the resurrection from the dead: 1:5 By whom we have received grace and apostleship, for obedience to the faith among all nations, for his name: 1:6 Among whom are ye also the called of Jesus Christ: 1:7 To all that be in Rome, beloved of God, called to be saints: Grace to you and peace from God our Father, and the Lord Jesus Christ.

There are your Christians, or followers of Christ, after His death, burial, and resurrection.

I'm certain you still disagree. As you should, until you are fully persuaded in your own mind otherwise, Romans 14:5.

At the same time, there is this, your responsibility, as much as any one else's, upon hearing a thing that just doesn't appear to add up, to do the following, with it...


Acts 17:11 These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so. 17:12 Therefore many of them believed; also of honourable women which were Greeks, and of men, not a few.

No matter where that leads, and no matter who its' results offends, or makes one their enemy, in their eyes.

But I as I said, I suspect you of all people already know not to allow yourself to be chased away by the double-standard of such people.

Romans 5: 6-8, in each...our stead.

 

[meshak]

Meshak, I suspect you know well enough by now to ignore the gospel of grace-less frauds on here now attempting to turn my prior post to you, into what it is not.

I asked you a simple question.

do you believe Christians are called so because they follow Jesus?

BTW, I am not a grace-less Christian.

We have so different opinion about what grace is.

And I believe most "Jesus is God" believers don't know what it is.

 

[Danoh]

I asked you a simple question.

do you believe Christians are called so because they follow Jesus?

And I said yes, but with the qualification I laid out to you, that you apparantly ignored, or did not understand.

Rom. 5:6-8.

 

[meshak]

And I said yes, but with the qualification I laid out to you, that you apparantly ignored, or did not understand.

Rom. 5:6-8.

then why do you ignore what Jesus says or teaches?

Is Jesus your Lord?

 

[Danoh]

I asked you a simple question.

do you believe Christians are called so because they follow Jesus?

BTW, I am not a grace-less Christian.

We have so different opinion about what grace is.

And I believe most "Jesus is God" believers don't know what it is.

I have not accused you of anything.

By the way, feel free to post what your understanding of grace is, backed up by Scripture - Acts 17:11, 12.

 

[Danoh]

then why do you ignore what Jesus says or teaches?

Is Jesus your Lord?

See my prior post, on Matthew 8, etc.

Acts 17: 11, 12.

 

[meshak]

I have not accused you of anything.

By the way, feel free to post what your understanding of grace is, backed up by Scripture - Acts 17:11, 12.

Jesus commends us to be perfect yet we cannot be perfect.

But Jesus says with God anything is possible meaning if you strive to be obedient the HS fill our imperfections and make us perfect in God's eye. This is Marcy.

And this is my contextual reasoning.

 

[meshak]

See my prior post, on Matthew 8, etc.

Acts 17: 11, 12.

If He is your Lord, you ought to take heed of all His word.

don't you agree?